A Few Thoughts on Mavs 107, Raptors 110

[SleepingHero]

Why does Brunson continually get singled out as the late game choker. 

Because he throws the ball away every other possession in the 4th quarter. Dude gets swallowed by presses. Though last night it wasn't just him, Wright and Curry also got exposed.

[Dahlsim]

After sitting with this for a few hours, I would have given the young guys some help in the form of a little Puerto Rican. 

Maybe I l let them figure it out until the lead gets down to 15. 

You can teach by making them do it. You can also teach by saying "sit here and watch this". 

But, you know, also, everything that Dan said up above somewhere.

I think this is where I have come out, especially after rewatching it and being reminded what a mess it was. Barea, the big men, a change in strategy, something to give them some help. 


I don't fault Rick for trying something that didn't work. However, in retrospect, I think he let it go on too long, and I think he would probably agree with that. 
….. 

So if we agree with Rick that it really was an 'L' on him because he let it go on too long, then is it just too difficult to say in this case the fault IS on Rick?  

No one is starting #FireCarlisle here as the Mavs are on great trajectory overall.  I don't put most the blame for this 'L' on a 2nd year player like Jalen Brunson going up against a FIVE TIME NBA All star Kyle Lowry while experienced NBA Championship PG JJ Berea is nailed to the bench.  

Sure, sometimes Coach says the loss is "on me" but they don't mean it.  In this case I think Rick does mean it and he should mean it, his loyal defenders just don't want to accept it, even when it comes directly from his own mouth.   

I will say he's earned the right to take on an extra 'L' here and there in the name of development, even if its completely unnecessary to take the learning experience that far.
Coach Carlisle's championship status with the Mavericks means he can take an NBA decade long largest blow lead that is so downright pathetic it puts the franchise into the NBA team disgrace history books.  His reputation is so strong that he can experiment his way into a loss that ties Dallas’ biggest blown lead in franchise history. 

Cuban has pretty much made the Mavs Carlisle's team since the Championship team and no player can really challenge the coach on the Mavericks.  He is the man so he can do this sort of boneheaded thing, and rightfully so.  Personally even though I think Rick should be called out on something like this, I'd still rather root for a team with the head coach as the strong man, more like a college team than a modern NBA team where the star player runs the show.
 
It will be interesting to see how it affects decisions the rest of the season. Maybe it pays off at playoff time when some of these players have to step up against NBA All Stars to try and win games that count much more.

[ItsGoTime]

Why does Brunson continually get singled out as the late game choker. 

I thought I was reading multiple opinions on multiple players choking. A colossal choke job of this kind takes way more than 1 person. I also see more blame on the coach than any single player. There is a ton of things not to like about that last game.

[SleepingHero]

Seems odd that a team with 4 primary ball handlers and 2 decent ones that we have 2 that can break a press. Someone said it earlier, if this becomes the book on how to beat us, like the zone exposed Phila, our guys might have lots of in game practice with beating it.

I don't think a press is going to be the textbook way to beat us. Notice, before Luka went out, Mavs never got pressed. Why? Well when you're pressing someone, you're trying to get them to speed up their game to make a mistake, and by doubling them you can make them easily throw the ball away. Well Luka never speeds his game up for anyone, and he's too big for opposing guards to effectively double him, and he's too fast to send bigger guys at him. Thus rendering any press useless. That and Luka has the ball handling skills to just drive by everyone for an easy layup. Same reasons why teams don't press Lebron. 

So as soon as Luka comes back I think that'll be the end of the press against the Mavs, I just hope that Brunson and co. take this as a valuable learning experience and practice against pressure.

[Fuerza1]

Because he throws the ball away every other possession in the 4th quarter. Dude gets swallowed by presses. Though last night it wasn't just him, Wright and Curry also got exposed.

Why does Brunson continually get singled out as the late game choker. 
I thought I was reading multiple opinions on multiple players choking. A colossal choke job of this kind takes way more than 1 person. I also see more blame on the coach than any single player. There is a ton of things not to like about that last game.

See the inaccurate hyperbole from your fellow mod (he's not only one) above. See how he cut out the factual statistics I posted?

[ItsGoTime]

I hope you’re right (and probably are). Doubling Luka for the inbounds possibly takes the ball out of his hands though. At that point someone has to step up and get the ball over the half court line.

[Fuerza1]

When did Barea become the Deus Ex Machina of the league? I don't think we lost that game because of no Barea. Lets not overthink this: Mavs were up by 30 pts and fell asleep at the wheel. 

Carlisle decided to go small, zero bigs for 3 minutes in the 4Q: Brunson, Seth, Delon, Bro, DFS. Mavs got outscored by 8 pts in this 3 min stretch. This is a similar line-up that he ran in the final minutes vs MIL, and we all know how that went. 

Mavs were still up by 10 pts when Porzingis checked in. Ok that's great but why wasn't Kleber or Powell there to help him? The Mavs were at their best playing 2 big's in Boban/Kleber or Powell/KP in the 2Q/3Q. 

Carlisle went away from that for whatever reason. The Mavs run pick 'n rolls more than anybody in the league. Their entire offense is predicated on this. Porzingis is not a good screen setter. This is where Powell, Kleber, or even Boban would have helped. 

