+- MavsBoard (https://www.mavsboard.com)
+-- Forum: Boards (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Dallas Mavericks and the NBA (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=2)
+--- Thread: Trade & FA 2023-24: Stein-Ingram Trade Inevitable| LAL Want Lebron Back On Any Terms (/showthread.php?tid=2444)
Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
144
145
146
147
148
149
150
151
152
153
154
155
156
157
158
159
160
161
162
163
164
165
166
167
168
169
170
171
172
173
174
175
176
177
178
179
180
181
182
183
184
185
186
187
188
189
190
191
192
193
194
195
196
197
198
199
200
201
202
203
204
205
206
207
208
209
210
211
212
213
214
215
216
217
218
219
220
221
222
223
224
225
226
227
228
229
230
231
232
233
234
235
236
237
238
239
240
241
242
243
244
245
246
247
248
249
250
251
252
253
254
255
256
257
258
259
260
261
262
263
264
265
266
267
268
269
270
271
272
273
274
275
276
277
278
279
280
281
282
283
284
285
286
287
288
289
290
291
292
293
294
295
296
297
298
299
300
301
302
303
304
305
306
307
308
309
310
311
312
313
314
315
316
317
318
319
320
321
322
323
324
325
326
327
328
329
330
331
332
333
334
335
336
337
338
339
340
341
342
343
344
345
346
347
348
349
350
351
352
353
354
355
356
357
358
359
360
361
362
363
364
365
366
367
368
369
370
371
372
373
374
375
376
377
378
379
380
381
382
383
384
385
386
387
388
389
390
391
392
393
394
395
396
397
398
399
400
401
402
403
404
405
406
407
408
409
410
411
412
413
414
415
416
417
418
419
420
421
422
423
424
425
426
427
428
429
430
431
432
433
434
435
436
437
438
439
440
441
442
443
444
445
446
447
448
449
450
451
452
453
454
455
456
457
458
459
460
461
462
463
464
465
466
467
468
469
470
471
472
473
474
475
476
477
478
479
480
481
482
483
484
485
486
487
488
489
490
491
492
493
494
495
496
497
498
499
500
501
502
503
504
505
506
507
508
509
510
511
512
513
514
515
516
517
518
519
520
521
522
523
524
525
526
527
528
529
530
531
532
533
534
535
536
537
538
539
540
541
542
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - dirkfansince1998 - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 05:06 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: Have you seen our roster???? The core of our valuable players ready to play now is all guards (Kyrie, Green, Hardy) with Luka as a Point Forward. Lively is 3 years out from being a starter on a championship team. What you are proposing is a Luka exit plan.
Paying Green crazy money would be a huge mistake. IMO, we need to move him for a like talent with production that better fits our needs... Z.Collins.
Mavs made the WCF with Kleber/Powell. Kleber is still on the roster and the Mavs didn´t draft someone with the 12th pick to bench him for the entire season. Lively will get some minutes. Maybe they think that Holmes can resurrect his career. Maybe they need another guy for 10-20 minutes (Saric, Wagner, even Powell are more than enough for a role like this) but with limited assets they cannot overpay on one position as long as they still have holes in other areas.
There is no perfect fix all solution for all positions. Too many holes. Not enough assets. Going to take some time to undo the damage of past trades/offseasons. Mavs used the most valuable asset they had to draft a young big. Don´t think they can afford to invest even more valuable assets (giving up a young player like Green, use MLE) into the center position.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - mvossman - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 05:06 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: Have you seen our roster???? The core of our valuable players ready to play now is all guards (Kyrie, Green, Hardy) with Luka as a Point Forward. Lively is 3 years out from being a starter on a championship team. What you are proposing is a Luka exit plan.
Paying Green crazy money would be a huge mistake. IMO, we need to move him for a like talent with production that better fits our needs... Z.Collins.
I think folks need to calm down on the paying Green crazy money bit. Somebody posted one speculation and now everybody is worried that Green is about to get 70 mil. My guess is he will probably get extended in the MLE range, which is a perfectly reasonable price. Worst case he gets to restricted free agency. He is not the kind of player that teams will overbid for knowing that Mavs will probably have to match anyways.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - DanSchwartzgan - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 05:22 PM)mvossman Wrote: I think folks need to calm down on the paying Green crazy money bit. Somebody posted one speculation and now everybody is worried that Green is about to get 70 mil. My guess is he will probably get extended in the MLE range, which is a perfectly reasonable price. Worst case he gets to restricted free agency. He is not the kind of player that teams will overbid for knowing that Mavs will probably have to match anyways.
