Trade & FA 2023-24: Stein-Ingram Trade Inevitable| LAL Want Lebron Back On Any Terms - Printable Version +- MavsBoard (https://www.mavsboard.com) +-- Forum: Boards (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=1) +--- Forum: Dallas Mavericks and the NBA (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=2) +--- Thread: Trade & FA 2023-24: Stein-Ingram Trade Inevitable| LAL Want Lebron Back On Any Terms (/showthread.php?tid=2444) Pages:
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RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - ItsGoTime - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 10:47 AM)omahen Wrote: KP has a 36 mil player option. Imho, he either signs something like 100/4 or he rather takes his option.Yep, I’ve been skeptical that he doesn’t exercise that option despite reports saying he will. All bets are off with a new GM and his next contract HAS to be Isaac-like, incentive laden. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - DallasMaverick - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 11:07 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: Yep, I’ve been skeptical that he doesn’t exercise that option despite reports saying he will. All bets are off with a new GM and his next contract HAS to be Isaac-like, incentive laden. I feel like KP's market value has slidden significantly below $36m, particularly with the new CBA. So he'll pick up the option. But in another year, Washington will have options. I can't see them S&T for him, either, at the end of the season. Next contract in the $15-20m range? RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Ghost of Podkolzin - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 11:20 AM)DallasMaverick Wrote: I feel like KP's market value has slidden significantly below $36m, particularly with the new CBA. He's still a top-5 center in scoring and only behind Horford, Markkanen, and Olynyk in 3pt%. That said, his rebounding and defense has fallen off dramatically. Ya, probably more like $20-25m range. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - DallasMaverick - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 11:31 AM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: He's still a top-5 center in scoring and only behind Horford, Markkanen, and Olynyk in 3pt%. That said, his rebounding and defense has fallen off dramatically. Ya, probably more like $20-25m range. A little better version of Bertans? RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - ItsGoTime - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 11:31 AM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: He's still a top-5 center in scoring and only behind Horford, Markkanen, and Olynyk in 3pt%. That said, his rebounding and defense has fallen off dramatically. Ya, probably more like $20-25m range.I think that’s about right if he hits all his incentives. Otherwise, in the $10-15M range. Lots of games played incentives. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Ghost of Podkolzin - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 11:58 AM)DallasMaverick Wrote: A little better version of Bertans? ??? Are you serious? RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Ghost of Podkolzin - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 11:00 AM)omahen Wrote: The problem with 1 is the Kyrie window. Can the Mavs really afford to wait two years for the pick to really develop? In that time Kyrie will likely find something to destroy the relationship with Mavs. Or he will simply start falling of the cliff. I am not totally against the pick, but they would really need to hit it big time. I completely agree. I'm not saying go after a bloated vet, but looking to talent that has been in the league a few years and has progressed. This jumpstarts what you're say by a few years. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - DallasMaverick - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 12:55 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: ??? Are you serious? Maybe I'm minimizing a bit. ...but if you squint just right... RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Ghost of Podkolzin - 05-25-2023 Using Reb% and DefRtg, I normalized the two at even weight and ranked all players under 26yo who played in at least 40 games last year. Here is the ranking. This is *somewhat* scientific on who our FO should be targeting. Clearly obtainability is not factored (eg, JJJ, Mobley, etc). 