Trade & FA 2023-24: NOP Will Not Give Ingram an Extension

[ItsGoTime]

Timmy for PJ straight up seems a little lite, but there are reasons they have not been able to trade Timmy in the past.  That injury killed his trade value starting with the trade deadline two seasons ago when he was out for the rest of the year.  That also left question marks at the beginning of this last season and his early struggles coming back from injury didn't help.  I will argue that Timmy is at least neutral value right now and PJ on a big contract is potentially neutral in value as well depending on the size of the contract.  The question might not be is THJ worth PJ, it might be how much do we have to pay PJ in that scenario.

This is such a ridiculous take. You’re stretching just to argue the point. Go look at our cap sheet and tell me THJ’s 3rd highest contract doesn’t stick out like a sore thumb.

[HAguiar95]

Still think we need a starting center that can rebound and protect the rim.

Right now, we have Powell, Green and Holmes (maybe) to OReb and Luka + Holmes (maybe) to DReb. Expect us to continue being 30th in OReb and about 26th in DReb.

Available: Gobert, Capela, Ayton, Zubac, Gafford, Adams, Nurkic, Valanciunas.

Assets: Hardaway, Holmes, Kleber, McGee, '27 DAL 1st, '26 DAL 1ST swap, '28 DAL '1st swap, 2 2nd rounders.

Holmes and McGee would be a dream scenario in the outgoing package, since Powell and Lively are going nowhere.

[Reunion Mav]

https://twitter.com/MavsStan41/status/16...7655980033

Jo (@MavsStan41)
Nico Harrison is simultaneously making the Mavericks better right now while also going younger …. Bro is having a generational offseason


I still haven't actually processed this offseason. The Mavs??? Being competent????????????????????????

I'm in a bit of state of shock. They managed to trade for Grant Williams, who while wasn't my first choice, obviously fills an incredible need and is better than Bullock through and through. Now they're making a run at Thybulle, and although a longshot, the idea that they've navigated the summer so that they're actually in a position to nab yet another elite wing defender has me at a loss of words. That's before even adding in the masterful draft, where again, although the Lively pick wasn't my first choice, the maneuver of turning #10 and offloading Bertans and getting 2 guys that ideally fill positions of need with upside just made too much sense.

What is actually happening right now??? Anyone else feels the same? I'm elated, but a bit catatonic. I'm hopeful but also skeptical. I have not fully processed this offseason at all.

Those of us who never fell for the whole off the deep end incompetence thing, especially with Nico and Findog, are I guess having an easier time accepting that we actually found partners this time.

[Chicagojk]

Has the second round picks been confirmed yet? I assume they are going to be very heavy protected or fake second round picks. Like Detroit Pistons top 55 protected. Or something like that.

[StepBackJay]

Yeah, if they don't think Holmes can be a solid stop gap, this is next shoe to drop with or without Thybulle.

Options:

Allen-  We don't have the assets

Ayton- That ship has sailed for now imo

Capella-  Really the perfect fit.  I was against the move back in the draft but would you offer a future first?  Probably not a fit now and Mavs lack the shorter contracts.

Gafford-  Would need to be a third team.   Not good enough to use a future first on.   

Stewart- Not good enough to use a future first on.   Does he provide the rim protection/defense this team is looking for?

Zubac-  I don't see it.   Good contract and Clippers need his role.   

Gobert- I think Minnesota holds on to him for now.   Could be risky if he has another downish season.   Huge money that would probably scare dallas away

Nurkic- Bad contract and his weakness is our weakness

Jonas-  Not worth a future first.  Not sure how we get there.  Also not a rim protector

Precious-  Worth a future first?  Is he ready to play 25 minutes a night?   Probably not worth the first.  Looking for his next contract.

I still think Ayton is alive bc of Stein's reporting and the agent connection Bill Duffy who is Grant and Luka's agent. It's been interesting that the reporting on THJ is that Mavs are confident he will be moved which makes me wonder if the Ayton trade is still on the table. Mavs have the ammo to dump McGee elsewhere and that was evidently the hold-up on draft night. So who knows but I still think its a possibility.

[JamesConway912]

https://twitter.com/droppingdimes02/stat...88098?s=46&t=-bN4oD2OLU_Ue80HIM_CZQ

Lillard to MIA according to the twitter account which got some attention lately. 

Would be bad timing in regards to the Thybulle offersheet I’d imagine.

Re Williams: very good pickup. Good 3D forward, decent contract money-wise, I’d like to know which 2nd rounders we’ll get. But the 2030 unprotected pick swap is a steep price, too. You really can’t afford to loose Luka before that now.

[Chicagojk]

In Woj's latest article he is saying Dame agent (same agent as Thybulle) is calling around to rival teams and warning against trading for his client. I assume the Blazers relationship with Goodwin is not great now.

BTW, I know this is all a part of the business, but it rubs me the wrong way that you request a trade and only want to wind up at one team. I guess you have to take emotion out of it and Dame will probably wind up in Miami, but it just erases some longterm goodwill with Dame in Portland. At least a small ammount. I am sure it will be forgotten in 10 years, but still.

[Chicagojk]

Mavs have maintained their flexibility and even if Thybulle is matched, they don't need to panic if they feel Holmes is a capable stop gap. If not, they may need to be a tad more aggressive.

But if he is a capable stop gap you have Hardaway at two more years (1 after the season) and potentially two first round picks next offseason.

