Trade & FA 2023-24: PHX Wants Lebron+Bronny| Jazz to Shop Collins

[Luka77]

At some point people said the same thing about Wiggins. Two years later he was one of the best two-way wings in the league and celebrated his first championship. Impossible to tell from the outside.

Wiggins is a peremiter player playing a defined role in chamionship culture surrounded by three hall of famers.

That's hardly what the Mavs are offering Atyton. Only thing the Warriors require from Wiggins is play defense and spread the floor by hitting timely shoots as a thrid or fourth option (Andre Iguadala role).  Having someone in that role with this new CBA is not a luxury teams will be able to have moving forward.

Moreover, during the draft all the scouts said that Wiggins could be a would be a great defender bc his elite athletism at worst (40 inch vert and son of high level athletes).  

That wasn't the case for Ayton who was athletic for a big but not considered elite athlete.  The scouts all said he will likely be fine on the offensive end but will need to work extremely hard to reach his potential on defense.

[Chicagojk]

I must admit I am lost on Ayton. I could see him be rejuvenated with a new team or i could see him continue to slip as a player. Neither would surprise me.

[ItsGoTime]

I must admit I am lost on Ayton.  I could see him be rejuvenated with a new team or i could see him continue to slip as a player.  Neither would surprise me.

+41

Except the way most teams play these days (including us) he doesn’t get much more of a chance to do more than he does in Phoenix (offensively). His upside has to come from defense and rebounding, which I wonder if he actually realizes that.

[IamDougieFresh]

What is the best rebounding stat for players?

[ItsGoTime]

What is the best rebounding stat for players?

I mean, clearly the answer is “your mom”, but I recognize that Ayton is a really good rebounder. His offensive rebounding has come down kinda significantly in the last couple years and if he wants more points, that’s the best way to get them for a C. However, for real the best rebounding stat? Contested rebounds found on nba.com. He could also be better there.

[Chicagojk]

Can Wood be used in a sign and trade as part of a bigger trade? Stein mentioned the #10, THJ and Maxi for Ayton. I was wondering if Wood could be included instead of Maxi? He would be a small part of that trade but maybe more upside than what Maxi brings. And Dallas has no interest in bringing back Wood so it wouldn't matter to them either.

[DanSchwartzgan]

Can Wood be used in a sign and trade as part of a bigger trade?  Stein mentioned the #10, THJ and Maxi for Ayton.    I was wondering if Wood could be included instead of Maxi?  He would be a small part of that trade but maybe more upside than what Maxi brings.  And Dallas has no interest in bringing back Wood so it wouldn't matter to them either.

Wood could possibly be useful in a S&T, but not one that includes the pick.  The pick would have to be made on behalf of Phoenix without the certainty of Wood agreeing to the plan.  I don’t think we’d make such a valuable pick for someone else without knowing we can control all elements of the deal.

[ItsGoTime]

https://twitter.com/NickVanExit/status/1...0020911105

I think that would be a pretty great offseason outcome.

[SleepingHero]

Btw, trading Kyrie, who the Mavs traded an unprotected 2029 first and a couple of key rotation players for a package of Reaves (UDFA), Vandy (2nd Round pick), and Beasley (underproforming late first, a bench player who the Mavs could have drafted if not for the Rondo trade) would be right in line with the misallocation of assests that Mavs fans have gotten accustomed too. 

Moreover, making such a trade would be an serious indictment of the Mavs development program/coaches to produce their own NBA players.

If Kyrie wants LAL, my demands would start with with an LAL unprotected '27 first, Rui (idk how you make it happen him being RFA), Vandy and salary if needed.  That would take care of the Mavs hole at the 4/PF spot that they have been missing from some time.

Side note: Can the Mavs hire Phil Handy (developmental guru) away from LAL or someone of that elk please.

Yeah I'm 100% with you there.

Reaves is good, but I have serious doubts as to how he can excel outside of playing next to Lebron+AD. But he does fit that Parsons-esque mold, an archetype we all know Cuban fawns over. 

Vanderbilt is a solid player and his defense would be great here, but he has legit limitations that stops him from being a perfect fit, that 3pt shot being one of them. 

Beasley is a whatever player who will quickly become the new Bertans.

I'd take Reaves, Vandy, and Hachimura along with their 2027 FRP. Anything else and the Lakers are getting away with a robbery.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

https://twitter.com/NickVanExit/status/1...0020911105

I think that would be a pretty great offseason outcome.

As much as I'd like to win, as a long time fan, it'll be tough to root for this team if they add guys like Brooks and Ayton to Kyrie and Kidd.

