Trade & FA 2023-24: Booker Likes NYK? Vogel Out? Suns Imploding?

[Mapka]

How high can you go with these incentives, if they don´t count against the cap?

Luka´s new contract

1M per year and 50M in incentives per season, if GP > 0.

Likely incentives (reached the year before) count against the cap.

[Chicagojk]

https://www.threads.net/t/CucxjwiuUwW/

[The Jom]

Thanks. And BTW, there may be almost $2M more in room now under the tax line than we thought. When the deal was signed, Kyrie's total salary came to 120M, not 126M (the other 6M is incentives), over the 3 years. 

At this point I show the Mavs may be tracking towards about 160.5M, almost 5M below the tax line. And that assumes they pay McGee his entire salary rather than erase it or minimize it somehow.

As you note, they aren't going to spend MLE money or that space under the tax line just to spend it, and you make a good point that we aren't seeing a target that would justify the added expense. One angle could be an attempt to take in some player being moved in a Harden or Lillard trade, but without that, it feels like a wait for nothing again (as happened last year). I remember the stupid "Trade for a Big Wing coming in August" thread that I objected to because it felt like a myth but the mod wouldn't change because he had decided it was certain to happen, which proved to be pure nonsense of course.

In fact, if they end up without any use for some tax-free payroll, it's possible they could do some contracts decreasing -- while Kyrie's is done, and Curry/Exum are probably not changeable due to exception limits, they still haven't done GW or Powell.

Congrats on being right about a thread title 11 months ago.

[ItsGoTime]

I feel certain they re-signed Kyrie because they want to see how a second stud can play with Luca-Mavs. The front office has whiffed on getting a true second star for the last 4 years, so this is their opportunity to see if it works.

I don't think there's any trickery here. It is exactly what they said they wanted for years.

I fully agree with this, but I also think it could quickly and easily turn into that.

[mvossman]

Thanks. And BTW, there may be almost $2M more in room now under the tax line than we thought. When the deal was signed, Kyrie's total salary came to 120M, not 126M (the other 6M is incentives), over the 3 years. 

At this point I show the Mavs may be tracking towards about 160.5M, almost 5M below the tax line. And that assumes they pay McGee his entire salary rather than erase it or minimize it somehow.

As you note, they aren't going to spend MLE money or that space under the tax line just to spend it, and you make a good point that we aren't seeing a target that would justify the added expense. One angle could be an attempt to take in some player being moved in a Harden or Lillard trade, but without that, it feels like a wait for nothing again (as happened last year). I remember the stupid "Trade for a Big Wing coming in August" thread that I objected to because it felt like a myth but the mod wouldn't change because he had decided it was certain to happen, which proved to be pure nonsense of course.

In fact, if they end up without any use for some tax-free payroll, it's possible they could do some contracts decreasing -- while Kyrie's is done, and Curry/Exum are probably not changeable due to exception limits, they still haven't done GW or Powell.

I think Derrick Jones Jr would make sense for that remaining balance up to the tax line.  But apparently we are still trying to send out Timmy and McGee so that prolly needs to happen (if its going to happen) before anything else.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

Congrats on being right about a thread title 11 months ago.

He’s right. The board was run completely based on one persons personal feelings, usually not based in reality. It’s a lot better now that there isn’t one guy steering all conversation.

[mvossman]

One of the interesting parts of this is it might explain why it hasn’t happened yet. If Detroit would take seconds for THJ, we don’t have them yet.  Also explains why no real urgency (seemingly) on Nico’s part to get something done.

Not excited if that is the route to get off Timmy.  I'm skeptical that Detroit does it, but Bojan is 34 and he has the look of a guy that is starting to fall of a cliff.  I'm guessing in a year Timmy's contract will look better.

[ItsGoTime]

He’s right. The board was run completely based on one persons personal feelings, usually not based in reality. It’s a lot better now that there isn’t one guy steering all conversation.

I didn’t realize the titles steered conversation so much, other than into complaining about the titles.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

Not excited if that is the route to get off Timmy.  I'm skeptical that Detroit does it, but Bojan is 34 and he has the look of a guy that is starting to fall of a cliff.  I'm guessing in a year Timmy's contract will look better.

