GAME 35: NYK (18-17) @ DAL (19-16) | 126-121 win

[Kammrath]

how long before Lebron vs. Michael is replaced by Luka vs. Michael. 

FIFY.

I have said since Luka's second season, his ceiling is the GOAT. It is just a matter of taking care of his body better and getting rid of his TERRIBLE lazy habits on D and effort.

[Nowitzki Way]

FIFY.

I have said since Luka's second season, his ceiling is the GOAT. It is just a matter of taking care of his body better and getting rid of his TERRIBLE lazy habits on D and effort.

Its not crazy to say he has GOAT potential. Look at what he's accomplished at a young age. But for him to be in GOAT conversations, he'll have to win championships. Multiple championships. Especially if we want people outside of Dallas to take these GOAT conversations seriously.  

Jordan was 24 when he won his first MVP.  He was 28 and in his 7th season when he won his 1st championship. 

Luka has time, but he'll need help. He was 26 when the Bulls got Scottie. We're all waiting on Luka's Scottie.

[cow]

Luka is an offensive savant but I'm not sure the GOAT can be primarily a one-way player no matter how transcendent that one-way is.

[Nowitzki Way]

Luka is an offensive savant but I'm not sure the GOAT can be primarily a one-way player no matter how transcendent that one-way is.

He'll never be on an All NBA Defensive Team but his D is getting better.

I think he needs to end up at 1 or 2 on the All Time Scoring List and win at least 2 Championships to be in the GOAT talks along with Jordan and Lebron. 

If he stays healthy and plays another 14 seasons (Age 38) I can see him being top 2 or 3 on the All Time Scoring lists. Lebron will pass Kareem within the next year, so who knows how long he'll play and what his end number will be. 

Kareem played until age 42 but didnt start in the NBA until age 23. Luka already has 8,000 points at age 23.   Kareem "only" scored 4,600 points after the age of 38            (4 seasons). If Luka keeps up his pace he'll pass Kareem.

[Mavs2021]

He'll never be on an All NBA Defensive Team but his D is getting better.

I think he needs to end up at 1 or 2 on the All Time Scoring List and win at least 2 Championships to be in the GOAT talks along with Jordan and Lebron. 

If he stays healthy and plays another 14 seasons (Age 38) I can see him being top 2 or 3 on the All Time Scoring lists. Lebron will pass Kareem within the next year, so who knows how long he'll play and what his end number will be. 

Kareem played until age 42 but didnt start in the NBA until age 23. Luka already has 8,000 points at age 23.   Kareem "only" scored 4,600 points after the age of 38            (4 seasons). If Luka keeps up his pace he'll pass Kareem.

Bron is obviously aiming for 40k at this point.

[Nowitzki Way]

Bron is obviously aiming for 40k at this point.

And he'll get there.  I forgot to mention Durant. I think he gets to 36 or 37K if he plays another 4 or 5 seasons (Age 38/39). That would put him 3rd over Karl Malone.

Other current players with a chance to get into top 5 would be Steph, Harden, and Giannis. But i dont see any of them reaching top 3.

[cow]

He'll never be on an All NBA Defensive Team but his D is getting better.

Better but his ceiling is probably to be an above average defender which disqualifies him from the discussion in my mind.  Maybe he'll go out and win 10 championships and make me rethink my position though.

[Nowitzki Way]

Better but his ceiling is probably to be an above average defender which disqualifies him from the discussion in my mind.  Maybe he'll go out and win 10 championships and make me rethink my position though.

Hell i'd sign up for 3 right now. Especially if they're all in a Mavs uniform!

[mvossman]

They were so bold on The NBA Podcast today to raise the issue of how long before Lebron vs. Michael is replaced by Luka vs. Lebron.  They pointed out that Luka is doing more in fewer minutes than Lebron was at the same point in their careers (five seasons).  Below is an averaging of the season averages (which is slightly different than the per game average for each season, but the numbers were easier to come by).  Note how close almost all of these numbers are:


                  Lebron      Luka
Minutes       41.1          34.5

FGA            21.2           20.3

FG%          .466          .466

3PA             4.0            8.2

3P%           .322          .340

EFG            .496          .535

FTA             8.7            8.2

FT%           .730          .737

DRB            5.6            7.6

TRB            6.9            8.6

ASST           6.6            8.2

STL             1.8            1.2

TOV            3.3             4.1

PTS             27.4          27.9


Bear in mind that Lebron is achieving virtually identical counting stats while playing 19% more minutes.  OK, Luka has more Assists, Rebounds and TO's, but everything else is about the same.  It is kind of uncanny.  

But wait!!!  Now normalize the minutes and not only does Lebron never score as much per 36 in his first five years as Luka has averaged per 36 in that time (28.6), Lebron has only achieved that number per 36 once in 20 years (last season).   Lebron has never once achieved a per 36 rebounding number equal to what Luka has averaged in his first 5 years per 36 (9.0).  There have only been two seasons in 20 where Lebron's per 36 assists have bested the per 36 assists Luka has averaged his first five years (8.5)

So, the perception that Luka and Lebron were similar in their first five years is almost completely about the extra minutes Lebron played.  Even without the extra minutes, Luka bests his numbers.  Normalize the minutes and almost any scoring, rebounding or assist season for Lebron is a disappointment compared to what Luka is averaging super early in his career.  Top 15-20.  Yeah, just a matter of health.

Luka's offense does look better in the comparison, but they are in different leagues defensively through first 5 seasons.

[Kammrath]

Luka's offense does look better in the comparison, but they are in different leagues defensively through first 5 seasons.

And Lebron's on/off numbers reveal that truth. Luka is finally making the impact he should this season, but Lebron did it every season except his rookie year.

[ballsrchr]

Can he crack the 10 ?

