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+--- Thread: Trade & FA 2023-24: Stein-Ingram Trade Inevitable| LAL Want Lebron Back On Any Terms (/showthread.php?tid=2444)
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RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - omahen - 07-10-2023
Indiana can offer salary relief as they still have some space left and expiring Buddy. It is a question of how much draft assets are they willing to throw in compared to competition. This is my opinion, not something I read
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - StrandedOnBeauboisHill - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 04:08 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: I'm a firm believer that when your two superstars are Luka/Kyrie, you go bigger at the 3 and 4:
*A Flex SF-PF at the 3 (someone like T.Eason)
--- GWill at the 4
*B Flex F-C at the 5 (someone like Z.Collins)
This said, could we use GWill as our POA defender? If so, I'd love to move Green, THJ, Holmes, Outgoing Wood, McGee, and perhaps 27FRP to acquire *A and *B.
Luka, Hardy
Kyrie, Curry
*A, OMax
G.Will, Maxi
*B, Powell, Lively
This gives us incredible flexibility in the future.
I would MUCH rather Hunter than Capella. From what I proposed earlier, Hunter becomes *A.
It was already mentioned by why wouldn't we simply be using Josh Green at the POA of attack and continue to use GWill the way that he has always been used off ball. You're also putting a lot of pressure on OMax in the scenario you've laid out here.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - F Gump - 07-10-2023
Patty Mills is a player for ATL not OKC.
About Siakam, and ATL --
1 ATL doesn't have any interest in a Mavs deal. They want Siakam.
2 So there's no DAL-ATL deal that would be brewing, unless it somehow helps move PS to the Hawks. Otherwise, we aren't of interest to them. Angles for how the Mavs get Capella or Hunter in a deal with ATL are meaningless, sad to say.
3 Other than doing what they can to get PS, didn't ATL already solve their roster issues when they sent Collins to UT?
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - ThisIStheYear - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 05:46 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: But a guy who guards guards is what the Mavs need.
Josh is the 4th best guard on the roster. He’s a nice piece but not for $17 million. I’d rather have a third wing, who can guard both guards and wings, than a 4th guard who can only guard guards. Or, I’d rather have a starting center (though I don’t think that’s as big a problem as most). What I’m really saying is that instead of paying Green a big salary, I’d like to upgrade him. Siakam is probably a pipe dream now, since I doubt we could beat the Hawks offer, but that would be a nice upgrade to Josh.
And regarding another comment, when DFS was traded, it seemed like Josh was forced to guard a lot of wings who were bigger than him, and he performed most poorly in that role. So, he guards guards, but then Hardy doesn’t get enough minutes. I just don’t think it’s optimal to have both of them. It’s just too small of a team.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - KillerLeft - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:34 PM)ThisIStheYear Wrote: Josh is the 4th best guard on the roster. He’s a nice piece but not for $17 million. I’d rather have a third wing, who can guard both guards and wings, than a 4th guard who can only guard guards. Or, I’d rather have a starting center (though I don’t think that’s as big a problem as most). What I’m really saying is that instead of paying Green a big salary, I’d like to upgrade him. Siakam is probably a pipe dream now, since I doubt we could beat the Hawks offer, but that would be a nice upgrade to Josh.
I don't get this. I think he starts, I think they're happy for him to start, and I think he's poised to have a really nice season. From where I'm sitting, I feel like he's one of the reasons for optimism. He can guard 3 positions at a high level, he can run in transition, handle the ball, is a good cutter, plays with infectious energy, is on Luka's timeline and most importantly I don't think he's going to get anywhere near the contract you suggest.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Chicagojk - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:34 PM)ThisIStheYear Wrote: Josh is the 4th best guard on the roster. He’s a nice piece but not for $17 million. I’d rather have a third wing, who can guard both guards and wings, than a 4th guard who can only guard guards. Or, I’d rather have a starting center (though I don’t think that’s as big a problem as most). What I’m really saying is that instead of paying Green a big salary, I’d like to upgrade him. Siakam is probably a pipe dream now, since I doubt we could beat the Hawks offer, but that would be a nice upgrade to Josh.
And regarding another comment, when DFS was traded, it seemed like Josh was forced to guard a lot of wings who were bigger than him, and he performed most poorly in that role. So, he guards guards, but then Hardy doesn’t get enough minutes. I just don’t think it’s optimal to have both of them. It’s just too small of a team.
