GameThread: The Preseason Trilogy: DAL (2-1) 127 vs. MIN (1-2) Boban 3pt Marksman

[fifteenth]

Maxi is what we all want Powell to be.

If you want Powell to be Maxi then that explains why you dislike Powell so much. He'll never be Maxi. When he was dialed in, playing well, and a big part of really productive lineups last season he wasn't Maxi.

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And also, Maxi has never been THAT Powell

[embellisher]

this last minute gets a WTF SMH LOL all at once

Carlisle is so fucking funny

As somebody said in the discord chat, that was RC saying no 2nd OT. We either win or lose on the last shot.

[SleepingHero]

If you want Powell to be Maxi then that explains why you dislike Powell so much. He'll never be Maxi. When he was dialed in, playing well, and a big part of really productive lineups last season he wasn't Maxi.

I don't want Powell to be Maxi. I want Powell to be able to defend just a tiny bit. He cannot. He's never been able to. He's worse than ever.

And since Powell wants to shoot threes, I wish he'd be able to actually hit any of them. He cannot. So you're right. Powell will never be Maxi. And that's why he should never get more than 15 minutes a game in the best case scenarios.

[fifteenth]

I don't want Powell to be Maxi. I want Powell to be able to defend just a tiny bit. He cannot. He's never been able to. He's worse than ever.

And since Powell wants to shoot threes, I wish he'd be able to actually hit any of them. He cannot. So you're right. Powell will never be Maxi. And that's why he should never get more than 15 minutes a game in the best case scenarios.

So, if you hated Powell's game when he was healthy then there is probably no point in this conversation. But the Mavs, and a few Mavs fans, thought that Powell had something to offer, and the Mavs built lineups that worked really well, offensive and defensively with healthy Powell. That being the case, should they try to use the preseason to allow him to see if he can get his game back? And give him a green light on 3s? But, see...what's the point if you think he never had a game?

[Mavsfan12]

So, if you hated Powell's game when he was healthy then there is probably no point in this conversation.  But the Mavs, and a few Mavs fans, thought that Powell had something to offer, and the Mavs built lineups that worked really well, offensive and defensively with healthy Powell. That being the case, should they try to use the preseason to allow him to see if he can get his game back? And give him a green light on 3s? But, see...what's the point if you think he never had a game?

I like Powell.  I root for Powell.  I want very badly for him to be successful.  He just makes it very hard to watch him struggle out there. Very Little WCS tonight.  I was disappointed in that.  I felt that this would have been a good opponent to roll him out to see what he could do in exhibition play.  Oh well.

[SwisherPrice]

Limited sample size but Josh Green finishes preseason 3/6 from three. The rest of his offense looks shaky right now but his 3 and D potential is what will be his calling if he wants to get any limited rotation minutes this season.

Terry and Bey should probably spend as much time in the G-League as possible. Instead of waving a towel, Terry needs lots and lots of minutes, even if it's vs. G-League competition.

[SleepingHero]

So, if you hated Powell's game when he was healthy then there is probably no point in this conversation.

"Hate" is a strong word. My dislike for Powell comes close but I don't think I hate him. I recognized his value as an elite roll man. He provided a verticality that the Mavs often needed. I wasn't blind to his strengths. I understood why he played even if I wasn't happy with it. However, I was one of many that did point out that his strengths aren't a rare skillset, but I digress.

Powell's biggest weaknesses were always defense, rebounding, and shooting. He doesn't really do any of that well. We all know this. I know Kamm can probably pull stats contradicting that statement, but just watching the game Powell is below average in all of those areas. I find at least 2 of those things, defense and rebounding, to be more important skills I want from a big man rather than just verticality. 

Now just going off these last 3 games, Powell's verticality aspect of his game isn't the same at all. He's had 1 or 2 plays here and there, but as a lob threat he just isn't that anymore, which was his 1 elite skill. Can he get better over the course of the season? I wouldn't rule it out. But I believe the upside of Powell returning to what he was versus the time investment that is needed for him to get back there isn't worth it. The fact that the Mavs have plenty of people day 1 that can be at least replacement level lob finishers AND bring other more valued skills on the roster also highlights more of a reason to not play him. And given the depth of the western conference, I'd rather not experiment on a gamble that has a high chance of not working out given the history of achilles injuries and athletic players. 

I like Powell as a person. He's a great dude. His lockerroom presence isn't taken for granted. But we're trying to build a basketball team, and Powell just isn't a very good basketball player. He was flawed before his injury, and now his injury has taken his weaknesses and just exacerbated them.

Can Powell become a solid spot minute guy that comes in randomly and switches the pace up ala 36 year old JJ Barea? I think that's his role from now on. But as a starter on a western conference playoff lock? I think that ship has sailed.

[fifteenth]

SH, I don't think any of our other roll man candidates come close to what healthy Powell provides in the pnr game. I doubt the Mavs are willing to draw conclusions on what Powell will be this season as quickly as you are. Though, I'm sure they'll have to draw conclusions at some point.

[SleepingHero]

I don't think any of our other roll man candidates come close to what healthy Powell provides in the pnr game

I think the better way to frame this is to ask some questions so we can at least forecast our conclusions. 

One question is how long will it take for Powell to return to what he was, if he can even return at all? Because my main hang-up is that it'd probably take 2 months before Powell is back to his old self if he can even be his old self. KP took about a month and a bit before he was back to himself. So 2 months isn't outlandish for a worse injury. 

