(09-28-2023, 01:10 PM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: https://clutchpoints.com/rumor-suns-mavs-nearly-completed-deandre-ayton-trade-during-2023-nba-draft

Story on Marc Stein's reporting back in late June.

(09-28-2023, 01:18 PM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: I mean, I'm not trying to say it's true or not.  Just that it was reported back around the time free agency started by Stein (and I want to say Chris Haynes also confirmed the rumor on their podcast).  I feel like there was plenty of discussion about it at the time on this board, would be surprised if there wasn't considering how many folks on here share news from Stein's substack but maybe it just flew under the radar.  I certainly remember being shocked we wouldn't simply remove Javale from the package if that's all it took which speaks to your point about red flags around Ayton.  Funny looking back at it now since we ended up stretch waiving Javale anyway.

(09-28-2023, 01:21 PM)omahen Wrote: I thought that it can't be true because of the JaVale part. That something like that can't be a hold up if you think there is value in him. If you think there is not, you don't consider him at all, imho

(09-28-2023, 01:27 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: Also Ayton has re-trade value. You do that trade just based on Ayton´s value for rebuilding teams. His contract is also only one year longer than THJ/Holmes, too. Maybe it was Cuban being very cheap again. 

(09-29-2023, 10:02 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: MacMahon, on the latest episode of the hoop collective, outright stated AGAIN that “PHX was willing to trade Ayton for Tim Hardaway Jr and Rahsaan Holmes on draft night.” That’s a direct quote, and wasn’t questioned by Windhorst or Bontemps.

I think the Mavs really killed that deal because the Suns wouldn’t also accept McGee’s contract.

(09-29-2023, 10:10 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: Well, I’m glad they didn’t make the trade right now. If he goes to Por and plays lights out, however, I will admit I was wrong on that one. I do think there is a decent chance that will happen too. With it being a draft day trade, the draft could have gone a completely different direction too (adding another good wing/SF talent at #12) which might have helped make that offseason timeline a success as well.

(09-29-2023, 10:10 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: Well, I’m glad they didn’t make the trade right now. If he goes to Por and plays lights out, however, I will admit I was wrong on that one. I do think there is a decent chance that will happen too. With it being a draft day trade, the draft could have gone a completely different direction too (adding another good wing/SF talent at #12) which might have helped make that offseason timeline a success as well.

(09-29-2023, 10:02 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: MacMahon, on the latest episode of the hoop collective, outright stated AGAIN that “PHX was willing to trade Ayton for Tim Hardaway Jr and Rahsaan Holmes on draft night.” That’s a direct quote, and wasn’t questioned by Windhorst or Bontemps.

I think the Mavs really killed that deal because the Suns wouldn’t also accept McGee’s contract.

(09-28-2023, 10:57 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: Anyone else hear Tim Macmahon on the hoop collective say Dallas could have had Ayton for THJ and Holmes over the summer?  Is that what he said or is it being reported wrong?

(09-29-2023, 03:30 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: Josh Primo signing a two way contract with the Clippers.  I felt he was overdrafted by San Antonio, from what I saw.  But that is a solid gamble on a guy who has run into some trouble.  Still very young.

(09-29-2023, 10:32 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: That is pretty interesting, if so.  Especially for two guys who are not in our long term plans.  I read also that PHX also wanted a pick and/or Green, so who knows.

Mavs were pretty clear this offseason that they wanted to totally rebuild their center rotation.  If Holmes is not a factor, they did not do that this offseason. 

I think an Ayton gamble would have been a solid roll of the dice...especially if that was the offer.

(09-30-2023, 06:11 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: That´s before you even get into the argument that Ayton is productive former #1 pick. They maintain re-trade value for at least one more trade. And there is a chance, with his seemingly good relationship with Luka, that he unlocks another gear and makes the Suns look dumb.

And if not you buy yourself time to develop Lively before you trade Ayton with a year left on his contract.

(09-30-2023, 06:11 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: I just don´t get what they are doing. It´s like they still don´t understand asset management at all.

if the Ayton deal goes through, here is the money allocated to the center rotation over the next two seasons:

Ayton 32.4 / 34.0
Lively 4.7 / 5.0
Powell 4.0 / 4.0
McGee 2.3 / 2.3
________
Totals: 41.4 / 45.3

If you apply the luxury tax threshold as the hard cap, it´s 25% and 26% for the positional salary.

Given what we are already locked into at PF....

Williams 12.4 / 13.0
Kleber 11.0 / 11.0
Omax 2.7 / 2.8
________
Totals 26.1 / 26.8

....you land bang on 40% of positional spending for the big positions.

That´s before you even get into the argument that Ayton is productive former #1 pick. They maintain re-trade value for at least one more trade. And there is a chance, with his seemingly good relationship with Luka, that he unlocks another gear and makes the Suns look dumb.

And if not you buy yourself time to develop Lively before you trade Ayton with a year left on his contract.

(09-30-2023, 07:43 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: You might be right. That POV is certainly not a rare one.

For me, I just don’t see ANY indication that he’ll be a good defender or a good complementary offensive player (at least not a content one). He seems to want a  featured role with post touches, yet I see no evidence of those being merited by skill.

I just don’t like the player he is or even the player he’s trying to become, really. There’s a chance he gets better in a new situation, sure, and that will make the price the Mavs walked away from look silly in a certain light. But, the downside is that you’d have to PLAY him and make PLAYSTYLE concessions to get there. I get why they’re not interested in that.