(12-28-2023, 04:59 AM)F Gump Wrote: We'll just have to agree to disagree whether using a 2nd to move off of Holmes is cheap or not, and whether getting that done via a deadline deal would be cheaper or not. And we'll also disagree on the pricing they faced when trying to dump McGee (I think if the cost had been merely a 2nd, they would have done it in a heartbeat, and that they were looking for that very sort of deal but couldn't find a taker).

I think the equation will be the same with Holmes as with McGee, ie he will NOT be a "useful filler" for some imagined trade, and if you can find a way to get him off your payroll, do it. They painted themselves into a corner with McGee, until they just ate his contract (but did so where it will handicap them for years). I don't want to see that happen again.

I would certainly PREFER a deadline move that lands a splashy upgrade, but I'm skeptical one is going to be out there. So I want to move Holmes' dead weight if we can. Find someone offering something good for THJ, Holmes, or both and I'm all in. But I'm not holding my breath.

(12-28-2023, 05:18 AM)omahen Wrote: No problem for me to accept you have a different view. Just a couple of more cost cutting moves this past summer:
- Bullock to SA for pick swap and 2 seconds coming back
- Collins to Utah, Atlanta received a second round pick
- Oladipo for 2 SRP
- Harris to Pistons for 2 SRP

Prime example from two seasons ago would be NY clearing cap space to sign Brunson

(12-27-2023, 03:44 PM)F Gump Wrote: I know that we have heard "several contenders interested" in Olynyk. Supposedly. I take that as an Ainge declaration to try to drum up interest, frankly.

I have no issue with moving Hardy, but others may. I've never been all that impressed with his shoot-at-all-costs and no-defense profile, and not sure he wants to work to truly change. And for a guy who wants to shoot every time, he's not very good at it, which is cringe-worthy stuff.

I wouldn't give much of anything for Drummond. To me a pick is too expensive a price. He's always been a guy whose stats are more attractive than his actual play.

I'm really hoping for a way to turn Holmes into an expiring, and to perhaps get some short-term use from the expiring.

(12-28-2023, 05:41 AM)F Gump Wrote: I'm not sure what your point is. Teams sell players, other teams buy them, part of the transaction may be a shift in cap room from one team to another, and player value may go the other way. 2nds are little pieces that get attached going this way or that. I'm not sure any of this would be an example of a salary dump that's cheaper than a single 2nd (which was the whole point, to be doing something when the prices are super low).

And just finding a deal with a 2nd going one way or the other doesn't seem really meaningful or necessarily parallel to me (much less 2, in some of those examples). Some of these teams were paying to get the player, and I don't anticipate anyone giving the Mavs some 2nds for Holmes, but if you have that lined up, I'm in.

What was that McGee deal that you keep alluding to, that you say the Mavs turned down, where it was a salary dump of his contract for a 2nd or less? Dumping McGee (or being able to do so) would be a great comp, but I don't recall any such offer being declined by Mavs at a price of a 2nd or less.

(12-28-2023, 12:31 PM)omahen Wrote: Perhaps just to try to really clearly make my point:
1. Some might think a fringe move like Holmes and couple of seconds for a back-up makes this team serious contender. I don't. Agree to disagree, no problem with that.
2. I don't agree Mavs need to make a move at TDL to have flexibility in the summer. I think it gives them less flexibility because it will cost assets and because they will lose an expiring salary for 2025. I don't think there is any problem to shave salaries to free the full MLE in the summer, if that is what they wish and need. At this point we don't even know, if full MLE is needed to keep DJJ (might take less or someone might offer more than that).

(12-28-2023, 01:14 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Some of your word choices feel like we are having a conversation with a high school debate team captain. Just narrowly define your parameters and you can’t lose.  

Is a backup center a “fringe move” or adding a “critical element to the defense”.  And who are these “true contenders”?  Is there a rule somewhere that says they are the only ones who can try to improve their team?  If you aren’t on a 60 win pace, should you be a seller?  I’ve shown a move that helps “fill a critical need” for multiple years in Richards.  Are those OK for teams that aren’t “true”?

I don’t agree that Hardy and a second or two ruins plans/opportunities for the summer.  In fact, the standard isn’t to have flexibility.  It is to have a path.  If someone like OG wants to come here it will be mostly about the picks.  Between THJ and GWill and Green ect ect, we’ll be able to have a path.

(12-28-2023, 02:50 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: Just a note. TDL is Feb 8. That’s a month and a few days, not 2 months. Not even positive Maxi will be back by then. Devin Harris had lots of toe injuries that kept him out for extended stretches. They are being very tight lipped on timelines for injured players.

(12-28-2023, 02:52 PM)omahen Wrote: Miscalculated, thanks for the note. One month less before some moves are made around the league

(12-28-2023, 03:06 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: Ya, I think things will start heating up after the holidays are over. The month of January will be rumors galore.

(12-28-2023, 03:17 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: That's interesting. Basically, the in-season tournament gets us to the trade deadline rumor season, which gets us to the all star break, which gets us to the stretch run, which gets us to the playoffs. 

I was kind of surprised at how quickly the in-season played out, but this is pretty smart.

(12-28-2023, 12:10 PM)omahen Wrote: If you think getting an expiring contract at TDL is so important, I would be much more open to move Maxi than Holmes. If Maxi is unavailable and just generally washed, we have no use for him as it is and getting rid of his remaining years would be beneficial. If Maxi returns to his best version of him, we don't need a back-up center anyway. Mavs have two months to figure that out.

(12-29-2023, 11:50 AM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: I’ve been curious as to what has more value. Holmes because his contract is up sooner or Maxi because there’s a small chance he could come back and help on the basketball court. I’m ok pairing either up with Hardy/2nd to get a backup center but been wondering how other gms would be looking at those two.

(12-29-2023, 04:57 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Man, Chicago, I know you didn't ask me and that I should just button up and stay quiet, but I can't.

Poetl is generally overrated, imo. He's pretty mediocre, and unless I'm way wrong about his game, he's not really even the type of center Dallas can play. I don't think he's nearly as good of a fit as Lively here, and there's almost no way they have enough role for both of them, especially in the important games. Finally, he is guaranteed almost $20 million per season for the next FOUR YEARS, the last of which is a freaking player option, lol.

NO, THANK YOU.