MAVS NEWS: Klay, Grimes, Naji Press Conference July 9th

[Smitty]

@TheMavsBlog

Dante Exum Today for Australia:

13 Minutes
9 Points
4 Rebounds
2 Assists
0 Turnovers
+17

The Mavericks reserve is an important part of the Boomers rotation.

[Jason Terry]

Stein backing up the reports that the DJJ decision was all about the money for him. That doesn’t make sense when he takes home less on his 3/30 than the 3/27 that was offered. There has to be more to the situation. Did he not want to wait around for a better offer or was the Clippers deal the best non-mav deal he was offered? You have an agent to represent your interests. Why did Rich Paul not get him the best deal? Sounds most like Rich Paul filled DJJ’s head with lies and will make a greater commission while his client gets less. Bet Jones jr feels dumb now

[KillerLeft]

Stein backing up the reports that the DJJ decision was all about the money for him. That doesn’t make sense when he takes home less on his 3/30 than the 3/27 that was offered. There has to be more to the situation. Did he not want to wait around for a better offer or was the Clippers deal the best non-mav deal he was offered? You have an agent to represent your interests. Why did Rich Paul not get him the best deal? Sounds most like Rich Paul filled DJJ’s head with lies and will make a greater commission while his client gets less. Bet Jones jr feels dumb now

It makes sense if the meaning is that he and his new agency were going to try to extort more money out of the Mavericks, specifically, and then when they told him to shove it (Marshall), they immediately had to settle for someone else’s offer without any leverage.

[Winter]

Interesting podcast I just heard on DJJ.

The podcast begins with a discussion of DJJ's starter minutes being lower than a typical starter. This is because his effectiveness diminished over time. Hence, his play was optimized at about 23 mpg rather than a more common 28-30 mpg from most starters. The Mavs still liked him a lot and apparently didn't have much trouble working around that number

Early on when it appeared DJJ was changing agents to Rich Paul, the Mavs foresaw the possibility of some delays with the new agent (in that they thought Rich Paul would go for slightly more money and drag this out a bit). The Mavs didn't want any delays as they had eyes on Klay and needed a clear lane to work in. They let it be known that they had a backup plan if the DJJ negotiations got delayed (the backup plan being Naji Marshall).

When it became clear that the DJJ\Rich Paul camp wasn't going to accept the initial number (3 for 27) without more negotiation, the Mavs turned the corner quickly and signed Marshall.

At this point, it's not clear why DJJ took the Clippers offer so quickly instead of looking for more suitors after the Mavs committed to Naji. Maybe DJJ\Paul didn't see another market offering more. If that's true, then it was a mistake not to take the Mavs offer in my opinion. The 3 for 30 he accepted is likely less in California than the 3 for 27 in Texas.

Some of this looks pretty clumsy - but not really by the Mavs Front Office. They had a plan and a timeframe and stuck with it. DJJ didn't do badly money-wise, but his role and his minutes-per-game look more uncertain in LA than his established role here.

I'm not sure if Marshall can improve on the minutes-per-game that DJJ played, but if Naji's skills are a little more versatile (as reported) the Mavs might be better off for it.

[KillerLeft]

Interesting podcast I just heard on DJJ.

The podcast begins with a discussion of DJJ's starter minutes being lower than a typical starter. This is because his effectiveness diminished over time. Hence, his play was optimized at about 23 mpg rather than a more common 28-30 mpg from most starters. The Mavs still liked him a lot and apparently didn't have much trouble working around that number

Early on when it appeared DJJ was changing agents to Rich Paul, the Mavs foresaw the possibility of some delays with the new agent (in that they thought Rich Paul would go for slightly more money and drag this out a bit). The Mavs didn't want any delays as they had eyes on Klay and needed a clear lane to work in. They let it be known that they had a backup plan if the DJJ negotiations got delayed (the backup plan being Naji Marshall).

When it became clear that the DJJ\Rich Paul camp wasn't going to accept the initial number (3 for 27) without more negotiation, the Mavs turned the corner quickly and signed Marshall.

At this point, it's not clear why DJJ took the Clippers offer so quickly instead of looking for more suitors after the Mavs committed to Naji. Maybe DJJ\Paul didn't see another market offering more. If that's true, then it was a mistake not to take the Mavs offer in my opinion. The 3 for 30 he accepted is likely less in California than the 3 for 27 in Texas.

Some of this looks pretty clumsy - but not really by the Mavs Front Office. They had a plan and a timeframe and stuck with it. DJJ didn't do badly money-wise, but his role and his minutes-per-game look more uncertain in LA than his established role here.

