Trade & FA 2023-24: OKC The Favorite For Nic Claxton Should He Leave BRK

[F Gump]

Shams just said on FanDuel TV that the Mavs have done their due diligence on both Siakam and Jerami Grant and determined the price tags were too high for them but still determined to upgrade PF.

That sounds likely, and feels like a reasonable approach too. Prices might come down, who knows.

[BigDirk41]

IMO the PF is probably DFS/Collins. With us using THJ/Holmes as fillers and Hardy/O-Max as incentive.

There is no way I throw in Hardy or Omax for DFS or Collins. I'm open to trading Hardy, but we can't send out THJ and Hardy. One needs to stay for scoring off the bench. Omax should only be considered for a legit star, but not for a role player.

[KillerLeft]

Dejounte Murray quit playing defense years ago. Still has that reputation among some people. Yeah he’s younger and taller than Kyrie but not really worth the organizational shakeup.

I have the same question about Jerami Grant. Is he willing to go back to playing defense? Seems like once guys hit 20 points per game, most of them forget about the other end.

Nuggets had three guys in Aaron Gordon, KCP, and Brown that didn’t fancy themselves as stars and bought into their roles.

Also, it seems like Murray's number one offensive skill is mid-range pull-ups off of screens. Not sure that's the best thing next to Luka, since that's the main argument being made. Yes, that's a skill for Kyrie, too, but it seems to me that Kyrie has a way better off-ball game. 

Two your last two points:

I agree with the worry on Grant. Denver Grant would be ideal, but he liked that role so much that he left for a different one at his first opportunity. To Detroit, of all places. To me, that means he wants to be a featured offensive player more than he wants to be on a good team (or at least he has for the past few years).

---

Terrified that we’ll start hearing Draymond/Mavs rumblings soon.

Be prepared.

[omahen]

Shams just said on FanDuel TV that the Mavs have done their due diligence on both Siakam and Jerami Grant and determined the price tags were too high for them but still determined to upgrade PF.

I think Siakam will be traded right at TDL or perhaps not at all. Toronto is 3-1 since the trade. So far Sacramento and Atlanta already gave up to trade for him, probably meaning Toronto is demanding too much.

[omahen]

I am also encouraged by wording: Mavs feel the price is too high.

It could be understood as Mavs could trade for them, but are not prepared to do it due to high price. I hope they are able to find a middle ground.

[F Gump]

Part of whether or not the price is too high, is the issue of what you are getting. My belief is that "he won't extend (iow he's a half-season rental)" creates "he's not worth what TOR wants." There's also a report that SAC lost interest in trading for PS because they didn't have any interest in PS's expectation of a max contract in the summer. That info is revealing.

PS's contract demands and expectations are going to be significant factors in his value. It will be an interesting road ahead if PS digs in his heels on the no-extension stance and if his market value for a contract is less than he thinks it should be..

[KillerLeft]

Part of whether or not the price is too high, is the issue of what you are getting. My belief is that "he won't extend (iow he's a half-season rental)" creates "he's not worth what TOR wants." There's also a report that SAC lost interest in trading for PS because they didn't have any interest in PS's expectation of a max contract in the summer. That info is revealing.

PS's contract demands and expectations are going to be significant factors in his value. It will be an interesting road ahead if PS digs in his heels on the no-extension stance and if his market value for a contract is less than he thinks it should be..

I agree with most of this. 

At the end of the day, whomever trades for him will have a reasonable expectation that he'll re-sign. I believe your note that Sacramento pulled out because of max contract expectation sort of proves that his agent is negotiating with potential trade designations. 

In other words, they'll find a team he's willing to play for who WILL offer a max. and only then will a trade happen. 

No idea if Dallas thinks he's worth another max contract.

[omahen]

Part of whether or not the price is too high, is the issue of what you are getting. My belief is that "he won't extend (iow he's a half-season rental)" creates "he's not worth what TOR wants." There's also a report that SAC lost interest in trading for PS because they didn't have any interest in PS's expectation of a max contract in the summer. That info is revealing.

PS's contract demands and expectations are going to be significant factors in his value. It will be an interesting road ahead if PS digs in his heels on the no-extension stance and if his market value for a contract is less than he thinks it should be..

Siakam wanting a max deal is well known rumor since the summer. That he doesn't want to sign an extension is also well know. Obviously, this reduces any team willingness to pay for him. I am sort of surprised Sacramento "discovered" that just now. I think Toronto wanting Murray was actually more of a deal breaker. Or perhaps the other way around - Sacramento would consider trading Murray if Siakam would sign extension and reduce his salary expectations. Sacramento is in a good place salary wise. Even if Siakam gets his max deal (is that 42 mil?), their top three guys would be paid 117 mil, which is less than top 3 guys in Boston, Milwaukee or Denver will get next season. Sacramento is projected at 150 mil for next season and outgoing salaries of Barnes, Mitchel and Huerter are basically same money Siakam would get. This would be leaving Sacramento a lot of space below second apron to resign Monk and fill rest of the roster with vet min deals. 

I think Toronto is also not willing to just trade Siakam for a bunch of bad contracts and meh pick(s). They might just keep him and try to resign him in the summer, or try to work out a SnT in the summer - they will likely get same crappy return of a couple of bad contracts and meh pick(s). That is why I believe a lot of teams are asking about Siakam, but none of them is willing to make a great offer. The chance for for a big return was probably wasted last TDL.

Since Siakam doesn't seem to be in a hurry to be traded, I think the most likely scenario is, that he stays with Toronto until the summer.

Edit: I believe Siakam will get a max deal in the summer

[HAguiar95]

Can't Pascal sign the same kind of deal Irving got in FA (126M/3y)? Does he really think that high of himself?

