(02-16-2024, 04:12 PM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: I feel like no one has watched him play in years

(02-16-2024, 04:04 PM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: Yeah…that’s working out really great getting a guy who wanted to be in Miami. Milwaukee probably closed their window shut going all in one guy in his 30s.

(02-16-2024, 04:07 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Someone will. It will happen when the old guard stars are all gone and Luka is at the top.

(02-16-2024, 05:34 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: I'm not so sure about that. I read an article about star players not wanting to come to Dallas because Luka is so ball dominant. Him and Kyrie seem to be making it work, but adding a 3rd wheel may be tricky. Until Luka is more willing to play off the ball ( he still doesn't) I have a hard time believing another bonafide star will sacrifice coming there.

(02-16-2024, 05:34 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: I'm not so sure about that. I read an article about star players not wanting to come to Dallas because Luka is so ball dominant. I'm not saying it can't happen,  but Luka's style of play doesn't fit everybody. Him and Kyrie seem to be making it work, but adding a 3rd wheel may be tricky. Until Luka is more willing to play off the ball ( he still doesn't) I have a hard time believing another bonafide star will sacrifice coming there.

(02-16-2024, 03:38 PM)RGP1981 Wrote: I do not mean to sound like Dr. Phil... but this right here sounds like your actual issue? You hate the Lakers so much and care more about any potential benefits for LAL, but not the the potential pitfalls of the deal to LAL? More importantly, you aren't first thinking about how such a deal might benefit the Mavs more than anyone else.

Don't be a fox with sour grapes bro. The Lakers have had nothing to do with the Mavericks' past misfortunes.

(02-16-2024, 05:34 PM)HoosierDaddyKid Wrote: I'm not so sure about that. I read an article about star players not wanting to come to Dallas because Luka is so ball dominant. I'm not saying it can't happen,  but Luka's style of play doesn't fit everybody. Him and Kyrie seem to be making it work, but adding a 3rd wheel may be tricky. Until Luka is more willing to play off the ball ( he still doesn't) I have a hard time believing another bonafide star will sacrifice coming there.

(02-17-2024, 07:22 AM)Dundalis Wrote: I actually don't care much about this, it doesn't "seem" to work between Luka and Kyrie, it works without qualification because Kyrie is not particularly ball dominant. He's not really been much more ball dominant than Steph Curry for a long while.

We don't need other ball dominant stars to play next to Luka, and those are the ones that would have issues playing here. Luka's style fits anyone who doesn't require the ball in their hands consistently to be effective, and that's fine, because there's not another player this team could acquire that would make the team better having an even split share of ball handling duties with Luka. If a third wheel type is gonna have an issue playing here it's because they are too reliant on ball dominance for their effectiveness, and we don't need that player anyway

(02-17-2024, 10:49 AM)surfpuckmd Wrote: I hope we make no more major trades for at least one year.  I'd rather let the roster develop together.  Any major change should be a new head coach depending on what we do in the playoffs.

I also don't think we really need to target a 3rd-best player.  Lively already is our 3rd-best player and will be only continue to improve.  

If we target a 4th-best player, it should be an elite defensive player who is decent offensively.  Those players are less expensive to trade for and have smaller contracts than offensive stars.  

My strong preference though is to wait a year and watch how Hardy, Green, PJ Washington and OMax develop.  We also need to see if Exum can return and play at the same level as before the plantar fasciitis.  Each of those players might be the solutions to our roster.  We just need to see which ones improve with experience.

(02-17-2024, 01:41 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: I'm very huge on "bring back the band" for next year already. While I think it could be a good idea to trade THJ and seconds and/or one first for a really solid upgrade, I am quite content with the 8-man of Luka-Kyrie-Green-Washington-Lively-Exum-Maxi-Gafford. To me, the biggest make-or-break for the 2024-25 season is a somewhat under-the-radar one - they must give OMax real minutes and genuinely develop him. He has the potential to be a huge part of the future, but if they don't develop him, they'll have screwed that pooch. As a matter of fact, a silver lining if they can't keep DJJ will be ***give those minutes to OMax,*** full stop.

