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+--- Thread: Trade & FA 2023-24: Stein-Ingram Trade Inevitable| LAL Want Lebron Back On Any Terms (/showthread.php?tid=2444)
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RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - KillerLeft - 07-16-2023
I’d be interested in the tax/apron ramifications of this Wood idea.
Do they have interest because they expect his contract to be so small that it won’t put them into the tax? In that case, the return would be verrrrrry small, but I could see that happening.
Or, does their interest lie more in the range of someone good enough to convince them to go into the tax (but still under Apron 1, obvs) like they were apparently willing to do for Thybulle? I don’t know how realistic I think it is that anyone wants Wood badly enough to give him that big of a contract, let alone give up something good enough for Dallas to put themselves into the tax just to help Wood and his new team. It would literally have to be something at least as good as Vanderbilt, and I just feel like that’s far-fetched.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - KillerLeft - 07-16-2023
Oh snap, Vanderbilt is much cheaper than I thought. That might be feasible as a wood contract, AND Dallas could probably stay under the tax.
Hmmmm…
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - KillerLeft - 07-16-2023
This paints a clearer picture, and it’s about what I expected. Screw that $9M, it would have to be a player they really liked to convince them to go into the TAX even, at this point.
https://twitter.com/samquinncbs/status/1680610281855098881?s=61&t=Zmns3TEXDYnIJIXeN05-eQ
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - KillerLeft - 07-16-2023
Yep!
https://twitter.com/Dc3daM/status/1680636695408943120?s=20
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - SleepingHero - 07-16-2023
(07-16-2023, 04:49 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Yep!
https://twitter.com/Dc3daM/status/1680636695408943120?s=20
Skyline Report (ATL news & rumors)
@Dc3daM
The Hawks are ready for it to be done so Siakam is here.
The Mavericks are ready for it to be done so they can get Clint Capela.
The Raptors fan base is ready for it to be done(trade or no trade) they are tired of hearing it.
Masai Ujiri…well, he’s just being stubborn ?
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - SleepingHero - 07-16-2023
(07-16-2023, 04:15 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Oh snap, Vanderbilt is much cheaper than I thought. That might be feasible as a wood contract, AND Dallas could probably stay under the tax.
Hmmmm…
The contract really lines up incredibly well. In fact Vando fits into the TPE perfectly (4.6 salary and TPE is 4.9).
Mavs are currently at $161,693,768 according to my excel sheet, which puts them $3,600,232 off the tax line. Vanderbilt would initially put them over the tax line, but a McGee S/W would put them right back under it by 2.2 mil.
New roster would be:
Luka/Curry/Exum
Kyrie/THJ/Hardy
Vando/Green
G-Will/Maxi/Omax
Holmes/Lively/Powell
Total roster salary: $163,005,812.
Heck, can even trade THJ for Capela and the new roster salary would be $165,724,084 and we'd be over the tax by 400k. Meaning, if the Mavs somehow find a way to throw McGee into the rumored Capela 3-teamer, AND do this hypothetical Vando SnT, we'd be able to have Capela+Vando while still staying under the tax:
Luka/Curry/Exum
Kyrie/Hardy
Vando/Green
G-Will/Maxi/Omax
Capela/Holmes/Lively/Powell
Total roster salary: $163,375,760
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - MFFL - 07-16-2023
If we get Capela for THJ, what are the chance we trade Maxi for Washington? I can see them interested in Maxi - a true pro with a very cost controlled contract
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - mvossman - 07-16-2023
(07-16-2023, 05:38 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: The contract really lines up incredibly well. In fact Vando fits into the TPE perfectly (4.6 salary and TPE is 4.9).
Mavs are currently at $161,693,768 according to my excel sheet, which puts them $3,600,232 off the tax line. Vanderbilt would initially put them over the tax line, but a McGee S/W would put them right back under it by 2.2 mil.
New roster would be:
Luka/Curry/Exum
Kyrie/THJ/Hardy
Vando/Green
G-Will/Maxi/Omax
Holmes/Lively/Powell
Total roster salary: $163,005,812.
Heck, can even trade THJ for Capela and the new roster salary would be $165,724,084 and we'd be over the tax by 400k. Meaning, if the Mavs somehow find a way to throw McGee into the rumored Capela 3-teamer, AND do this hypothetical Vando SnT, we'd be able to have Capela+Vando while still staying under the tax:
Luka/Curry/Exum
Kyrie/Hardy
Vando/Green
G-Will/Maxi/Omax
Capela/Holmes/Lively/Powell
Total roster salary: $163,375,760
Can't imagine LA has any interest in sending Vanderbilt out. It would surely cost assets. What are we willing to send out?
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - dirkfansince1998 - 07-16-2023
(07-16-2023, 06:26 PM)mvossman Wrote: Can't imagine LA has any interest in sending Vanderbilt out. It would surely cost assets. What are we willing to send out?