1. Jordan
   
2. Lebron
   
3. Wilt
   
4. Kareem
   
5. Bill Russell
   
6. Magic
   
7. Kobe
   
8. Shaq
   
9. Bird
   
10. Duncan
    
11. Oscar Robertson
    
12. Durant
    
13. Steph
    
14. Hakeem
    
15. Dr. J.
    
16. Giannis   
    
17. Karl Malone
    
18. Dirk
    
19. Jerry West
    
20. Moses Malone
    

That's a hell of a list.  Crack 10?  I think he can...but he needs help.

[cow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7GO7C112kk

[burekemde]

People are amazed that Luka was not doubled. But there is more to that story, and it is about the adjustments that Mavs have made over previous games, starting where Wood entered the starting lineup. On almost every Luka double since that time, Luka has used Wood as a quick outlet. The play where Wood starts with the screen and the double on Luka is made, instead of waiting for Wood to attack the paint, instead Luka passes the ball over to Wood quickly at foot height between the two doubling defenders. Why is this so effective? It is effective because Wood is a player that from this position and because of Luka doubled being essentially completely unguarded at least initially, has the ability to dribble and attack the rim, and finish efficiently when the help arrives at the rim. This is exactly what Sabonis is also good at and why I hoped he would be the guy filling the role here. Instead it is Wood and it is enhoyable to watch this occur and that the squad has a player with this particular skillset!

I didnt manage to vote in the dearkie thread, but my vote actually goes to Wood. Wood is the player (and Kidds doubling adjustments on Luka) that ensured less Luka doubling. This is not to say Wood played better in the last game, it was arguably Lukas best performace to date or one of them. Wood is having a huge impact on this team, on both ends of the floor.

We have two SKILLED players other than Luka. We lost one in JB. That is SD and Wood. These are players you dont leave alone, players that can both shoot but also attack the rim and score in myriad of different ways, that you just cant gameplan from. Multidimensional players like these are the key in making the offense multidimensional and prevent Luka doubling, and what will take this team to a championship. The remaining core of our players have considerably less ability in penetration/finish/passing (in addition to shooting), we see some skills from time to time from THJ and from DSF and from Green. But its not close to the level of SD/Wood and not good enough to completely eliminate double teaming from even being a thought of the opponents coaches.

Nevertheless, proper use of Wood and SD has made the double teams considerably less efficient tactic for opponents ever since Wood started and since he was starting to be used as that quick outlet option immediately after the double.

More complicated doubling will occur in playoffs and require more skills also from the two other positions and will require more passing/penetration/finishing from also THJ and DSF and others.

So far so good, Im relieved to see that the team uses Woods skills properly. But this is just the beginning. Our team will find more ways to incorporate Wood, he is a lot more skilled than what he is performing at the moment. We will see games where Luka gets doubled and where he and SD will explode.

Finally, becoming more a team now again. We took a huge step back with Brunson leaving, and it was no coincidence that doubles started to work again. But i finally feel we made the transition and Wood is replacing Brunsons skills. That being said, we need two more SKILLED players like SD/Wood to win the title. It puts 100% pressure on outside shooting to work otherwise. But using the space to attack the rim, pass, make the ball movement is much more safe way to use the space that is left from doubling Luka than is just outside shooting. Deep in playoffs, pure outside shooting i wouldnt trust too much on. I hope the team makes another acquisition of a player with multidimensional offensive skillset. Preferably using THJ and Bullock for such a trade. There is nothing worse for an offense than the pure 3&D player that can only shoot from outside, as the ball will always end there and with the shot and kill the ball movement of the offense, and the space is used for shooting, and not for attacking the rim which is much more efficient when space is present. When one such player is present, it is bearable somehow, but when there are multiple, it kills the flow. No wonder that the ball movement has increased significantly now that we have 3 players in the lineup that are not only outside threat for shooting, but can penetrate, finish, pass which moves the ball.

IMO to win the title, it is essential to acquire 4th player that is multidimensional on offense. It would be acceptable that the 5th is a 3&D player like DFS. this would make the offense EXPLODE.

[Razzmatazz_Hopskidillydoo]

^Wood and SD were instrumental in the improbable win.
And Luka's 3 point play was from a THJ miss (Luka compensating for his team mates).

That's the Mavs in a nut shell.

But yes, Wood and SD aren't enough.
SD should be the 4th option.
And Wood... well he's going to be traded, and the Mavs won't get anything close to his talent for a replacement.

[burekemde]

^Wood and SD were instrumental in the improbable win.
And Luka's 3 point play was from a THJ miss (Luka compensating for his team mates).

That's the Mavs in a nut shell.

But yes, Wood and SD aren't enough.
SD should be the 4th option.
And Wood... well he's going to be traded, and the Mavs won't get anything close to his talent for a replacement.

why will he be traded you think? I certainly hope not. Wood and SD are the only players able to keep that double away right now. Or lowering them from occuring every single play and making them less efficient.

[burekemde]

The more I think about it, John Collins fits exactly the skillset for that additional player. JC can also shoot/penetrate/finish around the rim and pass it well enough when needed. Wood / SD / Collins would ensure no double teams are set rest of the season and until the finals in the playoffs, and inclusive the finals. It is only a player that is multidimensional, as SD and Wood, that can fulfill that for our offense to keep the doubles away. Pure shooters will never work. In addition, he is extremely mobile and versatile on defense and can play multiple positions. All in all Collins would be a MASSIVE upgrade over Powell/THJ/Bullock and what they are able to provide. In addition, pick and roll would be able to be done with either Wood or Collins, which would keep the defenses guessing. Of course, our depth would take a hit, but our starting lineup would destroy every team. I really believe we are one player away, someone with those type of mutidimensional skills.