Another question is, is the drop off from the other roll man candidates (namely Maxi and WCS) so great from Powell that it's worth investing 2 months in a shortened season to bring Powell back to what he was? 

Finally, even if there is a drop off, do the more varied skillsets of Maxi/KP/Bobi/WCS more than makeup for it? Given that Maxi and KP stepped up in place of Powell and didn't miss a beat, I think we already have the answer to this one.

These are the questions I'm dealing with. I don't think the drop off is that big at all, and I'm highly suspect that Powell can return to what he ever was, which means we shouldn't be riding on his return. Further, even IF Powell can return, 2 months in a shortened season is far too big of a time investment for me to give the amount of runs Powell would need. We saw his defense against the Wolves tonight, he was eaten alive. Same story against the Bucks. And historically Powell has never been good in that area so I don't see why that would change, and if he isn't producing on offense then he's a massive liability.

Of course the Mavs aren't going to make a conclusion on Powell after 3 preseason games. Odds are they'll give him time. But I disagree with the decision.

[jesusshuttlesworth82]

Terry looks like he belongs in the G league.

[omahen]

Terry looks like he belongs in the G league.

As a PG certainly. I would like to see him as SG

[Drew]

Guys the Mavs and Rick are not idiots, despite what some of you “fire Rick” dudes in the past at least, have thought.

They are something we don’t OR see it exactly like we do. They got an idea what they’re doing.

Maybe they’re playing him with the starters to get him back to his old form. Or to showcase him for a future trade.

Maybe they realize without JJB having him in the 2nd unit is worthless as neither Brunson nor Burke run the PnR the same way and Luka is the only one that’ll exploit the rolling big man.

Yes he’s THE liability in the starting lineup. He won’t be when KP gets back as I HOPE he gets sent to the bench instead of DFS(I think they prefer him Starting though).

All in all I trust the team to do what’s best.

[david75090]

I was really disappointed to find out that the Mavs 2nd unit was not infallible.

[Mapka]

I think the better way to frame this is to ask some questions so we can at least forecast our conclusions. 

One question is how long will it take for Powell to return to what he was, if he can even return at all? Because my main hang-up is that it'd probably take 2 months before Powell is back to his old self if he can even be his old self. KP took about a month and a bit before he was back to himself. So 2 months isn't outlandish for a worse injury. 

Another question is, is the drop off from the other roll man candidates (namely Maxi and WCS) so great from Powell that it's worth investing 2 months in a shortened season to bring Powell back to what he was? 

Finally, even if there is a drop off, do the more varied skillsets of Maxi/KP/Bobi/WCS more than makeup for it? Given that Maxi and KP stepped up in place of Powell and didn't miss a beat, I think we already have the answer to this one.

These are the questions I'm dealing with. I don't think the drop off is that big at all, and I'm highly suspect that Powell can return to what he ever was, which means we shouldn't be riding on his return. Further, even IF Powell can return, 2 months in a shortened season is far too big of a time investment for me to give the amount of runs Powell would need. We saw his defense against the Wolves tonight, he was eaten alive. Same story against the Bucks. And historically Powell has never been good in that area so I don't see why that would change, and if he isn't producing on offense then he's a massive liability.

Of course the Mavs aren't going to make a conclusion on Powell after 3 preseason games. Odds are they'll give him time. But I disagree with the decision.

So, why do you think it does so much harm letting him play some minutes.

Will Rick let him singlehanded loose us games? Pretty sure not. 

Will it help to have a better recovered Powell. Pretty sure. 

Will it help WCS to make him earn his minutes? Who knows? 

KP is out and till he is back there is a void in the starting lineup so or so.

[HanspardsShowerVoice]

I mean ... it seems the contention among certain people is that Powell provided absolutely zero contribution to the Mavs having the most efficient offense in NBA history last year, which I find hard to believe.

[ClutchDirk]

I mean ... it seems the contention among certain people is that Powell provided absolutely zero contribution to the Mavs having the most efficient offense in NBA history last year, which I find hard to believe.

https://media.giphy.com/media/D3c7kmykcC7hS/giphy.gif

[ItsGoTime]

but...STATS!

[HanspardsShowerVoice]

It seems to be implied that Dwight Powell only gets time because Carlisle considers him a cool hang and a nice guy, but Donnie has also said he considers Powell a perfect compliment to KP and Cuban also raves about how important he is. And the Mavs have been one of the most advanced statistics driven front offices in all of professional sports, much less the NBA, for the better part of 15+ years. So you don't think maybe they might have some proprietary data to support their belief in Powell to go along intangibles? Especially when just the public facing stats also support his efficiency.

[juanc]

I realy don't get the Powell hate. Powell is comming back from one of the worst(if not the worst) injuries in basketball, he hasn't played basketball in almost a year, and we expect him to be the same old Dwight he was when he got down. We gave KP time(almost half of the season) after the ACL, for example. And when it comes to his defense, the first two players he had to guard were Giannis and Towns, two of the top5 offensive bigs in the league.

I don't get the rotations either, I don't see Powell as a starter at least not the Dwight that we saw in the preseason, but just give the man some time.

[ItsGoTime]

I don't get the rotations either, I don't see Powell as a starter at least not the Dwight that we saw in the preseason

There are a few posts sharing more than this view, but this is considered Powell hate as far as I’ve been labeled.