Available 2nds. In my opinion another big forward would reduce the need for a center. Mavs could get away with more small ball without running out of steam by the allstar break (Tucker/RoCo Rockets). Would allow them to move Kleber to full time center.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - mvossman - 07-16-2023
(07-16-2023, 06:29 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: Available 2nds. In my opinion another big forward would reduce the need for a center. Mavs could get away with more small ball without running out of steam by the allstar break (Tucker/RoCo Rockets). Would allow them to move Kleber to full time center.
That would be my limit as well, but I doubt that gets it done. I do really like the idea of a Max/Vanderbilt backcourt.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - Smitty - 07-17-2023
(07-16-2023, 05:38 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: Luka/Curry/Exum
Kyrie/Hardy
Vando/Green
G-Will/Maxi/Omax
Capela/Holmes/Lively/Powell
Total roster salary: $163,375,760
This is beautiful. Who would have thought this was possible at the end of the year. A terrible roster and limited assets…. Things change quickly in the NBA. Lindsey was a great hire! I hope him and Nico can pull this off and cap off a great offseason!
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - DanSchwartzgan - 07-17-2023
(07-16-2023, 05:38 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: Mavs are currently at $161,693,768 according to my excel sheet, which puts them $3,600,232 off the tax line.teamer,
Just to clarify, with the Seth contract coming in smaller than expected. The room is now $4.1mm.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - DanSchwartzgan - 07-17-2023
(07-17-2023, 08:09 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Just to clarify, with the Seth contract coming in smaller than expected. The room is now $4.1mm.
BTW, I think this leads credence to the reporting on Killian and Bojan. It didn’t work under the tax when we thought Curry was making $4.5mm. Now it does. They can’t go right up to the tax as they have to give themselves a little space. Curry at $4.0mm does that.
I’m not sure why they waited until yesterday to sign OMax. That was odd to me. Surely he wasn’t going to be included in a trade after Nico’s statements about ‘making this happen’.
Even with Dallas doing all of its business on a 14 man roster, Stein still seems to think there is another move coming and THJ and McGee won’t be here. If they go out together, they can bring back $27.747mm ($17.897 + $5.34 + $4.1 = $27.747) and keep Dallas under the tax. If they go in a 2 for 1, you have to account for a minimum slot being added. It is also possible a smaller salary (like Hardy) could be added if it brings back the right player for a bit above the $27.747mm.
Since nothing has happened, it feels like anything that might happen is tied to the open Siakam, Lillard and Harden trades. Tyler Herro fits in the range we are talking about. So does Capela and OPJ. Now that we know all of the numbers and the high likelihood we will stay under the tax, it is easier to forecast what might or might not happen. BTW, I wouldn’t sleep on the possibility of Herro. If we wanted Bojan, we would probably be even more interested in Herro. I’d like the move, but I think it will be expensive as there apprears to be competition.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - SleepingHero - 07-17-2023
(07-17-2023, 08:45 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: BTW, I think this leads credence to the reporting on Killian and Bojan. It didn’t work under the tax when we thought Curry was making $4.5mm. Now it does. They can’t go right up to the tax as they have to give themselves a little space. Curry at $4.0mm does that.
I’m not sure why they waited until yesterday to sign OMax. That was odd to me. Surely he wasn’t going to be included in a trade after Nico’s statements about ‘making this happen’.
Even with Dallas doing all of its business on a 14 man roster, Stein still seems to think there is another move coming and THJ and McGee won’t be here. If they go out together, they can bring back $27.747mm ($17.897 + $5.34 + $4.1 = $27.747) and keep Dallas under the tax. If they go in a 2 for 1, you have to account for a minimum slot being added. It is also possible a smaller salary (like Hardy) could be added if it brings back the right player for a bit above the $27.747mm.
Since nothing has happened, it feels like anything that might happen is tied to the open Siakam, Lillard and Harden trades. Tyler Herro fits in the range we are talking about. So does Capela and OPJ. Now that we know all of the numbers and the high likelihood we will stay under the tax, it is easier to forecast what might or might not happen. BTW, I wouldn’t sleep on the possibility of Herro. If we wanted Bojan, we would probably be even more interested in Herro. I’d like the move, but I think it will be expensive as there apprears to be competition.
Herro at the minimum would cost an unprotected 1st that Miami is desperately searching for to bolster their Lillard package.
I don't see why the Mavs would pay that premium after just re-signing Kyrie, grabbing Seth, and ideally developing Hardy. Just doesn't make much sense to me.
Thank you for the contract clarification by the way. This means my hypothetical Wood for Vando SnT, then following up with a THJ for Capela (and a McGee S/W) still puts the team under the tax line. I'd much rather go this route (and pay a premium for it) than somehow finding a way for Herro or Bojan.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - myconsumerclub - 07-17-2023
Still got a spot to add on another player that gets cut at the TDL or end of training camp if it looks like a solid move.