I'm not sure if Marshall can improve on the minutes-per-game that DJJ played, but if Naji's skills are a little more versatile (as reported) the Mavs might be better off for it.

This is what I've been trying to suggest, but you worded it (or summarized what you heard) very well. Glad to have a little confirmation. Which podcast was it?

I think DJJ is an absolute fool for switching agents when he did.

EDIT: $3 million, guaranteed, is no small amount, especially given what Jones has earned through his entire career so far, but with the Mavs, 50% of his games would've been played in Texas (more than 50%, when games in Houston and SA are added in). I'd be curious to know how much money that actually saves, even if it's just a round number ballpark. Do we have any accountants/tax attorney types on the board?

[BigDirk41]

This is what I've been trying to suggest, but you worded it (or summarized what you heard) very well. Glad to have a little confirmation. Which podcast was it?

I think DJJ is an absolute fool for switching agents when he did.

EDIT: $3 million, guaranteed, is no small amount, especially given what Jones has earned through his entire career so far, but with the Mavs, 50% of his games would've been played in Texas (more than 50%, when games in Houston and SA are added in). I'd be curious to know how much money that actually saves, even if it's just a round number ballpark. Do we have any accountants/tax attorney types on the board?

It looks like the total over the contract is around 1 million more than he would have gotten in Texas, but that doesn't include the games vs Houston and San Antonio so it would be under a million total difference in the end.

[BigDirk41]

So maybe we're talking 250k a year or so roughly.

[Smitty]

So maybe we're talking 250k a year or so roughly.

I’d jump ship for $250K more a year

[BigDirk41]

I’d jump ship for $250K more a year

Lmao same here

[The Jom]

It looks like the total over the contract is around 1 million more than he would have gotten in Texas, but that doesn't include the games vs Houston and San Antonio so it would be under a million total difference in the end.

How do you calculate this? It gets super complex in a hurry. Marginal tax rate in CA is going up to 14.3%, but it won’t reach deferred income, which is an unknown amount. 

Plus the jock tax is calculated differently in each state (games played, duty days, etc.). So figuring how much state tax DJJ would’ve paid had he stayed in Texas is an insane amount of research and math.

[Jason Terry]

It makes sense if the meaning is that he and his new agency were going to try to extort more money out of the Mavericks, specifically, and then when they told him to shove it (Marshall), they immediately had to settle for someone else’s offer without any leverage.

Which makes you think why would that same agent not do the same thing with Hardy? I think Nico is done with them

[MarkAguirreWrathofGod]

Which makes you think why would that same agent not do the same thing with Hardy? I think Nico is done with them

I think they also represent Lively. So he can’t be done with them for a long while yet

[Reunion Mav]

I’d jump ship for $250K more a year

Thinking to the next contract starting from 30 is better than starting from 27. Long term it makes more sense especially to a guy who has not yet made big money. He probably is being directed to think about getting a 4 years times 20 million next contract. He may even believe replacing Paul George as a starter as the way to do this rather than playing behind Klay Thompson. Then there is the LA possible attraction. I really doubt the guy feels stupid. No he is dreaming of and betting on his future. It might not turn out well for him but he certainly feels happy about his free agency success and his dreams for the future. I will even cheer for him sometimes. He helped us!!

[BigDirk41]

Accidentally deleted my message above so reposting.


Mine was just a estimate and I didn't try to be exact. The jock tax in California is 13.3% based on what I found. I'm just looking at the 30 million taxed at 13.3% and then cutting it in half for home games. They would actually play more games in California with 3 other California teams so he would get hit with that 13.3% on the other 6 games he plays in California assuming they play each California team 4 times. When you factor in the 18 additional California games over 3 years, that's an additional roughly 292k in taxes so this is around a 700k difference over the course of the contract. Rough estimate.

That being said, this was just based on a quick Google search. I'm not stating it as fact. If I'm off, feel free to correct and we can go with whatever is correct.

[F Gump]

Jock tax, and CA taxes, is a complex calculation. Lots of the info is already mentioned, but it's way more complexity than that. I suspect a sports agent or the CPA for an agent or team or player might have a program to figure this out, but there are layers to it.

The missing layer in the discussion so far is "where does the player LIVE" - and then how does the state where he lives, as well as the state of the team that pays him, treat that issue.

If I live in CA, and play for a CA team, the tax rule might say that I pay 13.3% on ALL of my income, but then I get a reduction for taxes paid in another state. So when I play in TX or FL, since I pay $0 to those states, I pay the full 13.3% to CA for those games too. And I pay 13.3 on everything when it's all done.

