TDL Archived: The 2nd Rnd Pick Yankee Swap

[Kammrath]

So I´m landing on two potential trades now...

Westbrook + Lakers 1st unprotected to Mavs
Irving (+ extension) + Bertans to Lakers
Dinwiddie + THJ to the Nets

if that is not enough for the Nets then....

Westbrook + Lakers 2027 1st unprotected + Nets 2023 1st unprotected to Mavs
Irving (+ extension) + Bertans to Lakers
Dinwiddie + DFS + McGee to the Nets

I am pretty confident I would do both of those deals.

[DanSchwartzgan]

Westbrook + Lakers 2027 1st unprotected + Nets 2023 1st unprotected to Mavs
Irving (+ extension) + Bertans to Lakers
Dinwiddie + DFS + McGee to the Nets

That’s kind of interesting.  If Luka’s injury was to take him out for a month, I’d be real interested.

One note regarding Bertans.  I’d rather send THJ to the Laker’s than Bertans (maybe get some other asset from them since THJ is probably the better player).  Bertans is super easy to S/W in about 15 months.  Simply don’t play him in 75% of next year’s games and in the summer of 2024 you divide his remaining $5mm by three and the cost is minimal.  It wouldn’t have to be Dallas doing this.  We could trade him as essentially an expiring contract as early as this summer.

So, 22/23 is a total punt.  But, this summer you have cap room, four picks of your own and the two from this trade to use in an overnight rebuild.  Heck, maybe KD is available by then.  Do we have confidence Nico can use those assets to do an overnight overhaul?

[F Gump]

There's been talk in this conversation of getting a 2023 1st from BKN, and in one place an "unprotected" 1st. Not that such protection would matter, since BKN will finish near the top of the league standings.

But they can't trade that 2023 1st.

They've already made their pick part of a swap scenario. But the piece that's left, it can't be traded, since they have no 2024 1st. In fact, the next available BKN 1st would be 2028.

[Kammrath]

There's been talk in this conversation of getting a 2023 1st from BKN, and in one place an "unprotected" 1st. Not that such protection would matter, since BKN will finish near the top of the league standings.

But they can't trade that 2023 1st.

Pretty sure they have an extra 2023 1st via HOU or PHI.

[Kammrath]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...3144603648

[Kammrath]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...5496116225

[F Gump]

Westbrook + Lakers 1st unprotected to Mavs
Irving (+ extension) + Bertans to Lakers
Dinwiddie + THJ to the Nets


Mavs send out Dinwiddie, THJ, and Bertans,
and get RW and Lakers 1st unprotected.

I generally like that deal. (But not those sending away DFS.)
1 It does solve Cuban's tax problem, so I can't see him saying no if offered.
2 It doesn't get Mavs closer to a star to pair with Luka.
3 It leaves the Mavs scrambling in the summer for a 2nd playmaker to replace Dinwiddie and backup Luka (with RW filling that role as a rental through end of season), and they're even farther away from having 3.
4 They haven't done anything to add more 2-way wings, although personally I would see the loss of THJ as freeing up minutes that becomes addition by subtraction in that area.
5 They might have over-MLE cap room, depending on what they do with Wood and Powell.

[F Gump]

Pretty sure they have an extra 2023 1st via HOU or PHI.

Respectfully, I am certain they do not. You may be confusing pick swaps as if it adds another pick, and it does not. Nets have a single 2023 FRP, the end result after pick swaps (perhaps their own, or PHI's), which will be the middle of the 3 picks between HOU, BKN, PHI. They have no other 2023 FRP at this point. Their next (and only) available-to-swap FRP is 2028.


2023 first round draft pick from Houston or Philadelphia (outgoing swap, Brooklyn outgoing to Houston or Utah)

Houston will receive the more favorable of its 2023 1st round pick and Brooklyn's 2023 1st round pick; Brooklyn will receive the more favorable of (i) the less favorable of its pick and the Houston pick and (ii) Philadelphia's 2023 1st round pick and Utah will receive the least favorable of the three (via Houston's right to swap for Brooklyn; via Philadelphia to Brooklyn) [Brooklyn-Cleveland-Houston-Indiana, 1/16/2021; Brooklyn-Philadelphia, 2/10/2022; Brooklyn-Utah, 6/30/2022]

[Kammrath]

I am certain they do not. You may be confusing pick swaps as if it adds another pick, and it does not. Nets have a single 2023 FRP, the end result after pick swaps (perhaps their own, or PHI's), which will be the middle of the 3 picks between HOU, BKN, PHI. They have no other 2023 FRP at this point. Their next (and only) available-to-swap FRP is 2028.


2023 first round draft pick from Houston or Philadelphia (outgoing swap, Brooklyn outgoing to Houston or Utah)

Houston will receive the more favorable of its 2023 1st round pick and Brooklyn's 2023 1st round pick; Brooklyn will receive the more favorable of (i) the less favorable of its pick and the Houston pick and (ii) Philadelphia's 2023 1st round pick and Utah will receive the least favorable of the three (via Houston's right to swap for Brooklyn; via Philadelphia to Brooklyn) [Brooklyn-Cleveland-Houston-Indiana, 1/16/2021; Brooklyn-Philadelphia, 2/10/2022; Brooklyn-Utah, 6/30/2022]

Ok, if that is the case, then many websites have it wrong.