I think the Naz Reid contract is a good model for Josh.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - Ghost of Podkolzin - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 05:14 PM)dirkfansince1998 Wrote: Mavs made the WCF with Kleber/Powell. Kleber is still on the roster and the Mavs didn´t draft someone with the 12th pick to bench him for the entire season. Lively will get some minutes. Maybe they think that Holmes can resurrect his career. Maybe they need another guy for 10-20 minutes (Saric, Wagner, even Powell are more than enough for a role like this) but with limited assets they cannot overpay on one position as long as they still have holes in other areas.
There is no perfect fix all solution for all positions. Too many holes. Not enough assets. Going to take some time to undo the damage of past trades/offseasons. Mavs used the most valuable asset they had to draft a young big. Don´t think they can afford to invest even more valuable assets into the center position.
Talk about a straw man. When did I say to bench Lively all year? My comment was he is at least 3 years away from being a starter on a championship team.
The second part puzzles me. We used a draft pick that would have gone elsewhere had we not tanked. You make it sound like we mortgaged our future for Lively. He is a plus to what we have last year, without a minus in assets out.
All that said, Luka has a player option in 2026. So we have 3 years to be contending, and I'd argue we have more like a year, given Luka's frustration level last year. What you are proposing is the Luka Exit Strategy.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - Ghost of Podkolzin - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 05:24 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: I think the Naz Reid contract is a good model for Josh.
Agreed. I was exaggerating with "crazy money", but the notion we shouldn't invest in bigs but we have Lively boggles my mind when our most valuable assets are 3 guards with Luka at Point Forward.
IMO, signing Naz makes their 2nd most valuable asset expendable... KAT. I read somewhere KAT for D.Murray was rumored, which makes all the sense in the world for both franchises.
Minny:
Gobert
Naz
Ant
Murray
Conley
Atl:
Okongwu
KAT
Bey
Get a SG for Capela
Young
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - dirkfansince1998 - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 05:34 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: Talk about a straw man. When did I say to bench Lively all year? My comment was he is at least 3 years away from being a starter on a championship team.
The second part puzzles me. We used a draft pick that would have gone elsewhere had we not tanked. You make it sound like we mortgaged our future for Lively. He is a plus to what we have last year, without a minus in assets out.
All that said, Luka has a player option in 2026. So we have 3 years to be contending, and I'd argue we have more like a year, given Luka's frustration level last year. What you are proposing is the Luka Exit Strategy.
For real? Bitch and complain about a non-existent strawman and follow it up with a real strawman. Was the 10th pick the most valuable asset this summer? Of course. Knowing about the shortcomings of the team. How did they use the most valuable asset? They added a young big. No win now move. Didn´t trade the pick for a guy that would most likely be more useful next season.
One last time. Lively is going to play center minutes next season. Just like Kleber. They still have Holmes that could get a couple of minutes. They could bring back Powell or sign a cheap big for the BAE instead of giving up the only above average point of attack defender on the roster.
If you need another opinion you might want to look at todays presser. Kidd was pretty vocal about the Mavs young core. Including Green. Basically only talked about the five youngsters (including Luka) and Kyrie.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - Jakeospikez - 06-26-2023
I don't see Lively as a 3 year project. His defensive awareness and rim protection wasn't raw at all. His shooting to spread the floor is likely a 3+ year project but he can start before then, hopefully early mid season like Kessler did. Future starting lineup is probably Luka/Kyrie/Green/OMax/Lively. Going off of Dinwiddie's description of how the defense was set up, Green POA for defending small guys like Ja/Curry, OMax for defending bigger PFs like Giannis to keep Luka/Kyrie fresh. Not sure how long it will take OMax to develop his shot but it wasn't that great in college so it may take awhile. Stretch 4 big wing right now is obviously the biggest need in FA since there's only Maxi for that role until OMax develops his shot. Backup 3 could be a huge need but depends on what happens to THJ/Bullock. THJ is probably fine as backup 3 for now, not sure if it's better to deal him now or when he's more valuable as an expiring this TDL/next offseason. I think the remaining moves are either upside players that are backups for now or vet stopgaps, don't really need to do anything crazy to impede playtime of the rookies and get long term guys that would bark if they're not a starter. Maybe a long term starting big wing is the proper target if they view OMax as a years away though I suppose.
Zach Collins issue isn't talent, guy is from the same glass shop as KP when it comes to injuries.
https://hoopshype.com/storyline/zach-collins-injury/
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - dirkfansince1998 - 06-26-2023
https://twitter.com/ChrisBHaynes/status/1673365594635382784
Suns basically have to rebuild the entire roster. Unless they can find 5-6 vet min ring chasers they won´t have an depth.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Cool down on Grant McMahon says - Jym - 06-26-2023
Stole this from the discord a moment ago.