On the reverse end, the Mavs players likely have to pay for the games played in CA, prorated from their total games in that state (or total days of the season).

Some cities also impose a tax.

It changes a bit if I live in another state (say in Texas) as my permanent residence, but am on a work assignment (playing for a team) in CA. In that case, CA would ONLY get to collect on games played in CA.

Very complex to even explain all the issues. Would not invest the massive amount of time to figure it out in a comparative way (presumably create a program with spreadsheets for inputting variables) without being well-paid by a player to do so.

[SleepingHero]

Still hurts not to have DJJ back. Maybe Marshall is exactly what we need and all but I really enjoyed watching DJJ. The fact he tried to strong arm the Mavs in the 11th hour leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

What an imbecile.

[Winter]

Still hurts not to have DJJ back. Maybe Marshall is exactly what we need and all but I really enjoyed watching DJJ. The fact he tried to strong arm the Mavs in the 11th hour leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

What an imbecile.

I might soften this a little.

DJJ has been banking on being seen as a good player now, and really wants a more appropriate payday. So He hires a new agent, who promises him that he will work tirelessly for the maximum amount of money.

The Mavs make an offer... and make it pretty clear that they'd like to get it done quickly. The new agent says, "Not so fast. I think our guy will get more on the open market". The new agent tells his client that he should play a little hardball here. The client is likely on-board after years of feeling under-valued.

What likely happens here (in my opinion) is that Rich Paul hasn't fully grasped the Mavs situation and their need to expedite this and move on to Klay. Rich Paul is likely playing this just as he would for all his clients, but maybe didn't read the room in this case. 

The Mavericks pivot without a counter-offer. There is no negotiation ... so DJJ is probably a little disappointed. But the Mavs need to stand pat for salary reasons, and they have a backup plan with Naji whom they feel very good about. So good, they don't see a real downside to acquiring Naji and can now move on to Klay.

At this point, it somehow becomes clear that these 3-for-30 numbers are likely what the market will bear. DJJ probably could have played some more hardball, but at least the Clippers might really offer him a noticeable role. It's not the Mavs, but maybe close. Maybe.

I wish him the best, but another year or two in Dallas would have cemented him I think in the minds of Mavs fans. Now he is faced with a few years of just being a hired gun with multiple teams. More than anything, that's what I think he'll be missing when looks back on his career. Maybe he finds a real home on a contender, but that's just not easy to do when you're pushing 30.

[KillerLeft]

I wish him the best, but another year or two in Dallas would have cemented him I think in the minds of Mavs fans. Now he is faced with a few years of just being a hired gun with multiple teams. More than anything, that's what I think he'll be missing when looks back on his career. Maybe he finds a real home on a contender, but that's just not easy to do when you're pushing 30.

This is the value lost to him. Much worse than $3 million less on the contract.

[fifteenth]

I might soften this a little.

DJJ has been banking on being seen as a good player now, and really wants a more appropriate payday. So He hires a new agent, who promises him that he will work tirelessly for the maximum amount of money.

The Mavs make an offer... and make it pretty clear that they'd like to get it done quickly. The new agent says, "Not so fast. I think our guy will get more on the open market". The new agent tells his client that he should play a little hardball here. The client is likely on-board after years of feeling under-valued.

What likely happens here (in my opinion) is that Rich Paul hasn't fully grasped the Mavs situation and their need to expedite this and move on to Klay. Rich Paul is likely playing this just as he would for all his clients, but maybe didn't read the room in this case. 

The Mavericks pivot without a counter-offer. There is no negotiation ... so DJJ is probably a little disappointed. But the Mavs need to stand pat for salary reasons, and they have a backup plan with Naji whom they feel very good about. So good, they don't see a real downside to acquiring Naji and can now move on to Klay.

At this point, it somehow becomes clear that these 3-for-30 numbers are likely what the market will bear. DJJ probably could have played some more hardball, but at least the Clippers might really offer him a noticeable role. It's not the Mavs, but maybe close. Maybe.

I wish him the best, but another year or two in Dallas would have cemented him I think in the minds of Mavs fans. Now he is faced with a few years of just being a hired gun with multiple teams. More than anything, that's what I think he'll be missing when looks back on his career. Maybe he finds a real home on a contender, but that's just not easy to do when you're pushing 30.

Wow, Winter. Wonderful writeup! Well worded!

[SleepingHero]

@MikeACurtis2
Quentin Grimes will wear No. 5 for the #Mavs, once worn by JJ Barea and Josh Howard and previously worn by Tyler Dorsey in 2023.