Can always S/W Powell when you have 3 decent centers in Capella, Holmes, and Lively and how much would that save us in tax?
Vando would be beyond my expectations, I cannot see LA being so generous to a team that would be a potential contender that they might match up with in the PO's. They can just sign Wood outright why S&T for him.
Capella is a luxury as well. The bottom line is we could make adjustments to cover SF with GWill and still have Kleber and OMax to cover PF and we also have Holmes and Lively and if needed.
Kleber can pitch in some at the 5. If somehow we end up being stuck with THJ and McGee that extra offense from THJ is usable and McGee to me is a better option than using Powell. I think we could make use of McGee in certain matchups that might be much more problematic with undersized guys in there.
Lively is our only real center and so I would not want to go into the season without another big body to play against certain teams who have major talent at the 5 to throw at us. DEN, UTA, MINN, NOP, LA, LAC, SAC, OKC, SAN, PHO are better more prepared to dominate us inside and that is just in our conference.
Jokic/Huff, Kessler/OLynyk/Markkanen/Collins, KAT/Gobert/NAZ, Valanciunas, Davis/Hayes/Bron, Zubica/Plumlee, Sabonis/Len/Queta, Holmgren/Poku/Sarr, Wemby/Collins, Ayton/Durant
With Kleber next to Lively we are somewhat strong enough to play against these fronts but having another 7 big that can absorb some contact so we keep our smaller 5's from getting killed is a smart move IMHO.
Azabuike may be off the map since he is on Boston's SL team. Yurtseven is a young big that produced for Miami in some limited runs not seeing him getting picked up yet. Even Boban is a FA. Having McGee is a nice backstop now but if we add Capella and SW or trade him then a lack of size is a potential problem when Lively gets into foul trouble or injured for a long stretch. Powell Holmes and Capella are all undersized 5's.
I would love to take away that hole on defense by making a final move to add a big that has bulk and real center size just for purposes of making teams respect our interior defense more and to give us some fouls to use when a guy is not a good FT shooter.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - HoosierDaddyKid - 07-17-2023
https://twitter.com/FredKatz/status/1680651397476282368
Knicks not waving J Sims.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - mvossman - 07-17-2023
(07-17-2023, 07:34 AM)Smitty Wrote: This is beautiful. Who would have thought this was possible at the end of the year. A terrible roster and limited assets…. Things change quickly in the NBA. Lindsey was a great hire! I hope him and Nico can pull this off and cap off a great offseason!
Don't really see this happening, especially the Vandy part. Agree on Lindsey. Nico has been here a couple of years and his only positive move before this offseason is Hardy.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - mvossman - 07-17-2023
(07-17-2023, 08:57 AM)myconsumerclub Wrote: Can always S/W Powell when you have 3 decent centers in Capella, Holmes, and Lively and how much would that save us in tax?
They are not going to S/W Powell after just signing him, and at his tiny salary there would be no point anyways. The Powell hate on this board is over the top sometimes.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - HoosierDaddyKid - 07-17-2023
https://twitter.com/YossiGozlan/status/1680605324154372096
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24:Suns trade Payne to SAS, sign Bol Bol| Mavs don't mind a Wood SnT? - SleepingHero - 07-17-2023
(07-17-2023, 09:22 AM)mvossman Wrote: Don't really see this happening, especially the Vandy part. Agree on Lindsey. Nico has been here a couple of years and his only positive move before this offseason is Hardy.
The Vando part is definitely a longshot. I tried to preface it with a bunch of qualifiers that no one besides Wood/Lakers/Mavs could answer.
But my reading of the tea leaves is that while Vanderbilt was a great get for the Lakers, they are in no way tied to him. They just signed a "replacement" in Prince and they just committed a bunch of money to Rui. I can also see why they'd be very motivated for Wood. AD's health is always a risky thing to bet on, and Wood could fill that AD role (sans defense) pretty well.
In fact, the Lakers have 1 backup center. Their current roster is as follows:
D'Lo/Vincent
Reaves/Hood-Schifino/Christie
Lebron/Reddish/Lewis
Rui/Vando/Prince
Davis/Hayes
Hayes was just cut by NOP in the last year of his rookie deal and is a 1 dimensional center. Having Wood be a backup to AD makes a lot of sense. I agree that the Lakers could just sign Wood outright, but that only works if Wood agrees to a vet min deal. And I don't see why Wood would be motivated to sign a vet min deal to play backup on the Lakers. If anything it'd make more sense for him to go to any other team that will feature him to restore his value with that kind of contract.
To me, that explains why the Lakers would be at least interested in a SnT. That way they guarantee Wood wanting to be there, get him locked up on a 3 year value deal, and it only costs them Vanderbilt with no other assets at a position where they have depth.