Where did the 17 million come from? No way he has earned that. PJ washington wants that and Josh hasn't had that level of success. Grant Williams got what 13-14 per year? I would guess you could extend him probably a tad below the MLE right now. If you wait until next season and he improves, he is still a restricted free agent and that will probably limit the offers. Did I miss the 17 million mark? I just can't imagine that is his number at this stage.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - ItsGoTime - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:37 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I don't get this. I think he starts, I think they're happy for him to start, and I think he's poised to have a really nice season. From where I'm sitting, I feel like he's one of the reasons for optimism. He can guard 3 positions at a high level, he can run in transition, handle the ball, is a good cutter, plays with infectious energy, is on Luka's timeline and most importantly I don't think he's going to get anywhere near the contract you suggest.Exactly. Also, if a person actually thinks he is the 4th best G on the team, how can they also make the assumption that he will get paid so much?
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - ItsGoTime - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:41 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: Where did the 17 million come from? No way he has earned that. PJ washington wants that and Josh hasn't had that level of success. Grant Williams got what 13-14 per year? I would guess you could extend him probably a tad below the MLE right now. If you wait until next season and he improves, he is still a restricted free agent and that will probably limit the offers. Did I miss the 17 million mark? I just can't imagine that is his number at this stage.It was discussed a few weeks ago with people throwing out numbers all over the place, which actually makes a lot of sense, cause this season (if he doesn’t get extended) will seemingly fully set his price. That outlook is so wide any guess is as good as the next. However, if he plays like a $17M player next year????? Who doesn’t want that guy for $17M?
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - ItsGoTime - 07-10-2023
Heck, I’ll go as far with that as to say, if Hardy takes a huge step up and Green plays like a $17M player, even if Kyrie plays like he should I’d be all about getting a big return for him and going forward with Green and Hardy. So many games to be played between now and then though.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - mvossman - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:34 PM)ThisIStheYear Wrote: Josh is the 4th best guard on the roster. He’s a nice piece but not for $17 million. I’d rather have a third wing, who can guard both guards and wings, than a 4th guard who can only guard guards. Or, I’d rather have a starting center (though I don’t think that’s as big a problem as most). What I’m really saying is that instead of paying Green a big salary, I’d like to upgrade him. Siakam is probably a pipe dream now, since I doubt we could beat the Hawks offer, but that would be a nice upgrade to Josh.
And regarding another comment, when DFS was traded, it seemed like Josh was forced to guard a lot of wings who were bigger than him, and he performed most poorly in that role. So, he guards guards, but then Hardy doesn’t get enough minutes. I just don’t think it’s optimal to have both of them. It’s just too small of a team.
4th best guard? Luka is a forward. Williams is a wing. I am trying to think who are talking about other Kyrie. Hardy?
When Dorian was traded, we had no PF on the roster. Green did get stuck guarding much bigger than he should. He is a point of attack defender. The only one we have. That is where he makes sense.
I have no idea why folks keep bringing up that 17 mil number. His market right now is not anywhere near that. He is likely going to get an MLE level contract unless he completely blows up this season. I can promise that Grant Williams is more highly regarded than Josh Green and he just got paid a little over MLE.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - RDB - 07-10-2023
Let me preface this by saying all this off-season cap/trade/RFA/UFA stuff gives me tired head and I have little motivation to learn the specifics.
When does the Knicks pick become a 2nd? If Capella for ‘27 happens, does that pretty much solidify that we will keep our picks for the next few years and NY will most likely end up with a 2nd?
Could there some comfort in ensuring we keep our picks, which means we will get 2 drafted players with an extra year or two of development before ‘27 rolls around? Kind of a time value of money argument. I’m not making a case for or against, just asking what if? I also realize there is a chance NY may not get the pick without a move for Capella.
I don’t know what Capalla’s contract is but hopefully when ‘27 rolls around, Lively will be ready to take the reins and we will finally have a settled C position.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Ghost of Podkolzin - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:08 PM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: It was already mentioned by why wouldn't we simply be using Josh Green at the POA of attack and continue to use GWill the way that he has always been used off ball. You're also putting a lot of pressure on OMax in the scenario you've laid out here.
If you could refresh my memory on why GWill shouldn't be the POA, that'd be great. Admittedly, when it comes to X and Os, I'm infinitely more knowledgeable about offense.
Yup, I agree about putting too much pressure on OMax. I noticed that. I guess it all depends on what we get back for J.Green, Holmes, McGee, S&T Wood, and 27FRP. A Batuim-like player would be ideal.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Ghost of Podkolzin - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 06:34 PM)ThisIStheYear Wrote: Josh is the 4th best guard on the roster. He’s a nice piece but not for $17 million. I’d rather have a third wing, who can guard both guards and wings, than a 4th guard who can only guard guards. Or, I’d rather have a starting center (though I don’t think that’s as big a problem as most). What I’m really saying is that instead of paying Green a big salary, I’d like to upgrade him. Siakam is probably a pipe dream now, since I doubt we could beat the Hawks offer, but that would be a nice upgrade to Josh.