[F Gump]

Which websites, and whose pick do they think BKN has (in addition to the one above)?

[Kammrath]

Which websites, and whose pick do they think BKN has (in addition to the one above)?

Trade machines and other sites suggesting that BKN has its own 2023 pick AND a pick from HOU/PHI. But I am assuming that is a confusion of the complicated swap scenario you outlined above.

[SleepingHero]

 Probably the combo of
1 Very high usage (over 27%) when he's on the floor
2 Very inefficient results from that high usage (49.8% TS%, which is in the very bottom tier in NBA)
3 Not especially good on defense either
4 Injured several weeks ago and not sure if/when he might be available again, or how that impairment (ab strain) might diminish his play going forward

Good points. I didn't notice that insane usage. Add that in he's only playing 22mpg and you have a black hole on offense. 

Wall very well might be washed. I can see a team like the Spurs try and rehabbing him though. Take him on a flier, rehab his value, flip him for a future 1st.

---

I hope the Mavs are smart enough to demand games played and playoff incentives to that 2 year contract!!!

If you do this, then Kyrie just sits out and destroys your entire locker room with a constant negative media drama cycle. 

That's the Kyrie experience. It's his way, everyday, and any dissent leads to him saying the earth is flat, Kanye has a point, and he doesn't want to play basketball.

[KillerLeft]

That's the Kyrie experience. It's his way, everyday, and any dissent leads to him saying the earth is flat, Kanye has a point, and he doesn't want to play basketball.

So damn true, my friend. You're my new favorite poster in this community.

[SleepingHero]

This is synced to start right on McMahon's analysis of what the Dallas offer would be, and I think he nails it.

I actually couldn't even finish his thoughts. The mere idea of sending our 2 most valuable wings, along with the rest of our guard depth for Kyrie Irving is enough of a nuke to question my fandom. 

I know he's not saying the Mavs are *actually* thinking about this. And that he doesn't think they should get involved either. But holy fucking shit how has Mark Cuban managed to sink my expectations even lower of him than already. I didn't know that was possible.

[ItsGoTime]

Good points. I didn't notice that insane usage. Add that in he's only playing 22mpg and you have a black hole on offense. 

Wall very well might be washed. I can see a team like the Spurs try and rehabbing him though. Take him on a flier, rehab his value, flip him for a future 1st.

---

If you do this, then Kyrie just sits out and destroys your entire locker room with a constant negative media drama cycle. 

That's the Kyrie experience. It's his way, everyday, and any dissent leads to him saying the earth is flat, Kanye has a point, and he doesn't want to play basketball.

I mean, all you have to do is read the rumors and see the offers to know Dallas is the best chance at get the them what they want. That also doesn’t mean DFS or Green. If LAL aren’t offering Reaves, why would we have to offer more than that when we have the better PG replacement option?

[Kammrath]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...3536592898

[Jmaciscool]

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...5496116225

With the picks that seems to trump any potential Mavs offer (whew)...

...but is that considering that Durant probably doesn't want to repeat the Westbrook experience? I suppose Nets could tell Westbrook to go home, but then they have a wasted spot on a roster they presumably want contending.

That's why I think the three team scenarios with Westbrook going elsewhere seem more likely than straight up Lakers/Nets trades involving Westbrook.

[SleepingHero]

The closest angle I can see to that is for Dallas to trade Dinwiddie + Bertans for Kyrie. If he stays, great. And if he bails, Dallas still cleared out a huge chunk of cap space. Just think of it as the fastest way out of the KP contract.

Even taking this angle, it only opens up 15 mil of cap space if they renounced everyone which they wouldn't do. It does get them drastically under the luxury tax, but that's only helpful for Cuban. 

Maybe the Mavs get super amped about Jerami Grant this offseason (and that thought isn't too outlandish if we're pining over Siakam) and they want to clear the capbooks to make Portland worried. 

Who knows? Still think it's an awful idea.

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https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status...3536592898

The fact were getting these little nuggets is making me think they actually are negotiating a deal.

This is just "Nets, we need to remove stuff. We aren't giving you DFS and Green."

Please make it stop. I can't take it anymore.

[ItsGoTime]

I don’t want Kyrie either (not as low on him as you and KL, for 2 months). My best angle out if this is to get Claxton out of this by giving up our more contender pieces in Wood and DFS. That way, we SnT Kyrie in the offseason and after having a pretty good playoff run (at least past the first round) to the Lakers when they have all their picks available. We can then go after Pascal Siakam and maybe even another high end starter.

[KillerLeft]

With the picks that seems to trump any potential Mavs offer (whew)...

Do not underestimate how hard and creatively Cuban is willing to work in order to sabotage his team.

Dinwiddie, DFS and Green, along with even one first, is a way better offer than that Westbrook/2 1sts offer from Brooklyn's POV, imho.