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Only Fantasy Traders in the Building (The Mitchell Case)
(07-20-2022, 03:48 PM)F Gump Wrote: It's a proposed 2-for-1 only because Powell outgoing by himself doesn't salary match with Rose. He would trade match with Beverly, however. (The problem there, and perhaps with Rose as well, would be Ainge's involvement.)

I like Rose in that he is very much a creator of offense, and that's what the opening requires.

A bench unit that included Rose, THJ and Wood would likely have an O-Rating in the high 120’s.  The key is not giving up the same number.

If you follow your Bigs/Wings/Creators motif, we have McGee/Wood/Maxi, DFS/Bullock/THJ and Luka/SD/Rose.  Maxi would be a plus defender off the bench.  I suspect we’d need Frank to get some PT (at least during the regular season) so that we don’t wear out DFS and Bullock.  Given McGee’s likely light minutes load, there are probably available minutes for Frank as an on-ball defender who doesn’t necessarily need to score because of all the firepower provided by the others.

I think one of the final two slots would need to go to a backup big.  Jericho Sims can’t be traded until 10/8.
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(07-20-2022, 05:14 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: A bench unit that included Rose, THJ and Wood would likely have an O-Rating in the high 120’s.  The key is not giving up the same number.

If you follow your Bigs/Wings/Creators motif, we have McGee/Wood/Maxi, DFS/Bullock/THJ and Luka/SD/Rose.  Maxi would be a plus defender off the bench.  I suspect we’d need Frank to get some PT (at least during the regular season) so that we don’t wear out DFS and Bullock.  Given McGee’s likely light minutes load, there are probably available minutes for Frank as an on-ball defender who doesn’t necessarily need to score because of all the firepower provided by the others.

I think one of the final two slots would need to go to a backup big.  Jericho Sims can’t be traded until 10/8.

If you are looking for a young developmental big how about Utah's Udoka?  He is extremely limited and has been a disappointment but he is still 22.  He would be a target in any playoff matchup, but how about him as a mcGee protege?

Nico said he wanted better rebounding and better protecting the rim.   Both of those are suppose to be Udoka's strengths.
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(07-20-2022, 05:33 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: mcGee protege


[Image: giphy.gif]
"The Dallas Mavericks must do everything they can to get Olivier-Maxence Prosper."
- IamDougieFresh (05-20-2023, 04:39 AM)
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(07-20-2022, 05:33 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: If you are looking for a young developmental big how about Utah's Udoka?  He is extremely limited and has been a disappointment but he is still 22.  He would be a target in any playoff matchup, but how about him as a mcGee protege?

Nico said he wanted better rebounding and better protecting the rim.   Both of those are suppose to be Udoka's strengths.

So, the plan is to trade Powell and bring in a vet min C to help keep McGee/Maxi fresh for the playoffs?
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(07-20-2022, 06:52 PM)chaparral Wrote: So, the plan is to trade Powell and bring in a vet min C to help keep McGee/Maxi fresh for the playoffs?

Probably wouldn't play much.  Could be useful if McGee got hurt.   But it would be a low cost gamble.

I am at the point where I don't want to include Green in these trades.  But the Mavs have a better look and feel of what he is and what he could be.   I do believe if he is kept and the Mavs still have hopes for him, that he needs to play.
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(07-20-2022, 06:55 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: Probably wouldn't play much.  Could be useful if McGee got hurt.   But it would be a low cost gamble.

I am at the point where I don't want to include Green in these trades.  But the Mavs have a better look and feel of what he is and what he could be.   I do believe if he is kept and the Mavs still have hopes for him, that he needs to play.

I understand that Powell's $$ can be useful in getting us that must needed 3rd PG.  And like all the fantasy talk about that process.  But what about a vet min vet like Whiteside?  Could he still be a useful player here?
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If we trade Green for Rose I will scream. Our only young player with any upside. Not sold on Hardy yet, but I wouldn’t trade him for Rose either. Have to have SOME cheap young talent. Green or Hardy have to bring back a player that helps us take a step towards being a title contender. Otherwise I’d rather get a third guard off the scrap heap. Still not sure why Dragic wasn’t enough. Especially as it may have made Luka happy. I’m past trying to decipher what our FO is thinking. Any of these options like Bev or Rose will likely cost us assets one way or another.
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The more I think about NY/Utah, the more I think Rose makes sense.  I’ll use Powell/Green as the Dallas outgoing as my base assumption.

