(06-02-2024, 03:59 PM)F Gump Wrote: I think the best way to lose DJJ is a THJ trade in June whose end result is someone else getting bigger money, and taking minutes. And then DJJ is offered the leftovers in July.

I think that if DJJ is the priority, he has to be treated that way. Resolve his situation with an agreement that is a TxMLE, or with an agreement that getting $__M to pay him is acceptable to him, and keeping him in the loop all the way.

I think THJ gets traded rather than kept. I have no feel for what that will look like, or what it will cost 

(06-02-2024, 06:38 PM)Jakeospikez Wrote: I wouldn't say Green can replace DJJ atm. Isn't what most complain about with Green other than the screen navigation stuff his size? He can guard 1-3. DJJ easily guards 1-4 and has the athleticism to block a KD jumper at its apex which is like a top 1% no one ever does that to him type of thing.   

I think DJJ would stay here on a NT MLE deal over taking slightly more from another team. I think DJJ has proven himself as a shooter already enough that teams won't completely abandon him like a Giddey which is sufficient. DJJ still has room for development too, he's worth keeping.

(06-02-2024, 07:12 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: As for Green, I like him, too, but it's more and more frustrating to me that he can't seem to find a toehold on the team. On one hand, he has emerged from the swamp of THJ/Exum as the most useful backup wing on the team this season, but on the other, I'm not seeing a clear, difference making role for him, and while yes, he's 23, he has been here a WHILE. It's just tiring.

(06-04-2024, 07:56 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Just to keep straight what I said....

I didn't advocate that Josh should replace DJJ.  I said I'd rather get value for THJ (and have Josh take on the DJJ role) than simply burn the THJ expiring (and maybe a pick) just to stand still.  It isn't about Josh vs. DJJ.  It is about Josh/Player X vs. DJJ/THJ.

As to what DJJ 'would' do, put yourself in his place.  He took a pay cut (and smaller contract than he'd had in years) to set himself up for this summer.  He chose well and his plan worked.  So, his choice now is to take a guaranteed $10mm ($5 this year and $5 next if things go south) and hope things continue to go well (and he's certainly seen things not go well in his career).  The payoff is a year from now he can get a contract that is roughly an NT MLE contract (average salary vs the actual MLE).  OR, he can get that $40mm or $50mm deal right now from someone else.  If such a deal is out there, he'd be an idiot not to take it.  Despite what we fans think people would/should do out of loyalty or fit, this is a business.  Jones and his agent are looking for the best financial situation they can get.  He may be 'open' to returning (exactly what an agent would tell him to say).  But that guarantees nothing if someone else is offering an extra $30-$40mm right now.

(06-04-2024, 08:15 AM)Smitty Wrote: You said it feels like he isn't playing much in the playoffs but he's played in all 17 games, averaging 18 MPG and had the best DefRTG on the team in the WCF... At age 23.

(06-04-2024, 07:51 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: 1 The good news is under the new rules Dallas will largely know where it stands with DJJ during the period of time a June deal would be done.  We've all experienced the reality that nothing is done until its done, but Dallas and Jones Jr. could come to an agreement in June while Dallas is also getting good value for THJ. 
2 You have been as big an advocate as anyone that .  If true, I'm not sure a THJ trade 'has' to change that..

(06-04-2024, 11:36 AM)Mavs2021 Wrote: .... or do they have to stretch-waive THJ. 

(06-04-2024, 11:12 AM)F Gump Wrote: One thing that doesn't get enough attention in these discussions is the issue of minutes. That's especially true when we think of THJ being used to bring back a useful player - ideally, one who can provide offense off the bench (one example would be Bogdanovic in ATL).

If they do that, who sits so that BB plays? Because trading THJ doesn't open up any minutes, since he isn't getting any.

When all are healthy, this is where they are in minutes next season
C - Gafford-Lively take all 48, and DP is the veteran backup
PF - PJW-Maxi take all 48, and can Omax force his way onto the floor? Morris is your DC (Designated Cheerleader)  ... even if you limit Maxi to 20-22, PJW is only playing 26-28.
SF - DJJ-Green
SG - Kyrie-Hardy
PG - Luka-Exum

It looks to me like their ideal move is to pay the price to trade THJ into space. That then leaves 2 open roster slots (Lawson may get one of them). And it lowers their payroll significantly.

(06-04-2024, 11:53 AM)F Gump Wrote: I don't think this option is a real back door, because I don't see it as tenable. 

It only gets them about 9M for DJJ, so it's uncertain if that would work for their needs in 2024.

But even more problematic is that a SW creates real payroll issues in future years, by having a significant chunk of dead money in 2026 when all of Luke, Ky, PJW, Gafford, and Maxi are up for new contracts and there may be sizable raises busting Aprons. Like most teams, they are probably going to be very averse to busting the 2nd Apron with its ensuing restrictions and penalties. Reducing that amount of possible payroll by 5.4M (after already having 2.2M sliced off, from McGee) would be a real issue.

I think they would opt to up the ante on what they will do to be rid of THJ before opting for a SW. Or DJJ will opt to stay at TxMLE, if the cost is exorbitant. Hopefully their negotiators have the skill to get where they need to go, at a reasonable price.

(06-04-2024, 01:55 PM)omahen Wrote: The question about minutes is, would there be more available if a good third option (6th man) would be here. Would Luka and Kyrie play less? Otherwise it is I think obvious that this new guy would take most of Green/Hardy/Exum playoff minutes and our playoff bench rotation would mostly be a center, Maxi and new guy. During regular season, there will always be minutes for Hardy, Exum and Green due to injuries and less playing time by the core rotation.

If there is a viable 6th man option, then I wouldn't worry about Green/Exum and Hardy minutes. Just go for it.

(06-04-2024, 02:45 PM)mvossman Wrote: If the trade for a 6th man involves letting DJJ walk, is this still your view?  I feel like that move will make us thin on POA defenders as well as probably making us smaller and older.  It also seems to directly block Hardy.  That player would have to be significantly better than DJJ for this to make sense.

(06-04-2024, 02:51 PM)omahen Wrote: No, "my" main move is to resign DJJ. 6th man is the move to consider after that if there is room/assets left to do it. FGump was operating with an assumption, that we convince DJJ to sign a tMLE 1+1 deal. In that case I would look hard to upgrade THJ and if needed even additional salary for the right 6th man.

(06-04-2024, 02:59 PM)mvossman Wrote: This might be a timing issue?  His post ended with two ideas (which are not on your response), both involved paying DJJ significantly more than tax MLE.

(06-04-2024, 01:55 PM)omahen Wrote: The question about minutes is, would there be more available if a good third option (6th man) would be here. Would Luka and Kyrie play less? Otherwise it is I think obvious that this new guy would take most of Green/Hardy/Exum playoff minutes and our playoff bench rotation would mostly be a center, Maxi and new guy. During regular season, there will always be minutes for Hardy, Exum and Green due to injuries and less playing time by the core rotation.

If there is a viable 6th man option, then I wouldn't worry about Green/Exum and Hardy minutes. Just go for it.

(06-04-2024, 02:45 PM)mvossman Wrote: If the trade for a 6th man involves letting DJJ walk, is this still your view?  I feel like that move will make us thin on POA defenders as well as probably making us smaller and older.  It also seems to directly block Hardy.  That player would have to be significantly better than DJJ for this to make sense.