One underconsidered reason why the Mavs should start stockpiling more assets is that whenever we move on from Kyrie (or he forces his way out, which at this point doesn't appear to be anytime soon), replacing him as the second star is going to be exorbitantly expensive. They need to have their eyes open for who that guy is already, tbqh.

(02-17-2024, 02:33 PM)surfpuckmd Wrote: I'm hoping the eventual THJ replacement is Jaden Hardy.

(02-17-2024, 02:33 PM)surfpuckmd Wrote: Agree with your post except I'm not sure where they'll be able to find minutes for OMax this season.  PJ, Maxi and DJJ are all clearly better players than OMax and as we're fighting for playoff position, it will be difficult to find any minutes for him unless there are more injuries.  I'd rather have him play in G-league and work on his shooting.  

(02-17-2024, 10:49 AM)surfpuckmd Wrote: I hope we make no more major trades for at least one year.  I'd rather let the roster develop together.  Any major change should be a new head coach depending on what we do in the playoffs.

I also don't think we really need to target a 3rd-best player.  Lively already is our 3rd-best player and will be only continue to improve.  

If we target a 4th-best player, it should be an elite defensive player who is decent offensively.  Those players are less expensive to trade for and have smaller contracts than offensive stars.  

My strong preference though is to wait a year and watch how Hardy, Green, PJ Washington and OMax develop.  We also need to see if Exum can return and play at the same level as before the plantar fasciitis.  Each of those players might be the solutions to our roster.  We just need to see which ones improve with experience.

(02-17-2024, 03:27 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: This is as good a place as any to put something I was thinking about the other day...how do we compare to Denver.

Kyrie  - Murray
PJW   - Gordon
Green - KCP 

Luka/Lively - Jokic/MPJ

Denver's bench is fairly small with Jackson, Braun and Watson getting the most minutes and Nnaji/Jordan/Strawther being their main front court guys.  Compare that to Exum, THJ, DJJ, Maxi and Gafford.

I think we fairly easily win the bench contest.  I suspect most would hand them the advantage regarding Gordon/KCP over Green/PJW (though the similarities here are interesting).  Green probably won't win a DPOY award, but he's also not 31 (and KCP might not match Green's TS% or 3% for a series).  We can probably argue for days about Kyrie/Murray and the combo's involving Luka/Lively and Jokic/MPJ (since our stars play different positions, I combined them with the opposite at that position).

I think it is important to note that the comparison isn't really about Luka vs Jokic or Green vs KCP.  It is really about what the other team can do to neutralize the other.  Is Dallas better equipped to stop Jokic with Lively and Gafford and Maxi or is Denver better equipped to neutralize Luka with Gordon (and who?).  The cross matches matter too.  Green and KCP won't be guarding each other.  Green (or Exum or DJJ) will largely get Murray and KCP will largely get Kyrie.  Who will the other team target for switches (probably Kyrie and Murray) and do their teams have the schemes to protect the disadvantage gained in such a switch.

When you start to look at it as team against team rather than "PJW sucks and he isn't nearly as good as Gordon" type commentary, I start to feel we aren't obviously doomed against Denver.  If everyone was 100% healthy, continuity and experience might win out.  But, I think it is close enough that a bump or bruise here or there might determine a series between these two.

Looking at the rest of the top teams in the West, I'm much less worried about Minnesota and OKC.  We can vary our lineups more than either and mitigate their strengths.  I'd probably want to avoid LAC if given the choice.  I'm just not sure how we stop everything they can throw at us if they are fully healthy.  But they certainly have holes we could take advantage of.

(02-17-2024, 03:27 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: This is as good a place as any to put something I was thinking about the other day...how do we compare to Denver.

Kyrie  - Murray
PJW   - Gordon
Green - KCP 

Luka/Lively - Jokic/MPJ

Denver's bench is fairly small with Jackson, Braun and Watson getting the most minutes and Nnaji/Jordan/Strawther being their main front court guys.  Compare that to Exum, THJ, DJJ, Maxi and Gafford.