Utah will want something for Clarkson or Beverley.  But if we are joining a Mitchell deal, we are giving Utah the choice of expiring Rose or expiring Powell (in a position of greater need) and a flyer on Green.  I think pretty clearly they would take the latter.  I think there is zero chance they take Powell alone for Beverley or Clarkson.

Dallas has to make a $5mm decision on Green by October for the 2023 season.  I like Green, but you can only have so many guys getting a few developmental minutes and we have a new shiny toy who probably has as much or more upside.  It makes much more sense for Green to get minutes in rebuilding Utah.

As I spoke of in the OP, I think Schwartz would be much happier with Powell playing some in Utah versus sitting most of the time in Dallas.

If Rose plays well, you control him for another year.  If you need a larger expiring contract, Rose has greater reach at $14.5mm than Powell at $11mm.  He can also be traded as an expiring contract next summer.  Powell can’t.

It might be nice to have Powell as a really good injury insurance policy in the regular season.  It might be nice to see for ourselves if Green will develop into anything (again, in the regular season).  But Rose contributes in the post season (if healthy) and Powell/Green likely don’t.  Ultimately that is what we have to judge this by.

My one stumbling block is having two open roster spots.  Part of me wonders about ways to expand this whether it be adding players or even picks.  Is there someone else that might. Be moving in this deal that we’d be willing to give up 2025 for?  Would NY trade 23 for 27 under the assumption we might be a worse team then than now.  Need more time to think through the possibilities, but I like what I perceive to be the base deal here.
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About the idea of adding an emergency center after trading Powell-Green in this imaginary trade, they would have to add someone to have a least a 14th body. (About the 15th slot, how that is filled, or not, might tell us something about priorities and limits for Nico. Isn't it much cheaper to just employ the minimum of 14, especially when you are a taxpayer?)

But I am not sure it would be anything of a particular need. For an emergency big, I think Wright would be that guy. I am guessing he is intended to be one of the 2-ways and Dorsey the other.

A depth chart something like this?

McGee     Wood                   Wright? (TW)
               Kleber   Bertans  
DFS                                             Dorsey? (TW)      
Bullock    THJ       Ntilikina   Pinson  

Dinwiddie
             Rose     Hardy
Luka

As far as whether Wright and Dorsey are slated to be the 2-ways, the fact that those deals (or ANY deals for 2-ways) are still undone at this point feels a bit concerning. Aren't they incredibly late to the table?
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(07-21-2022, 01:17 PM)F Gump Wrote: Dorsey?


I'm by no means a Dorsey expert, but the video I've seen of him has him running the offense. I think he's more of a ball-handler type. That's what worries me. I have a feeling they view him as Plan Z for ball-handler. In other words, not a 2-way, but the "if all else fails" 3rd guy in the rotation there.

Definitely agree that 4th center isn't/wouldn't be a real concern should Powell go out. You'd essentially be replacing Boban, who almost never played.
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(07-21-2022, 01:20 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I'm by no means a Dorsey expert, but the video I've seen of him has him running the offense. I think he's more of a ball-handler type. That's what worries me. I have a feeling they view him as Plan Z for ball-handler. In other words, not a 2-way, but the "if all else fails" 3rd guy in the rotation there.

Definitely agree that 4th center isn't/wouldn't be a real concern should Powell go out. You'd essentially be replacing Boban, who almost never played.


So something more like this, if we assume a Powell-Green trade for Rose??

McGee     Wood                   Wright? (TW)
               Kleber   Bertans  
DFS                                              
Bullock    THJ       Ntilikina   Pinson  
                          Hardy
Dinwiddie
             Rose     Dorsey? (TW)     
Luka
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(07-21-2022, 01:20 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I'm by no means a Dorsey expert, but the video I've seen of him has him running the offense. I think he's more of a ball-handler type. That's what worries me.


His ast/tov numbers are comparable to THJs and he takes more than 50% of his shots from 3. He is a better ballhandler but I don´t see him in any kind of playmaking role. More like a worse version of Devonte Graham. In a best case scenario he provides high 3-point volume/efficiency and the ability to move the ball within the offensive scheme. From the little that I have seen he basically has no inside game. Main reason why I cannot imagine that a pick and roll / penetration heavy offense like Dallas views him as a ballhandler.
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