Not sure I agree with this. I’m not super into the Bojan idea because I don’t feel more offense is what we need (although I did think he was the best perimeter defender in the playoff series against us, even better than Royce ONeale), but Bojan just put up the best numbers of his career and his efficiency went up in most places on higher volume. When Hardaway is cooking he’s great but having more consistency from a guy like Bojan is something I think you can count on for two more seasons.

[myconsumerclub]

Orlando Robinson a center I think I suggested taking a look at before free agency started is now officially a mistake we made this offseason by not trying to take him away from Miami when they left him open to our getting him as they made him an unrestricted free agent.

He singlehandidly defeated Boston in summer league scoring 36 points and he also hit 75% from 3 going 3 of 4 from beyond the arc.

https://www.nba.com/news/summer-standout...le-doubles

He was there to be had guys and guess who also had 6 points and 6 rebounds for Boston in 17.5 minutes? Udoka Azabuike.

So other teams are trying the remaining centers. The Heat resigned Robinson so he got back with them and we blew it.

I was wanting us to take on the other Miami center that is also an unrestricted free agent now and he may be even better than Robinson.

Vet min would allow us to add him. Omer Yurtseven 6'11 264 pounds and maybe we could talk him into playing with our SL team like Boston is doing with Udoka.

How come we do not take an approach similar to Miami or at least try to keep an eye on what they are doing and spy on their roster moves more since they are clearly better at signing talent from the pool of undrafted players who show they can perform in the league.

If they cut a guy we should be on the phone and asking them to visit at the very least.

Look how many players who performed with their team where undrafted.

Maybe they are just better at finding talent among the undrafted than our guys are.

Robinson would have been a better option than resigning Powell for sure.

Good luck dreaming that we are going to be getting anything at all out of a trade for McGee or THJ and hope Holmes is able to recapture his ability form 2 years ago. That is what we have to look forward to now. So glad Cuban was able to get Powell resigned since he is such a great all time GOAT for us LOL.

[Mavs2021]

I feel certain they re-signed Kyrie because they want to see how a second stud can play with Luca-Mavs. The front office has whiffed on getting a true second star for the last 4 years, so this is their opportunity to see if it works.

I don't think there's any trickery here. It is exactly what they said they wanted for years.

Oh yeah. Of course if they have a great season, then they won´t trade Kyrie. 

What they define as success, is the big question.

If Kyrie has a great season, we could still be looking at a 5th-8th seed with a first round loss. Is that enough or do they adjust the timeline at that point?


Also if they wanted a 2nd star so desperately, they should have kept Brunson.

[KillerLeft]

I feel certain they re-signed Kyrie because they want to see how a second stud can play with Luca-Mavs. The front office has whiffed on getting a true second star for the last 4 years, so this is their opportunity to see if it works.

I don't think there's any trickery here. It is exactly what they said they wanted for years.

Then you and I agree. 

But, it sure is obvious that the REST of the team is deliberately being built on Luka’s timeline, not his. This DOES mean that they have an easy exit strategy if something goes wrong with him. They obviously thought about this before they did it. Obviously.

Why is acknowledging this basic, common sense, staring us in the face fact riling so many feathers?

[Mavs2021]

Orlando Robinson a center I think I suggested taking a look at before free agency started is now officially a mistake we made this offseason by not trying to take him away from Miami when they left him open to our getting him as they made him an unrestricted free agent.

He singlehandidly defeated Boston in summer league scoring 36 points and he also hit 75% from 3 going 3 of 4 from beyond the arc.

https://www.nba.com/news/summer-standout...le-doubles

He was there to be had guys and guess who also had 6 points and 6 rebounds for Boston in 17.5 minutes? Udoka Azabuike.

So other teams are trying the remaining centers.

I have to admit, I was really confused that we had so little size on our SL roster. You´d think they´d give some undrafted/young center a look.

[KillerLeft]

Yeah I don't think there's any want or desire to get away from Kyrie
Their positioning is more about making the escape easier if Kyrie has another Kyrie Moment

Yes!