The press hurt but it's not what killed the Mavs; they simply couldn't score in the half court sets, settling for perimeter, contested shots. KP got plenty of touches but kept passing out. THJ's shot selection was the usual. Guys missed open looks. It sucks but it happens; we'll forget about this game once we're in the playoffs.

[IamDougieFresh]

Raptors scored 47 in the fourth and Maximus (best overall defender in the league) sat on the bench

[ItsGoTime]

See the inaccurate hyperbole from your fellow mod (he's not only one) above. See how he cut out the factual statistics I posted?

He’s not singling him out though, he’s responding to your defense of a guy that deserves some of the blame. I admit the hyperbole is unnecessary.

[Fuerza1]

He’s not singling him out though, he’s responding to your defense of a guy that deserves some of the blame. I admit the hyperbole is unnecessary.

I am speaking generally in the last 5 games (since Luka has been out).

Even the thread creator had to pile on and imply Brunson with his "usual late game struggles." No other player is tagged with that label. I am trying to shed light on the situation that it is not all him like many seem to be leaning towards. 

I even posted statistics to offer some perspective but it was met with people with an agenda.

[mtrot]

I hope you’re right (and probably are). Doubling Luka for the inbounds possibly takes the ball out of his hands though. At that point someone has to step up and get the ball over the half court line.

When the opponent is pressing, you have to have bigs in the game(because it's easier to get the ball to them than a short player, and it's then easier for them to get off a good pass), and they have to know to run to a spot somewhere in the middle of the court, so as to receive the ball and pass to a team mate who is then cutting towards the goal.  Maxi, Powell, and/or KP have to be in the game and know what to do.  And the guards have to get rid of the ball BEFORE they get trapped.

[dirkfansince1998]

I hope you’re right (and probably are). Doubling Luka for the inbounds possibly takes the ball out of his hands though. At that point someone has to step up and get the ball over the half court line.

When the opponent is pressing, you have to have bigs in the game(because it's easier to get the ball to them than a short player, and it's then easier for them to get off a good pass), and they have to know to run to a spot somewhere in the middle of the court, so as to receive the ball and pass to a team mate who is then cutting towards the goal.  Maxi, Powell, and/or KP have to be in the game and know what to do.  And the guards have to get rid of the ball BEFORE they get trapped.

This. Easiest way to beat a full court press is a inbounds pass to a big followed by a quick handoff. Nearly inpossible to prevent it without fouling.

[fifteenth]

Mods are just posters who Magick asked to delete spam. Most other modding that has taken place is to watch out for Mod on Mod crime. No reason to hold that against SH.

I've been doing a bit of Brunson defending lately, but it is true that he's having to learn how to handle pressure. His 4th quarters have been up and down, no doubt. 

JJB would absolutely have settled that game down. He knows how to handle pressure because of his experience level in high pressure NBA situations, mental toughness and handles. 

And finally, based on past DSJ posts, more recent Seth posts (who takes Jalen's minutes sometimes), and consistent Brunson posts, I think Fuerza actually is Jalen Brunson. Which is really cool. He may be the first real live NBA player we've had on the board. 

We (most of us) love you Jalen!!

[Fuerza1]

Mods are just posters who Magick asked to delete spam. Most other modding that has taken place is to watch out for Mod on Mod crime. No reason to hold that against SH.

I've been doing a bit of Brunson defending lately, but it is true that he's having to learn how to handle pressure. His 4th quarters have been up and down, no doubt. 

JJB would absolutely have settled that game down. He knows how to handle pressure because of his experience level in high pressure NBA situations, mental toughness and handles. 

And finally, based on past DSJ posts, more recent Seth posts (who takes Jalen's minutes sometimes), and consistent Brunson posts, I think Fuerza actually is Jalen Brunson. Which is really cool. He may be the first real live NBA player we've had on the board. 

We (most of us) love you Jalen!!

You are under the impression Barea is guaranteed to come off the bench ice cold and perform at a high level. He also has to play defense and he wasn't gonna stop Lowry, who was coming in like a freight train. 

Sure, I would prefer to see Barea run the offense over Delon/Seth, which hurt us in a 4 min span from 3Q-4Q but again I don't think it was the difference between winning/losing like many of y'all expect. Barea could have came in and screwed up just as easily too. 

Contrary to belief, I like all the Mavs players equally. I try to add a different perspective instead of contributing to the echo chamber of Luka = god posts.

[fifteenth]

You are under the impression Barea is guaranteed to come off the bench ice cold and perform at a high level. He also has to play defense and he wasn't gonna stop Lowry, who was coming in like a freight train. 

Sure, I would prefer to see Barea run the offense over Delon/Seth, which hurt us in a 4 min span from 3Q-4Q but again I don't think it was the difference between winning/losing like many of y'all expect. Barea could have came in and screwed up just as easily too. 

Contrary to belief, I like all the Mavs players equally. I try to add a different perspective instead of contributing to the echo chamber of Luka = god posts.