And regarding another comment, when DFS was traded, it seemed like Josh was forced to guard a lot of wings who were bigger than him, and he performed most poorly in that role. So, he guards guards, but then Hardy doesn’t get enough minutes. I just don’t think it’s optimal to have both of them. It’s just too small of a team.
I somewhat agree with this. One of the advantages to Luka is his size. If you go bigger at the 3 and 4, using a mobile flex F-C at the 5, you take full advantage of Luka's size advantage. By starting J.Green take away Luka's size advantage in that they can use their 3 to guard Luka. I think J.Green is perfect for what we need, but only at the 2 (where Kyrie is cemented). I'm all about trading J.Green for either a flex SF/PF or a flex F-C. With his age and contract, I think we can get back equal talent/age, but a better fitting part. Someone like Z.Collins as a flex F-C would be perfect.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - mvossman - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 07:20 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: If you could refresh my memory on why GWill shouldn't be the POA, that'd be great. Admittedly, when it comes to X and Os, I'm infinitely more knowledgeable about offense.
Yup, I agree about putting too much pressure on OMax. I noticed that. I guess it all depends on what we get back for J.Green, Holmes, McGee, S&T Wood, and 27FRP. A Batuim-like player would be ideal.
Grant is a big guy with a big ass. He can take on athletic forwards, but he is not the guy you want chasing around quick guards.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - dirkfansince1998 - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 07:20 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: If you could refresh my memory on why GWill shouldn't be the POA, that'd be great. Admittedly, when it comes to X and Os, I'm infinitely more knowledgeable about offense.
Yup, I agree about putting too much pressure on OMax. I noticed that. I guess it all depends on what we get back for J.Green, Holmes, McGee, S&T Wood, and 27FRP. A Batuim-like player would be ideal.
First of all. Teams need more than one legit perimeter defender. But more importantly is Kyrie going to guard Curry, Lillard, Morant and other elite scoring guards?
To simplify it (ignoring switches, pick and rolll...). Green defends the better PG/SG. Kyrie takes the easier matchup. GWill. defends the better SF/PF. Luka takes the easier matchup.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Ghost of Podkolzin - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 07:43 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: First of all. Teams need more than one legit perimeter defender. But more importantly is Kyrie going to guard Curry, Lillard, Morant and other elite scoring guards?
To simplify it (ignoring switches, pick and rolll...). Green defends the better PG/SG. Kyrie takes the easier matchup. GWill. defends the better SF/PF. Luka takes the easier matchup.
Thanks. Defense is not my forte.
So using DEN as an example defensively...
Green... KCP
G.Will... Gordon
Kyrie... Murray
Luka... MPJ
Powell et al... Jokic
To compare the two, we're lacking...
Green < KCP
G.Will < Gordon
Kyrie = Murray
Luka < MPJ
Powell et al <<< Jokic
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - omahen - 07-10-2023
Stewart got 64 mil for 4 more years. Seems a bit rich. What is Detroit going to do with all those centers?
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1678583307968344064
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Okstate819 - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 09:02 PM)omahen Wrote: Stewart got 64 mil for 4 more years. Seems a bit rich. What is Detroit going to do with all those centers?
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1678583307968344064
Strange deal. Overpay by almost double imo.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Mavs2021 - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 09:02 PM)omahen Wrote: Stewart got 64 mil for 4 more years. Seems a bit rich. What is Detroit going to do with all those centers?
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1678583307968344064
WTF. LOL. Did not expect that. That´s a lot of cash for 11/8 in 28 MPG on 44% shooting. Feels like literally every C under NBA contract could do that, if given 28 MPG, except maybe the Mavs centers. And they got Wiseman and Duren.
(07-10-2023, 09:02 PM)omahen Wrote: Stewart got 64 mil for 4 more years. Seems a bit rich. What is Detroit going to do with all those centers?
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1678583307968344064
Maybe had to pay him that much to make it a salary match with THJ.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: ATL wants Siakam?| PHI matches Reed deal - Chicagojk - 07-10-2023
(07-10-2023, 09:02 PM)omahen Wrote: Stewart got 64 mil for 4 more years. Seems a bit rich. What is Detroit going to do with all those centers?
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1678583307968344064
Detroit is going against the grain building an NBA roster. A ton of dinosaur centers and non shooters. Odd team.
Can Stewart play 4? I am a huge fan of Duren in time. I like Stewart as well. Just not sure what the plan is there.