[omahen]

Can't Pascal sign the same kind of deal Irving got in FA (126M/3y)? Does he really think that high of himself?

Why wouldn't he? He is a borderline all star with championship ring. His next deal would still be at least mostly through his prime. I could think of a lot of players that signed worse contracts in past years.

[DallasMaverick]

Siakam wanting a max deal is well known rumor since the summer. That he doesn't want to sign an extension is also well know. Obviously, this reduces any team willingness to pay for him. I am sort of surprised Sacramento "discovered" that just now. I think Toronto wanting Murray was actually more of a deal breaker. Or perhaps the other way around - Sacramento would consider trading Murray if Siakam would sign extension and reduce his salary expectations. Sacramento is in a good place salary wise. Even if Siakam gets his max deal (is that 42 mil?), their top three guys would be paid 117 mil, which is less than top 3 guys in Boston, Milwaukee or Denver will get next season. Sacramento is projected at 150 mil for next season and outgoing salaries of Barnes, Mitchel and Huerter are basically same money Siakam would get. This would be leaving Sacramento a lot of space below second apron to resign Monk and fill rest of the roster with vet min deals. 

I think Toronto is also not willing to just trade Siakam for a bunch of bad contracts and meh pick(s). They might just keep him and try to resign him in the summer, or try to work out a SnT in the summer - they will likely get same crappy return of a couple of bad contracts and meh pick(s). That is why I believe a lot of teams are asking about Siakam, but none of them is willing to make a great offer. The chance for for a big return was probably wasted last TDL.

Since Siakam doesn't seem to be in a hurry to be traded, I think the most likely scenario is, that he stays with Toronto until the summer.

Edit: I believe Siakam will get a max deal in the summer

Who do you think will sign him to a max deal?

Paying max money to a good, but not great player seems like a sure-fire way to descend into cap hell.

Seems like teams are being a little more cautious financially than they were prior to the latest cap rules.

[RGP1981]

Who do you think will sign him to a max deal?

The 76ers will, for sure.

Maxey, Melton, Oubre/Tobias, Siakam/Tobias, Embiid

And if he doesn't get a max elsewhere, the Raptors will re-sign him.

[omahen]

Who do you think will sign him to a max deal?

Paying max money to a good, but not great player seems like a sure-fire way to descend into cap hell.

Seems like teams are being a little more cautious financially than they were prior to the latest cap rules.

Siakam is basically a player that fits on almost every roster. There will be some teams looking for a step forward and a possibility for max cap space. Indy and Orlando to name two of them. Philly will have max cap space available. Several other teams with max cap space and all SnT options possibilities.

I don't think teams have become way more hesitant after new CBA. All contenders are above second apron and several big deals for far lesser players were signed last summer. Brooks, KP, FVV to name a few. As I outlined in the post you quoted, big threes of three main contenders cost on average basically same as Siakam max deal.

[IamDougieFresh]

Luka Doncic
Kyrie Irving
Andrew Wiggins
PJ Washington
Dereck Lively II

Dante Exum
Jaden Hardy
Derrick Jones Jr.
Olivier-Maxence Prosper
Nick Richards

Seth Curry
Frank Ntilikina
AJ Lawson
Maxi Kleber
Dwight Powell

Make it happen.

[omahen]

The league is wide open and a player like Siakam could make many teams far more likely to get a ring than without him. So at the end of the day a team may balk at the price and sign a lesser player at 70 % of the cost. But that lesser player might just not be good enough to get a ring. This is a risk you take, because a competitor will sign the guy and have a better player. Of course every team signing Siakam will be locked with him, hoping it will work. This is a risk you take. If they win a ring, nobody will care they gave him a max deal. If they don't succeed, they will be stuck and probably in need of a rebuild in a couple of years. But, only one team wins it each year. What we have seen is that top contenders still invest everything possible to create as good as team as possible. High salaries, most picks traded. This is a price to have a good chance. And not all of them succeed. But it still is a price you have to pay.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

Who do you think will sign him to a max deal?

Mark Cuban circa 2021

[KillerLeft]

Luka Doncic
Kyrie Irving
Andrew Wiggins
PJ Washington
Dereck Lively II

I'm with you on Washington, but after last week I poked around on Wiggins and I'm a hard no on him. He's AWFUL.

[omahen]

Just a final note - If Siakam would be willing to sign that 2 year extension with whoever is willing to trade for him, there would be 10 teams waiting in line and price would go way above what Mavs have to offer. The only thing that Mavs can consider Siakam is that he is not willing to do that. You can basically pay a lot of assets but save on salary or you can pay the salary and save assets. I think Mavs can afford to pay the salary and still have plenty of cap left to build a solid team. I think that is far better for them and their flexibility than spending all assets on one guy. Or spending similar assets on lesser guys on lower salaries. Especially since they have Exum and Lively as very cheap playoff rotation players locked for next season.

[Scott41theMavs]

Luka Doncic
Kyrie Irving
Andrew Wiggins
PJ Washington
Dereck Lively II

Dante Exum
Jaden Hardy
Derrick Jones Jr.
Olivier-Maxence Prosper
Nick Richards

Seth Curry
Frank Ntilikina
AJ Lawson
Maxi Kleber
Dwight Powell

Make it happen.

Sorry, thought you were someone who wanted the Mavs to win, which is mutually exclusive with having Wiggins on roster.

[IamDougieFresh]

I'm with you on Washington, but after last week I poked around on Wiggins and I'm a hard no on him. He's AWFUL.

Only reason we could trade for him or PJ is their decreased value. Swoop in and buy low. This is where legendary GMs are born.