No guarantees. Maybe JJB fails to settle the game down. I believe he would've succeeded though. I don't think it was Jalen/Delon (the primary ball handlers) lack of skill that lead to the breakdown, I think it was their lack of experience in that kind of NBA pressure cooker. 

I also would have had KP and Maxi in there too, fwiw. 

Hard to believe you see an echo chamber in this place. Seems to me like we have almost every opinion possible represented. But you can't fault a fan base for being excited about drafting a potential super star. 

If you tell me that you like all the players, I have no reason to doubt you. But it seems pretty clear based you really, really like Jalen. No crime in that. I like him too. I said it was a good draft pick from the beginning, which was a minority opinion.

[mtrot]

Mods are just posters who Magick asked to delete spam. Most other modding that has taken place is to watch out for Mod on Mod crime. No reason to hold that against SH.

I've been doing a bit of Brunson defending lately, but it is true that he's having to learn how to handle pressure. His 4th quarters have been up and down, no doubt. 

JJB would absolutely have settled that game down. He knows how to handle pressure because of his experience level in high pressure NBA situations, mental toughness and handles. 

And finally, based on past DSJ posts, more recent Seth posts (who takes Jalen's minutes sometimes), and consistent Brunson posts, I think Fuerza actually is Jalen Brunson. Which is really cool. He may be the first real live NBA player we've had on the board. 

We (most of us) love you Jalen!!

You are under the impression Barea is guaranteed to come off the bench ice cold and perform at a high level. He also has to play defense and he wasn't gonna stop Lowry, who was coming in like a freight train. 

Sure, I would prefer to see Barea run the offense over Delon/Seth, which hurt us in a 4 min span from 3Q-4Q but again I don't think it was the difference between winning/losing like many of y'all expect. Barea could have came in and screwed up just as easily too. 

Contrary to belief, I like all the Mavs players equally. I try to add a different perspective instead of contributing to the echo chamber of Luka = god posts.

Well, why not?  Barea is one of the very best in the league at drawing offensive fouls on the opponent.  He does it all the time.  Just because he's cold off the bench doesn't erase his memory of how to draw fouls.  Also, it's when a player is "coming in like a freight train" that they are most susceptible to committing an offensive foul.  JMHO.

[ItsGoTime]

I try to add a different perspective instead of contributing to the echo chamber of Luka = god posts.

I’m a fan of that. Even though, Luka = A higher power.

[Fuerza1]

Well, why not?  Barea is one of the very best in the league at drawing offensive fouls on the opponent.  He does it all the time.  Just because he's cold off the bench doesn't erase his memory of how to draw fouls.  Also, it's when a player is "coming in like a freight train" that they are most susceptible to committing an offensive foul.  JMHO.

I mean he really is not. There is literally a statistic based on charges drawn. Barea's career high is 0.06 charges drawn per game. For comparison, Brunson averaged 0.16 as a rookie and 0.10 this season. 

And I am not saying Barea would guard Lowry, he wouldn't have. DFS/Delon were the ones guarding Lowry, who scored 20 pts in the 4Q so he wasn't going to be stopped. Boucher also had 12 pts in the 4Q, no body could stop him either.

Even if Barea was a plus defender, it wouldn't have mattered because he's not guarding those guys.

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Lets get some game tape in here: Lowry with 20 pts in 4Q; Boucher with 12 pts; Holis-Jefferson with 6 pts. They had 34, 21, and 18 pts respectively for the entire game. 

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RHJ: 

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Lowry: 

[mtrot]

Well, why not?  Barea is one of the very best in the league at drawing offensive fouls on the opponent.  He does it all the time.  Just because he's cold off the bench doesn't erase his memory of how to draw fouls.  Also, it's when a player is "coming in like a freight train" that they are most susceptible to committing an offensive foul.  JMHO.

I mean he really is not. There is literally a statistic based on charges drawn. Barea's career high is 0.06 charges drawn per game. For comparison, Brunson averaged 0.16 as a rookie and 0.10 this season. 

And I am not saying Barea would guard Lowry, he wouldn't have. DFS/Delon were the ones guarding Lowry, who scored 20 pts in the 4Q so he wasn't going to be stopped. Boucher also had 12 pts in the 4Q, no body could stop him either.

Even if Barea was a plus defender, it wouldn't have mattered because he's not guarding those guys.

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Lets get some game tape in here: Lowry with 20 pts in 4Q; Boucher with 12 pts; Holis-Jefferson with 6 pts. They had 34, 21, and 18 pts respectively for the entire game. 

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RHJ: 

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Lowry: 

DFS and Delon are not the type of players I would have trying to defend Lowry in the fourth when he was going off because they are too long legged and don't have quick enough lateral movement.  I would have put in JJB specifically to harass and try to get in front of Lowry.  But I guess you are not going to consider an alternative strategy to what Rick used.

[SportPsychMav]

The 4th quarter went as bad as a quarter can possibly go. 
We lost by one possession. 

I think we can all agree that literally any change to what happened is more likely to result in us winning than having a worse outcome of a quarter.



If an opponent is making a run like that it's on the Coach to disrupt it.

Barea would have helped for sure, Boban too.

Boban, JJB, Kleber, Prozingis, Wright should have done it.