1 Jarrett Allen CLE 25 2 Mark Williams CHA 21 3 Isaiah Hartenstein NYK 25 4 Jaren Jackson Jr. MEM 23 5 Evan Mobley CLE 21 6 Mitchell Robinson NYK 25 7 Nic Claxton BKN 24 8 Walker Kessler UTA 21 9 Nick Richards CHA 25 10 Wendell Carter Jr. ORL 24 11 Deandre Ayton PHX 24 12 Onyeka Okongwu ATL 22 13 Dyson Daniels NOP 20 14 Bam Adebayo MIA 25 15 Mo Bamba LAL 25 16 Xavier Tillman MEM 24 17 Sam Hauser BOS 25 18 Josh Okogie PHX 24 19 Bol Bol ORL 23 20 Jayson Tatum BOS 25 21 Jalen Duren DET 19 22 Desmond Bane MEM 24 23 Santi Aldama MEM 22 24 Hamidou Diallo DET 24 25 Ja Morant MEM 23 26 Grant Williams BOS 24 27 Dennis Smith Jr. CHA 25 28 Tari Eason HOU 22 29 Naz Reid MIN 23 30 Rui Hachimura LAL 25 31 Jericho Sims NYK 24 32 Immanuel Quickley NYK 23 33 Thomas Bryant DEN 25 34 Jalen Smith IND 23 35 Lamar Stevens CLE 25 36 Jarred Vanderbilt LAL 24 37 Daniel Gafford WAS 24 38 Tre Mann OKC 22 39 Precious Achiuwa TOR 23 40 Anthony Lamb GSW 25 41 Scottie Barnes TOR 21 42 Obi Toppin NYK 25 43 Oshae Brissett IND 24 44 Josh Giddey OKC 20 45 Deni Avdija WAS 22 46 Michael Porter Jr. DEN 24 47 Jose Alvarado NOP 25 48 Isaac Okoro CLE 22 49 Jordan Goodwin WAS 24 50 Isaiah Jackson IND 21 51 Jaylin Williams OKC 20 52 Tyler Herro MIA 23 53 Aaron Wiggins OKC 24 54 Christian Braun DEN 22 55 Naji Marshall NOP 25 56 Cole Anthony ORL 23 57 Jeremiah Robinson-Earl OKC 22 58 Zach Collins SAS 25 59 Franz Wagner ORL 21 60 Isaiah Stewart DET 22 61 Coby White CHI 23 62 Sandro Mamukelashvili SAS 24 63 Anthony Edwards MIN 21 64 Luka Doncic DAL 24 65 O.G. Anunoby TOR 25 66 Darius Garland CLE 23 67 Brandon Ingram NOP 25 68 Jaylen Nowell MIN 23 69 Jalen Suggs ORL 21 70 Talen Horton-Tucker UTA 22 71 Ayo Dosunmu CHI 23 72 Troy Brown Jr. LAL 23 73 Herbert Jones NOP 24 74 Jonathan Kuminga GSW 20 75 John Collins ATL 25 76 Austin Reaves LAL 24 77 Jaden McDaniels MIN 22 78 De'Anthony Melton PHI 24 79 Paolo Banchero ORL 20 80 Marvin Bagley III DET 24 81 Jalen McDaniels PHI 25 82 David Roddy MEM 22 83 Jalen Williams OKC 22 84 Alperen Sengun HOU 20 85 Isaiah Joe OKC 23 86 Patrick Williams CHI 21 87 Nickeil Alexander-Walker MIN 24 88 Bryce McGowens CHA 20 89 AJ Griffin ATL 19 90 Josh Green DAL 22 91 Caleb Houstan ORL 20 92 Malik Monk SAC 25 93 Shai Gilgeous-Alexander OKC 24 94 Trey Murphy III NOP 22 95 Luguentz Dort OKC 24 96 Kevin Knox II POR 23 97 Jordan Poole GSW 23 98 James Wiseman DET 22 99 Markelle Fultz ORL 24 100 Tyrese Maxey PHI 22 101 P.J. Washington CHA 24 102 Davion Mitchell SAC 24 103 Trendon Watford POR 22 104 Jeremy Sochan SAS 20 105 Jordan Nwora IND 24 106 Cam Thomas BKN 21 107 Quentin Grimes NYK 23 108 Theo Maledon CHA 21 109 Saddiq Bey ATL 24 110 De'Andre Hunter ATL 25 111 Bennedict Mathurin IND 20 112 Daishen Nix HOU 21 113 Romeo Langford SAS 23 114 Keegan Murray SAC 22 115 Kenyon Martin Jr. HOU 22 116 Chris Duarte IND 25 117 RJ Barrett NYK 22 118 Gary Trent Jr. TOR 24 119 Isaiah Livers DET 24 120 Ochai Agbaji UTA 23 121 Jabari Smith Jr. HOU 20 122 R.J. Hampton DET 22 123 Trae Young ATL 24 124 De'Aaron Fox SAC 25 125 Corey Kispert WAS 24 126 Kevin Huerter SAC 24 127 Aaron Nesmith IND 23 128 Ty Jerome GSW 25 129 Shaedon Sharpe POR 19 130 Bones Hyland LAC 22 131 Anfernee Simons POR 23 132 Collin Sexton UTA 24 133 Lonnie Walker IV LAL 24 134 Kevin Porter Jr. HOU 23 135 Tyrese Haliburton IND 23 136 Killian Hayes DET 21 137 Nassir Little POR 23 138 Tre Jones SAS 23 139 Cam Reddish POR 23 140 Andrew Nembhard IND 23 141 Malaki Branham SAS 20 142 Jaden Ivey DET 21 143 Keldon Johnson SAS 23 144 Jalen Green HOU 21 RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Ghost of Podkolzin - 05-25-2023 Now, take the 74 players from above who are above average of the 174, here is their ranking by value (2022/23 Contract). Interesting in this list IMO is Mark Williams, Nick Richards, Dyson Daniels, Sam Houser, Josh Okogie, Tari Eason, and our old friend Dennis Smith Jr, 1 Mark Williams CHA 21 2 Nick Richards CHA 25 3 Walker Kessler UTA 21 4 Isaiah Hartenstein NYK 25 5 Evan Mobley CLE 21 6 Xavier Tillman