Yeah we need to figure out a way to dump Bullock
![[Image: IMG_0241.png]](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/784811934146232352/1123094453595426856/IMG_0241.png)
RE: MAVS NEWS: Lively to wear #2, OMax #18, THJ #10...Kyrie #11? - SleepingHero - 06-26-2023
Quote:https://streamable.com/fx59ve
[Chris Haynes] The Dallas Mavericks recently made a serious play for DeAndre Ayton, but the package was not approved by Phoenix
Quote:https://twitter.com/BibsCorner/status/1673444051293446145?s=20
@mavsmarie Tim, Holmes, Mcgee per #Sources. Suns wanted Mcgee out of the deal for money reasons and Mavs wanted him in the deal for money reasons.
Take this as a grain of salt.
Still, I'd rather get Ayton and S/W McGee if that's all it takes.
RE: MAVS NEWS: Lively to wear #2, OMax #18, THJ #10...Kyrie #11? - KillerLeft - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:10 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: Take this as a grain of salt.
Still, I'd rather get Ayton and S/W McGee if that's all it takes.
Kill me.
RE: MAVS NEWS: Lively to wear #2, OMax #18, THJ #10...Kyrie #11? - SleepingHero - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:13 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Kill me.
You're going to learn to love Dominayton
RE: MAVS NEWS: Lively to wear #2, OMax #18, THJ #10...Kyrie #11? - KillerLeft - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:19 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: You're going to learn to love Dominayton
Nah, I like players who can run, change direction, defend and play with heart, not ones who have to watch the last few minutes of important games from the bench.
RE: MAVS NEWS: Lively to wear #2, OMax #18, THJ #10...Kyrie #11? - BigDirk41 - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:10 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: Take this as a grain of salt.
Still, I'd rather get Ayton and S/W McGee if that's all it takes.
I'm so glad that trade didn't happen. Lucky Mavs.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Mavs tried to trade for Ayton? - Jym - 06-26-2023
Ayton made more sense when we were desperate.
The MBT shouldn't feel desperate now
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Mavs tried to trade for Ayton? - SleepingHero - 06-26-2023
I think y'all are overlooking a very real reality where Lively isn't ready, Holmes is shot, and we're stuck with McGee starting every night and playing 20mpg.
Ayton, for all of his flaws (and there really aren't a lot of them), would solidify the center position and provide Lively ample time to grow into his role. If Lively is more ready than what is previously thought, then you hit and are playing with house money given that Ayton only cost THJ+Holmes. Each year that passes is another year that is easier to move Ayton should Lively overtake him in the rotation.
In the meantime, you're adding one of 6 centers in the league that averaged 18/10. Has real playoff experience being a starter for a team that went to the finals, and isn't some slow plodding center.
Does he have motivation issues? There is a lot of evidence that he does. But there are also a lot of explanations as to why. I'd much rather run the risk of Ayton being unmotivated 50% max of the time (and have Lively cover the gaps), than hope Holmes can bounce back.
Also, THJ+Holmes is just the cost??? That's it??? I mean c'mon. That's practically free. Holmes wasn't apart of the roster last year and THJ is a great role player but isn't integral at all as evidence of the WCF run where the team didn't miss him for a single game.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Mavs tried to trade for Ayton? - KillerLeft - 06-26-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:51 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: I think y'all are overlooking a very real reality where Lively isn't ready, Holmes is shot, and we're stuck with McGee starting every night and playing 20mpg.
I think you are overlooking the very real reality where Ayton suuuuuuuuuucks.
I’d rather they pick a center at random from among the posters in this community.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Mavs tried to trade for Ayton? - cow - 06-27-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:57 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I think you are overlooking the very real reality where Ayton suuuuuuuuuucks.
I’d rather they pick a center at random from among the posters in this community.
Time to see if Dwight Howard's Taiwanese three ball translates to the NBA! Cuban can recycle "the cartoon" and pretend he was right all along.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Mavs tried to trade for Ayton? - SleepingHero - 06-27-2023
(06-26-2023, 11:57 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I think you are overlooking the very real reality where Ayton suuuuuuuuuucks.
I’d rather they pick a center at random from among the posters in this community.
Your Ayton hate is blinding you. He is a legit center. He has a proven track record of winning and being successful in the playoffs. He absolutely doesn't suck and the stats back me up on that.
The eye test shows a talented dude that sometimes goes through the motions.
In the even the Mavs trade for Ayton I cannot wait for him to prove you wrong.
RE: Trade & FA 2023-24: Collins to UTA for Gay+2nd| Mavs tried to trade for Ayton? - cow - 06-27-2023
(06-27-2023, 12:03 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: ...that sometimes goes through the motions.
$32,459,438
$34,005,126
$35,550,814