[RoyTarpleysGhost]

edit: Dan already posted in the draft thread


From Marc Stein

The Mavericks' trade interest in Phoenix's Deandre Ayton, league sources maintain, has been overstated to this point. While Ayton does have some fans in the organization, there are likewise questions about the former No. 1 overall pick's ability to live up to the $102-plus million left on Ayton's contract over the next three seasons. I don’t get any sense at this juncture that Ayton is Dallas’ top trade target

The Mavericks, league sources say, want to have a thorough handle on their drafting options before they make a firm commitment to trading out of the first round now that they've (narrowly) retained their top-10-protected pick in Round 1 that would have been conveyed to New York had it fallen any lower than No. 10 in Tuesday's lottery. The expectation in rival front offices, when it comes to the Mavericks' selection, nonetheless continues to be that they will try to package No. 10 with, say, Tim Hardaway Jr. and/or Dāvis Bertāns and/or JaVale McGee in a trade to be consummated after Dallas makes the pick.

[dirkfansince1998]

Translation: Ayton is not even 25. Wouldn´t be a fit on the team that we are trying to build. We will look into his future development. If he continues on his current trajectory he could emerge as a target once he is on the right side of 30.

[Jakeospikez]

Milwaukee has all NBA defenders Giannis, JRue and Middleton next to Lopez. I don't think any other team can really survive playing drop defense

I wouldn't prioritize going for him but could do worse out there if he's cheap enough. He could also be a stopgap for a year or 2 while a drafted or still young player develops. Not sure what type of defense they are going to use. I'd think still the smaller 5 like Powell blitz heavy defense but that didn't work out too well last season. I think a lot of it had to do with tanking but also it's possible the league studied it while the Mavs were in the WCF and figured out how to attack it.

[Luka77]

edit: Dan already posted in the draft thread


From Marc Stein

The Mavericks' trade interest in Phoenix's Deandre Ayton, league sources maintain, has been overstated to this point. While Ayton does have some fans in the organization, there are likewise questions about the former No. 1 overall pick's ability to live up to the $102-plus million left on Ayton's contract over the next three seasons. I don’t get any sense at this juncture that Ayton is Dallas’ top trade target

The Mavericks, league sources say, want to have a thorough handle on their drafting options before they make a firm commitment to trading out of the first round now that they've (narrowly) retained their top-10-protected pick in Round 1 that would have been conveyed to New York had it fallen any lower than No. 10 in Tuesday's lottery. The expectation in rival front offices, when it comes to the Mavericks' selection, nonetheless continues to be that they will try to package No. 10 with, say, Tim Hardaway Jr. and/or Dāvis Bertāns and/or JaVale McGee in a trade to be consummated after Dallas makes the pick.

Music to my ears.

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Sure pursue young talent if it's an upgrade to what you already have or brings something to the team concept you don't currently have.  

On a list of priorities the Mavs don't need another ball handler, facilitor, scorer.  They need defenders, rim protection, rebounding and ability to spead the floor.  Reaves brings little to none of those qualities.

Also, IMO Hardy is more talented and will be more impact full over time given the minutes than Reaves.

Moreover, contrary to popular belief Kyrie is not a bad defender.  I would much rather keep Kyrie and have him blocking Hardys minutes give his role to Reaves.

Reaves will get Ducan Robinson overpaid soon and I'm not looking forward to the Mavs doing that.

Well said.  I completely agree with Kyrie being a plus defender.  I see what you're saying

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

https://twitter.com/NickVanExit/status/1...0020911105

I think that would be a pretty great offseason outcome.

I'm for Brooks and G Williams.  Bev has been stealing money for several seasons now.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

https://nypost.com/2023/05/20/nets-offse...tops-list/

[HoosierDaddyKid]

^^ Where's the delete button? This is behind a paywall.

[ItsGoTime]

I'm for Brooks and G Williams.  Bev has been stealing money for several seasons now.

He would be vet min in my mind and have the role of 3rd string PG. If 1 of Luka or Kyrie goes down, he’s playing some minutes to balance out Hardy’s time on the court. Doesn’t have to be him, can be Rose or someone else, just a vet min PG in the role they pitched Dragic last year.

[DanSchwartzgan]

It hasn’t gotten as much play on this board as it has other places, but there are some Cleveland based rumors surrounding a Jarrett Allen to Dallas based trade.  The idea is in the long run Allen and Mobley can’t co-exist, so Mobley has to be the LT Center and Allen has to go.

Rather than focus on whether it is a good idea or not, I’m curious what people think the cost will be.  Some of the thinking out there is Cleveland would like THJ.  Other places think the deal would revolve around Maxi and Reggie.  There isn’t agreement about the pick compensation either.  Cleveland’s only pick is #49, so they aren’t a trade down candidate.  Is #10/THJ reasonable for a 25 year old center who rebounds well and plays good D?  Is #10 too much?  If so, does either side substitute 2027 for #10?  If you do 2027, does that allow you to bring Wood into the conversation?  Can Wood and Mobley work in some form or fashion?  

I suspect Cleveland would like to spread the floor some without killing their super strong D.  So, Maxi and Reggie make a lot of sense (and Reggie probably keeps you from having to retain LaVert).  I’m just having a hard time figuring out what, if any, draft compensation is the right amount to go with this.