I think we fairly easily win the bench contest.  I suspect most would hand them the advantage regarding Gordon/KCP over Green/PJW (though the similarities here are interesting).  Green probably won't win a DPOY award, but he's also not 31 (and KCP might not match Green's TS% or 3% for a series).  We can probably argue for days about Kyrie/Murray and the combo's involving Luka/Lively and Jokic/MPJ (since our stars play different positions, I combined them with the opposite at that position).

I think it is important to note that the comparison isn't really about Luka vs Jokic or Green vs KCP.  It is really about what the other team can do to neutralize the other.  Is Dallas better equipped to stop Jokic with Lively and Gafford and Maxi or is Denver better equipped to neutralize Luka with Gordon (and who?).  The cross matches matter too.  Green and KCP won't be guarding each other.  Green (or Exum or DJJ) will largely get Murray and KCP will largely get Kyrie.  Who will the other team target for switches (probably Kyrie and Murray) and do their teams have the schemes to protect the disadvantage gained in such a switch.

When you start to look at it as team against team rather than "PJW sucks and he isn't nearly as good as Gordon" type commentary, I start to feel we aren't obviously doomed against Denver.  If everyone was 100% healthy, continuity and experience might win out.  But, I think it is close enough that a bump or bruise here or there might determine a series between these two.

Looking at the rest of the top teams in the West, I'm much less worried about Minnesota and OKC.  We can vary our lineups more than either and mitigate their strengths.  I'd probably want to avoid LAC if given the choice.  I'm just not sure how we stop everything they can throw at us if they are fully healthy.  But they certainly have holes we could take advantage of.

(02-17-2024, 03:27 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: This is as good a place as any to put something I was thinking about the other day...how do we compare to Denver.

Kyrie  - Murray
PJW   - Gordon
Green - KCP 

Luka/Lively - Jokic/MPJ

Denver's bench is fairly small with Jackson, Braun and Watson getting the most minutes and Nnaji/Jordan/Strawther being their main front court guys.  Compare that to Exum, THJ, DJJ, Maxi and Gafford.

I think we fairly easily win the bench contest.  I suspect most would hand them the advantage regarding Gordon/KCP over Green/PJW (though the similarities here are interesting).  Green probably won't win a DPOY award, but he's also not 31 (and KCP might not match Green's TS% or 3% for a series).  We can probably argue for days about Kyrie/Murray and the combo's involving Luka/Lively and Jokic/MPJ (since our stars play different positions, I combined them with the opposite at that position).

I think it is important to note that the comparison isn't really about Luka vs Jokic or Green vs KCP.  It is really about what the other team can do to neutralize the other.  Is Dallas better equipped to stop Jokic with Lively and Gafford and Maxi or is Denver better equipped to neutralize Luka with Gordon (and who?).  The cross matches matter too.  Green and KCP won't be guarding each other.  Green (or Exum or DJJ) will largely get Murray and KCP will largely get Kyrie.  Who will the other team target for switches (probably Kyrie and Murray) and do their teams have the schemes to protect the disadvantage gained in such a switch.

When you start to look at it as team against team rather than "PJW sucks and he isn't nearly as good as Gordon" type commentary, I start to feel we aren't obviously doomed against Denver.  If everyone was 100% healthy, continuity and experience might win out.  But, I think it is close enough that a bump or bruise here or there might determine a series between these two.

Looking at the rest of the top teams in the West, I'm much less worried about Minnesota and OKC.  We can vary our lineups more than either and mitigate their strengths.  I'd probably want to avoid LAC if given the choice.  I'm just not sure how we stop everything they can throw at us if they are fully healthy.  But they certainly have holes we could take advantage of.

(02-17-2024, 03:27 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: This is as good a place as any to put something I was thinking about the other day...how do we compare to Denver.

Kyrie  - Murray
PJW   - Gordon
Green - KCP 

Luka/Lively - Jokic/MPJ

Denver's bench is fairly small with Jackson, Braun and Watson getting the most minutes and Nnaji/Jordan/Strawther being their main front court guys.  Compare that to Exum, THJ, DJJ, Maxi and Gafford.

I think we fairly easily win the bench contest.  I suspect most would hand them the advantage regarding Gordon/KCP over Green/PJW (though the similarities here are interesting).  Green probably won't win a DPOY award, but he's also not 31 (and KCP might not match Green's TS% or 3% for a series).  We can probably argue for days about Kyrie/Murray and the combo's involving Luka/Lively and Jokic/MPJ (since our stars play different positions, I combined them with the opposite at that position).

