(06-25-2023, 05:21 AM)Branduil Wrote: True, but two things to consider:

1) George's contract has only two years left, with a player option next offseason. So you can evaluate how to go forward after this season.
2) Imagine a scenario where
a) The Luka/Kyrie fit is still bad, AND
b) Hardy takes a big leap and now looks like someone who could start
So now you're stuck in a situation where Hardy deserves a starting spot, but can't be on the floor with Kyrie, who is still a bad fit. Trading Kyrie for Paul George would allow you to try out a Luka/Hardy/Green/PG3/C lineup with strong two-way potential, and now you basically enter a two-year transition window where you can try to win with Luka + PG3 while the young players develop.

There's a lot of ifs, but I don't think it's the most unlikely scenario that we end up in a bad place again with Luka + Kyrie.

(06-24-2023, 03:40 AM)Dundalis Wrote: I'd start with 1+1 as opener then offer him 2 years with a team option for a 3rd, and he can take it or leave it, and see if he can find a team with max cap space thats not a bottom feeder, but will actually want to spend max money on a 30 year old headcase PG for 4-5 years.

(06-25-2023, 02:02 AM)Dundalis Wrote: Both Nico and Cuban clearly intimated they would love to resign Kyrie, but either said it's not Kyrie or bust (Cuban), then Nico stated on the radio that while they want to resign Kyrie, they have now brought in players that will work regardless of whether he comes back or not. You can treat these comments as nothing, but this is NOT what you see from a FO that is planning to ensure a star resigns at all costs (it's night and day compared to Cuban's definitive contract extension comments after trading for KP for example, before KP had even stepped on the court).

Luka wearing himself out has zero to do with how he's used (or at least much less than people keep harping on about) and everything to do with his conditioning. That's on him, no one else. Kyrie's TOP was not any greater than Dinwiddie's, or Brunson's before him. Luka has had guys take ball handling duties away from him well before Kyrie, and could have taken more off him, but HE wants the ball in his hands more often than not, no matter who's playing with him, Kyrie or otherwise.

At this point team success with Kyrie is purely assumed. Because the evidence is we had more success without him. Now I'm not saying Kyrie makes this team worse, but IMO a lot of what Kyrie does offensively is at least partially offset by the disadvantage of a small 6'2 guard defensively, and it has knock on effects. He also has off court issues that you simply can't ignore. We lock ourselves into a long term deal with Kyrie at our absolute peril IMO, his history is clear cut, the FO can think what they want, but the above comments give me hope they aren't going into the negotiations with absolute blinders on thinking that it's Kyrie or bust, because it simply isn't, and a WCF without him should at least be a partial indication of that.

(06-25-2023, 09:13 AM)Jason Terry Wrote: Grant and Middleton are big fish I’m keeping an eye on. Draymond too but i think SAC would be the spot. I’m not sure that we’re quite ready for the big move, but we’ll see.

Vucevic MLE if the top targets (Brown, McDaniels, Brooks) sign elsewhere?

Hardaway for Fultz straight up? Isaac if we sign Brown?

Reggie for Boucher? Monte Morris?

I see a path for 2 quality players to be added without touching future draft assets. I think nailing these last moves would complete a perfect offseason

(06-25-2023, 02:02 AM)Dundalis Wrote: At this point team success with Kyrie is purely assumed. Because the evidence is we had more success without him. Now I'm not saying Kyrie makes this team worse, but IMO a lot of what Kyrie does offensively is at least partially offset by the disadvantage of a small 6'2 guard defensively, and it has knock on effects. He also has off court issues that you simply can't ignore. We lock ourselves into a long term deal with Kyrie at our absolute peril IMO, his history is clear cut, the FO can think what they want, but the above comments give me hope they aren't going into the negotiations with absolute blinders on thinking that it's Kyrie or bust, because it simply isn't, and a WCF without him should at least be a partial indication of that.

(06-25-2023, 12:20 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: Honestly incredible points but I do want to suggest that I think you're underrating Kyrie's offense.

Kyrie as a 6'2 guard has been one of the most efficient offensive players of all time. In fact, running a Kyrie Irving iso play has been the 12th most efficient play of the last 15 years. This year he had 247 possessions and a whopping 1.28ppp on isolations. If he qualified for possessions it'd be just behind a Steph offball screen with KD on his team.

https://twitter.com/CrumpledJumper/status/1666982537695215617?s=20

That kind of offensive firepower has never been on our team. Even Brunson at his peak this year hasn't come close (1.10ppp). 

Just framing Kyrie's offensive brilliance. I do agree giving him an extension would be a perilous endeavor and his reputation precedes him. Where I diverge is if the Mavs fail to turn Kyrie into 2-3 rotation players, then they're pretty F'd. I'd rather they negotiate from a position of leverage, get Kyrie on a ~40 mil deal, and see how it works out. If it works then they're in the green and they just have to pray Kyrie doesn't be Kyrie. If it doesn't then they can flip him to the highest bidder.

(06-25-2023, 01:48 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: https://twitter.com/legionhoops/status/1673038921612275713?s=12&t=XdhFFilhK6jh_QyYOUcCeg

Dillon Brooks is believed to be looking for over $12M/year in free agency, per @TheSteinLine

Too high, too low, just right?

(06-25-2023, 02:02 PM)mvossman Wrote: MLE sounds about right.  I like Brown better.

(06-25-2023, 01:48 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: https://twitter.com/legionhoops/status/1673038921612275713?s=12&t=XdhFFilhK6jh_QyYOUcCeg

Dillon Brooks is believed to be looking for over $12M/year in free agency, per @TheSteinLine

Too high, too low, just right?

(06-25-2023, 02:17 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Under no circumstances can the Mavs bring Brooks onto this team.

(06-25-2023, 01:18 PM)cow Wrote: I honestly loved what I saw from Kyrie when Luka was out last year.  He runs the offense is such a way that he almost forces others to be involved.

(06-25-2023, 01:48 PM)SleepingHero Wrote: https://twitter.com/legionhoops/status/1673038921612275713?s=12&t=XdhFFilhK6jh_QyYOUcCeg

Dillon Brooks is believed to be looking for over $12M/year in free agency, per @TheSteinLine

Too high, too low, just right?

(06-25-2023, 02:24 PM)soog Wrote: I have been a Kyrie hater but I was very impressed by what I saw last year. He made everyone around him better. I hate to say it but based on the eye test the team ran better when he was on the court than when Luka was… Anyone have the on/off numbers between Luka and Kyrie post trade?

(06-25-2023, 03:25 PM)loki Wrote: Click

This is for the entire year. You can check the box for "Only include stats from games in which all players selected played" and it's pretty brutal for Luka, although the sample size is tiny.