MEM 24 7 Nic Claxton BKN 24 8 Dyson Daniels NOP 20 9 Sam Hauser BOS 25 10 Onyeka Okongwu ATL 22 11 Josh Okogie PHX 24 12 Bol Bol ORL 23 13 Jarrett Allen CLE 25 14 Mo Bamba LAL 25 15 Wendell Carter Jr. ORL 24 16 Desmond Bane MEM 24 17 Mitchell Robinson NYK 25 18 Santi Aldama MEM 22 19 Jalen Duren DET 19 20 Dennis Smith Jr. CHA 25 21 Hamidou Diallo DET 24 22 Grant Williams BOS 24 23 Naz Reid MIN 23 24 Tari Eason HOU 22 25 Jericho Sims NYK 24 26 Immanuel Quickley NYK 23 27 Rui Hachimura LAL 25 28 Thomas Bryant DEN 25 29 Ja Morant MEM 23 30 Lamar Stevens CLE 25 31 Daniel Gafford WAS 24 32 Jalen Smith IND 23 33 Jarred Vanderbilt LAL 24 34 Anthony Lamb GSW 25 35 Tre Mann OKC 22 36 Precious Achiuwa TOR 23 37 Oshae Brissett IND 24 38 Obi Toppin NYK 25 39 Scottie Barnes TOR 21 40 Josh Giddey OKC 20 41 Jose Alvarado NOP 25 42 Deni Avdija WAS 22 43 Jaren Jackson Jr. MEM 23 44 Jordan Goodwin WAS 24 45 Isaiah Jackson IND 21 46 Isaac Okoro CLE 22 47 Jaylin Williams OKC 20 48 Aaron Wiggins OKC 24 49 Tyler Herro MIA 23 50 Naji Marshall NOP 25 51 Bam Adebayo MIA 25 52 Christian Braun DEN 22 53 Deandre Ayton PHX 24 54 Jeremiah Robinson-Earl OKC 22 55 Cole Anthony ORL 23 56 Franz Wagner ORL 21 57 Sandro Mamukelashvili SAS 24 58 Zach Collins SAS 25 59 Jayson Tatum BOS 25 60 Isaiah Stewart DET 22 61 Coby White CHI 23 62 Anthony Edwards MIN 21 63 Michael Porter Jr. DEN 24 64 Darius Garland CLE 23 65 Jaylen Nowell MIN 23 66 O.G. Anunoby TOR 25 67 Jalen Suggs ORL 21 68 Ayo Dosunmu CHI 23 69 Troy Brown Jr. LAL 23 70 Talen Horton-Tucker UTA 22 71 Herbert Jones NOP 24 72 Jonathan Kuminga GSW 20 73 Brandon Ingram NOP 25 74 Luka Doncic DAL 24 RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Ghost of Podkolzin - 05-25-2023 This is the kind of analysis I hope the FO is doing better than me. Anyway, it's taking advanced stats, normalizing them, factoring value, and applying it against younger talent. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - F Gump - 05-25-2023 About WASH, my guess is that they want to find a way to win now, rather than tear down/rebuild and shoot for later. KP-Kuzma-Beal as the core. I think that's why they got the LAC GM, since for quite some time LA has been in the mode of repeatedly adding the right MLE-or-less pieces around a few key players. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - F Gump - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 10:54 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: IF this is true and these teams, including the Mavs, are behind the 8 ball. I hope the Mavs don't panic. It will be hard not to due to their past mistakes and style of doing things in the past. But if they are stuck, the easiest ways to change that is the folllowing: I think you nailed it. I suspect the Mavs are going to look for "win now" solutions and might do something stupid out of desperation, but I agree they'd be better off looking for efficient solutions that might take 2-3 years to bloom. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Jym - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 07:28 PM)F Gump Wrote: About WASH, my guess is that they want to find a way to win now, rather than tear down/rebuild and shoot for later. KP-Kuzma-Beal as the core. I think that's why they got the LAC GM, since for quite some time LA has been in the mode of repeatedly adding the right MLE-or-less pieces around a few key players. We can complain but imagine being a Wizards fan They haven't won 50+ games in a season since 1979. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - IamDougieFresh - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 04:38 AM)omahen Wrote: Harden max deal will immediately become one of the worst contracts in the league. Jim Harden is COOKED https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/1661763790390820865?s=20 RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - ItsGoTime - 05-25-2023 (05-25-2023, 10:48 PM)IamDougieFresh Wrote: Jim Harden is COOKEDMiami should be retroactively be charged for DWade. Dallas starts next season’s first game shooting 30 techs for the 06 finals alone. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - F Gump - 05-26-2023 (05-25-2023, 07:58 AM)omahen Wrote: From Hollinger: The Mavs are one of the teams in that boat, where their options are choked off and there are no teams selling. As the article implies, there are so many teams looking for help, that any "good" players made available who can improve your team will have a slew of suitors eager to grab the player, which means nothing will be cheap. I will repeat something I've said a few times before, which is that the Mavs real way forward would be to somehow figure out and embrace the minimum salary and developmental route. Create a pipeline and use it. Part of that requires real minutes, and roles, and an attempt to bring players along. Between the Legends and the 2-ways and some open slots in the roster, with a willingness to invest minutes, I believe you can make things happen IF it becomes your priority. The Mavs dabble at these things, and piddle around. I think of the times when they have 2-way openings that go unused, for what seems forever, when they should always be aware where "the next guy" is, and grabbing him and getting to work when they get an opening. The lack of urgency speaks volumes. Cuban is impatient (as we are too) and wants to swap his way to better roster. My crap for your useful player. Or for those hidden gem guys. But no one wants to give away their talent or emerging gems, so that costs an arm and a leg. Instead, gotta create the bargain yourself, for yourself -- go expertly identify and find those guys and develop them into the kind of player we need. Hardy might be a start, but Mavs need to be doing 2-3 of these every year, with the hope that you end up putting 1-2 into your bargain keeper category each year. There is nothing in the cap to keep that from being doable. Including this year, when there are no assets. It just takes smarts, hard work, and some patience. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Mapka - 05-26-2023 (05-25-2023, 07:34 PM)F Gump Wrote: I think you nailed it. I suspect the Mavs are going to look for "win now" solutions and might do something stupid out of desperation, but I agree they'd be better off looking for efficient solutions that might take 2-3 years to bloom. We already left this path, if we ever had a chance to walk that way. We traded for a a 3x-year "superstar". RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - F Gump - 05-26-2023 (05-26-2023, 05:05 AM)Mapka Wrote: We already left this path, if we ever had a chance to walk that way. Are you saying the window of opportunity for the Mavs to develop their own bargain talent has been closed? I wouldn't think so. In fact, I think it's more important than ever. Whether Cuban will make it a priority and demand it be done at the highest level does remain to be seen. But I think the team's current roster and payroll screams for them to figure out how to become really superior at the find-and-develop game. RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Lebron: "I got a lot to think about next year" - Chicagojk - 05-26-2023 (05-26-2023, 01:33 AM)F Gump Wrote: The Mavs are one of the teams in that boat, where their options are choked off and there are no teams selling. As the article implies, there are so many teams looking for help, that any "good" players made available who can improve your team will have a slew of suitors eager to grab the player, which means nothing will be cheap. I agree. There are two second round picks last year who I will be curious to see where they wind up. One is Trevor Keels who was drafted by the Knicks right after we took Hardy. There were rumors the Mavs liked Keels. I am sure the trade with Sacramento started prior to the draft if our guy was there. Hardy just fell more than they thought. Keels was brought up to the Knicks roster late in the season, released and then signed back as a two way. I don't believe he is tied to the Knicks after the season. Can the Knicks guarantee him a spot on the roster? If the Mavs did like him, why not offer him the 15th spot on a two year deal? I have some doubts on him as a player, but he is only 19 years old. The other is Kennedy Chandler. He is a smaller point who was released by Memphis as they had to get bigger for the playoffs due to injuries. He is also young and someone you can develop. Those are just two examples. |