I think it is important to note that the comparison isn't really about Luka vs Jokic or Green vs KCP.  It is really about what the other team can do to neutralize the other.  Is Dallas better equipped to stop Jokic with Lively and Gafford and Maxi or is Denver better equipped to neutralize Luka with Gordon (and who?).  The cross matches matter too.  Green and KCP won't be guarding each other.  Green (or Exum or DJJ) will largely get Murray and KCP will largely get Kyrie.  Who will the other team target for switches (probably Kyrie and Murray) and do their teams have the schemes to protect the disadvantage gained in such a switch.

When you start to look at it as team against team rather than "PJW sucks and he isn't nearly as good as Gordon" type commentary, I start to feel we aren't obviously doomed against Denver.  If everyone was 100% healthy, continuity and experience might win out.  But, I think it is close enough that a bump or bruise here or there might determine a series between these two.

Looking at the rest of the top teams in the West, I'm much less worried about Minnesota and OKC.  We can vary our lineups more than either and mitigate their strengths.  I'd probably want to avoid LAC if given the choice.  I'm just not sure how we stop everything they can throw at us if they are fully healthy.  But they certainly have holes we could take advantage of.

(02-17-2024, 03:27 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: This is as good a place as any to put something I was thinking about the other day...how do we compare to Denver.

Kyrie  - Murray
PJW   - Gordon
Green - KCP 

Luka/Lively - Jokic/MPJ

Denver's bench is fairly small with Jackson, Braun and Watson getting the most minutes and Nnaji/Jordan/Strawther being their main front court guys.  Compare that to Exum, THJ, DJJ, Maxi and Gafford.

I think we fairly easily win the bench contest.  I suspect most would hand them the advantage regarding Gordon/KCP over Green/PJW (though the similarities here are interesting).  Green probably won't win a DPOY award, but he's also not 31 (and KCP might not match Green's TS% or 3% for a series).  We can probably argue for days about Kyrie/Murray and the combo's involving Luka/Lively and Jokic/MPJ (since our stars play different positions, I combined them with the opposite at that position).

I think it is important to note that the comparison isn't really about Luka vs Jokic or Green vs KCP.  It is really about what the other team can do to neutralize the other.  Is Dallas better equipped to stop Jokic with Lively and Gafford and Maxi or is Denver better equipped to neutralize Luka with Gordon (and who?).  The cross matches matter too.  Green and KCP won't be guarding each other.  Green (or Exum or DJJ) will largely get Murray and KCP will largely get Kyrie.  Who will the other team target for switches (probably Kyrie and Murray) and do their teams have the schemes to protect the disadvantage gained in such a switch.

When you start to look at it as team against team rather than "PJW sucks and he isn't nearly as good as Gordon" type commentary, I start to feel we aren't obviously doomed against Denver.  If everyone was 100% healthy, continuity and experience might win out.  But, I think it is close enough that a bump or bruise here or there might determine a series between these two.

Looking at the rest of the top teams in the West, I'm much less worried about Minnesota and OKC.  We can vary our lineups more than either and mitigate their strengths.  I'd probably want to avoid LAC if given the choice.  I'm just not sure how we stop everything they can throw at us if they are fully healthy.  But they certainly have holes we could take advantage of.

(02-17-2024, 10:49 AM)surfpuckmd Wrote: I hope we make no more major trades for at least one year.  I'd rather let the roster develop together.  Any major change should be a new head coach depending on what we do in the playoffs.

I also don't think we really need to target a 3rd-best player.  Lively already is our 3rd-best player and will be only continue to improve.  

If we target a 4th-best player, it should be an elite defensive player who is decent offensively.  Those players are less expensive to trade for and have smaller contracts than offensive stars.  

My strong preference though is to wait a year and watch how Hardy, Green, PJ Washington and OMax develop.  We also need to see if Exum can return and play at the same level as before the plantar fasciitis.  Each of those players might be the solutions to our roster.  We just need to see which ones improve with experience.