OR, just if the combo of him and Luka isn’t as good as they hope. OR, if 1 of 30 other problems that could come up do come up.

This is a COMPLIMENT to the Mavs, my dudes. It’s one of of the smartest things I’ve ever seen them do.

[ItsGoTime]

Yes!

OR, just if the combo of him and Luka isn’t as good as they hope. OR, if 1 of 30 other problems that could come up do come up.

This is a COMPLIMENT to the Mavs, my dudes. It’s one of of the smartest things I’ve ever seen them do.

After the crap Lillard is giving Por with his trade demands, this is how I hope they approach that situation. Oh, you only want to go to 1 team? Ok, sit out until that 1 team meets our demands. In the meantime, we’ll go ahead and start our youth movement without you!

[KillerLeft]

After the crap Lillard is giving Por with his trade demands, this is how I hope they approach that situation. Oh, you only want to go to 1 team? Ok, sit out until that 1 team meets our demands. In the meantime, we’ll go ahead and start our youth movement without you!

I agree with this.

But, I also feel like the Mavs set this situation up in such a way where they can quickly, easy send Kyrie anywhere, including where he wants to go, and profit handily.

[Smitty]

I think there’s zero chance the Mavs organization doesn’t think they’re “contenders” with 2 of the best 10 players in the league. They’ve spent the offseason targeting players that fit Luka, whom two seasons ago made it to the WCF, (Kyrie= Brunson, GWill = DFS, Thybulle = Reggie). I think they found a day 1 rotation player in OMax so maybe POR matching Thy won’t sting as much.

I also think there’s absolutely no reason to trade THJ unless it’s a clear upgrade AND the money makes sense (LT vs no LT / 1st Apron). THJ has a clear role on this current roster. If he’s outgoing in any trade you will need to replace him as the backup SF.

Luka and Kyrie should be good enough to win in the regular season with below average center play. I think they wait to see if they’re really a starting Center away and if so, use their remaining assets at the TDL to address. Seeing what you have in Holmes is the logical way forward at this point.

The only potential trade that makes sense from a Mavs perspective before then, is the one SH came up with:

Maxi+THJ+FRP and/or 3 SRP’s for Allen & Okoro

Interesting enough that trade is an exact salary match (28.9M), and trading two 31 year olds for 2 players under 25 fits the youth movement.

[ItsGoTime]

I agree with this.

But, I also feel like the Mavs set this situation up in such a way where they can quickly, easy send Kyrie anywhere, including where he wants to go, and profit handily.

Ok, you set yourself up for this one, and this is just playing cause I’m (edit: I should say more with you than not) with you on the player, but, Ayton???

[KillerLeft]

Ok, you set yourself up for this one, and this is just playing cause I’m (edit: I should say more with you than not) with you on the player, but, Ayton???

That’s one way it could go, sure. I don’t really think PHX was ever really interested in putting Kyrie next to Beal/Booker, but I think there will be options if/when the time comes.

[myconsumerclub]

I have to admit, I was really confused that we had so little size on our SL roster. You´d think they´d give some undrafted/young center a look.

Especially when you see teams that are trying to upgrade the center position and how they are doing it.  The MBT simply ignore that need as if we are somehow okay because we got the right people. 

We just resigned a bum like Powell and did so while we have no real starter in place but somehow a guy who has not been given any meaningful minutes at center in years is somehow a find that we should look forward to letting play the 5 for us and he is only 6'8. 

This teams ownership is mentally defective in very obvious ways.

Azabuike Robinson Yurtseven Huff and many others with legit size are and where there for us to take a look at in free agency for next to nothing. 

Robinson was a free agent and he was resigned by his old team so they left him open and probably thought that they would resign him later but hey they probably feel it would be safe to leave him unrestricted for a week or so because they know that most owners in this league see someone getting made an unrestricted free agent and right away they assume that the player is probably crap and not worth being looked at since why else would they make them unrestricted.

LOL I think it is hilarious that the Heat just trolled the entire league and showed how totally clueless they all are.