[MFFL]

https://twitter.com/droppingdimes02/stat...88098?s=46&t=-bN4oD2OLU_Ue80HIM_CZQ

Lillard to MIA according to the twitter account which got some attention lately. 

Would be bad timing in regards to the Thybulle offersheet I’d imagine.

Re Williams: very good pickup. Good 3D forward, decent contract money-wise, I’d like to know which 2nd rounders we’ll get. But the 2030 unprotected pick swap is a steep price, too. You really can’t afford to loose Luka before that now.

Or the pressure of a Thybulle deal kicked the deal across the finish line. Which might be great for us.

[speedkilz88]

David Lord
@David_Lord_2020
·
6h
Mavs CAN'T do THJ-Holmes for Ayton without also sending McGee, because as is it requires $3M salary space under the hard cap they don't have.

Ayton's EXTREMELY bloated salary, and so many centers on the roster already, are also obstacles. Can't they do much better for the $?

---

David Lord
@David_Lord_2020
·
5h
I think Gafford should be on the list of a center that would be a good fit for the Mavs (and on mine, he would be at the top).

[MaxiThreeba]

You know who makes a lot of sense for Cleveland….PJ Washington.

PJ to Cleveland
Allen to Mavs
THJ, McGee, 2nd rounders to Charlotte

Still have Holmes salary and the 2027 pick (with more soon unlocked) to make improvements down the road.

[Chicagojk]

I still think Ayton is alive bc of Stein's reporting and the agent connection Bill Duffy who is Grant and Luka's agent. It's been interesting that the reporting on THJ is that Mavs are confident he will be moved which makes me wonder if the Ayton trade is still on the table. Mavs have the ammo to dump McGee elsewhere and that was evidently the hold-up on draft night. So who knows but I still think its a possibility.

I just feel like they are going to hold on to him for now.  PHX fans are thrilled with the minimums they picked up.   Gordon can fill the role that Hardaway would fill.   Unless they thought Ayton is a lost cause, I expect to see how this year goes.   I would think a Holmes/Hardaway offer would be available even if his play didn't get better.

But maybe I am underestimating the damage he did last year.

[Smitty]

David Lord
@David_Lord_2020
·
6h
Mavs CAN'T do THJ-Holmes for Ayton without also sending McGee, because as is it requires $3M salary space under the hard cap they don't have.

Ayton's EXTREMELY bloated salary, and so many centers on the roster already, are also obstacles. Can't they do much better for the $?

---

David Lord
@David_Lord_2020
·
5h
I think Gafford should be on the list of a center that would be a good fit for the Mavs (and on mine, he would be at the top).

I’m not a fan of Ayton in a vacuum but the 2-3 year window that Luka and Kyrie are on with their deals do make sense for the Mavs to kinda go all-in now. The deadline is 1100 cst for Thybulle to sign the offer sheet and submit to Portland. 

The Mavs could solve the McGee dump with a SnT for Thybulle and then up the offer for Ayton. I have them at 3 tradable second round picks now.

McGee + SRP for Thybulle
THJ + Holmes + ‘27 FRP (or the 2 remaining SRP’s) for Ayton OR THJ + Holmes + '27 FRP for Ayton + 2 SRP's


Luka - Curry - Exum
Kyrie - Hardy
Green - Thybulle - Pinson*
Williams - Kleber - Prosper
Ayton - Powell - Lively

On paper it’s a very balanced team and has a chance to contend for the next 2-3 years.

Only 4 players over the age of 27. (Kyrie, Curry, Kleber, Powell)

[BigDirk41]

I'd be surprised if Ayton is still available with the players they were able to sign.

[DallasMaverick]

I'd be surprised if Ayton is still available with the players they were able to sign.

I imagine that Ayton will be available for the remainder of his contract.

[Jason Terry]

The thing with the ridiculous Ayton contract…..

THJ, Holmes and Mcgee are dead money and make more combined than Ayton over the next 2 years. It would be huge value over the next 2 years to swap those guys for Ayton. Even if Ayton is a fraud like we think, it’s still smart business

In regard to the 3rd year of Ayton……when is a $30 million expiring contract ever a bad thing? If Ayton is a bust then boom, we have the expiring contract needed to go big game hunting

[Tyler]

https://twitter.com/droppingdimes02/stat...88098?s=46&t=-bN4oD2OLU_Ue80HIM_CZQ

Lillard to MIA according to the twitter account which got some attention lately. 

Would be bad timing in regards to the Thybulle offersheet I’d imagine.

Re Williams: very good pickup. Good 3D forward, decent contract money-wise, I’d like to know which 2nd rounders we’ll get. But the 2030 unprotected pick swap is a steep price, too. You really can’t afford to loose Luka before that now.

Fake account. The original is 20.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

Mavs have maintained their flexibility and even if Thybulle is matched, they don't need to panic if they feel Holmes is a capable stop gap.  If not, they may need to be a tad more aggressive. 

But if he is a capable stop gap you have Hardaway at two more years (1 after the season) and potentially two first round picks next offseason.

As seemingly public as the Hardaway shopping has been, I have a hard time seeing him return.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

Watching Grant Williams highlights and it's like giving someone who can move their feet the Dirk strip/low block move. There's like an entire highlight reels of just that move from him.

[Okstate819]

From Brian Demaris article in D-Magazine…

Thybulle doesn’t seem to fit the Blazers’ new plan, and sources have told me they are confident Portland won’t match.