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+--- Thread: ROSTER TALK: Mavs favs for Vogel if no HC job exists. Kyrie handshake deal? (/showthread.php?tid=2173)
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RE: ROSTER TALK: - Chicagojk - 11-01-2022
https://www.dmagazine.com/sports/2022/11/the-mavericks-early-growing-pains-are-no-reason-to-panic/?swcfpc=1
RE: ROSTER TALK: - Chicagojk - 11-02-2022
It it me, or have we not seen some of the really nice passes from Wood the last few games? The first two games I was really impressed with his passing.
My hope is if Wood is up to the task that the pick and roll/pop is our key play in 4th quarters. Question though, if teams are switching everything how does that impact our offense execution? It feels like we just try to get Luka on a weak defender and then he creates when everyone watches. Is there something else we can do with more ball and player movement?
RE: ROSTER TALK: - dynamicalVoid - 11-02-2022
(11-02-2022, 08:25 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: It it me, or have we not seen some of the really nice passes from Wood the last few games? The first two games I was really impressed with his passing.
My hope is if Wood is up to the task that the pick and roll/pop is our key play in 4th quarters. Question though, if teams are switching everything how does that impact our offense execution? It feels like we just try to get Luka on a weak defender and then he creates when everyone watches. Is there something else we can do with more ball and player movement?
Does Luka want that is the question?
Supposedly he doesnt like coming out of games...wouldnt surprise me if we are hamstrung to what Luka wants to do offensively. I know he is the most efficient thing in the World of Basketball...but I would prefer more ball movement or player movement like GS.
We really dont know or cant judge this years team until about a month before the Playoffs. Last two or three that Ive been following...its experimental most of the season and then in the Playoffs the team acts completely different than regular season. How can you judge anything if what we are seeing isnt the final product?
Josh Green would benefit more offensively if he slashed more. Seems like Luka is smart enough with a high level IQ to get him the ball on slashes. Or...if Luka drove to the lane, collapsed the defense...and Josh Green came trailing behind Luka for an easy dump off from Luka and an easy dunk attempt by Green. We never see that stuff though. They did it a couple of time with Luka and KP but then it went away.
Love Luka...but Luka ball is a beat down all season. The second quarter of the Phoenix game and the second quarter of the Memphis game where the second unit was fast paced and everyone was passing and scoring was so electric.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - KillerLeft - 11-02-2022
(11-02-2022, 08:25 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: It it me, or have we not seen some of the really nice passes from Wood the last few games? The first two games I was really impressed with his passing.
A lot of this is dictated by how the pick and roll is defended.
Those nice passes (which were very nice, indeed) came out of the short roll, in situations wherein Wood had space to floor the ball and drive, sucking in help defense.
For the past several games, the Mavs seem to have faced a lot more switching, meaning either Luka goes 1-on-1 against Wood's man or Wood works it into the post and calls for the ball against Luka's man. Additionally, it seems like teams have been "pre-switching" to avoid the Luka/Wood pick and roll altogether a little bit already, putting the guy on Wood they know Luka doesn't want, etc.
Still, the Luka/Wood thing needs to be developed to have answers for all defensive approaches, to your point. I think when you have an offensive talent like Wood, you can't afford to allow the defense to force you away from it.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - Smitty - 11-03-2022
(10-27-2022, 03:00 PM)Smitty Wrote: A Luka - Dinwiddie backcourt to start off defensively is less than ideal. Luka looks to score to start so I prefer Din off the bench and let the Luka/Wood minutes set the tone. Start your 3 best defenders with Luka/Wood and the best 2-man offense in the NBA will be enough.
1st unit: Luka - RB - DFS - Wood - Maxi
2nd unit: Dinwiddie - THJ - Green - McGee POWELL
Luka 34 / Dinwiddie 14
RB 16 / THJ 16 / Dinwiddie 16
DFS 14 / Green 26 / RB 8
Wood 28 / DFS 20
Maxi 26 / Powell 16 / Wood 6
Luka 34 min
RB 24 min
DFS 34 min
Wood 34 min
Maxi 26 min
Dinwiddie 30 min
THJ 16 min
Green 26 min
Powell 16 min
Replacing McGee with Powell but this is STILL the best way forward IMO
RE: ROSTER TALK: DAL "gearing up for big trade for wing"? | "unlikely" DP is kept? - Smitty - 11-03-2022
(07-15-2022, 07:01 PM)Smitty Wrote: Put me in the camp that believes Josh Green will be a good player this year. I’m actually less upset about the off-season, as I sip on my bourbon, because I’ve talked myself into a breakout season for the young fella.
The bourbon hit different that night.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - DanSchwartzgan - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 07:18 AM)Smitty Wrote: Replacing McGee with Powell but this is STILL the best way forward IMO
One of the keys to this is the way you limit Hardaway's minutes.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - mvossman - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 07:18 AM)Smitty Wrote: Replacing McGee with Powell but this is STILL the best way forward IMO
This is right about where I am. For Powell minutes, I would want both Luka and Dorian on the court for size and rebounding. The Powell minutes are probably also the best time for Timmy and his chucking, and that begs Green who can cover for Timmy on defense and wont be asked to do much offensively.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - dynamicalVoid - 11-03-2022
Just bench THJ. Im so over it.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - mvossman - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 08:44 AM)dynamicalVoid Wrote: Just bench THJ. Im so over it.
Have to look at the long game. You burry Timmy on the bench it will be almost impossible to dump that contract. He was a good player for Rick. It seems like Kidd is bringing out every bad habit in him. Not sure if it's in Kidd's nature to put a leash on him on the court.
On the other hand, they catered to KP for over half a season in the hope to jack his trade value up, and still had to send him out for depressed assets. We would have been better off trading KP in the previous offseason and we are probably going to be saying the same thing about Timmy before its done.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - dynamicalVoid - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 08:51 AM)mvossman Wrote: Have to look at the long game. You burry Timmy on the bench it will be almost impossible to dump that contract. He was a good player for Rick. It seems like Kidd is bringing out every bad habit in him. Not sure if it's in Kidd's nature to put a leash on him on the court.
On the other hand, they catered to KP for over half a season in the hope to jack his trade value up, and still had to send him out for depressed assets. We would have been better off trading KP in the previous offseason and we are probably going to be saying the same thing about Timmy before its done.
I keep harping on it and I dont care...until this guy is traded or benched I will scream at the top of my lungs...
He is the most selfish player in the league. I guess he is being told to shoot every chance he can get to try and up his value...but it is making him look so so much worse. Not only is he inefficient and streaky...he looks like a selfish, ball hog now to. This isnt the 90's anymore with hero ball...all the youngsters pass now...no one wants to play with a ball hog in the modern NBA.
You can call me "ignent" or any other name...but telling this dude to play within the flow of the offense would up his value more than whats being displayed currently. And I cant stand the excuse of "hes a volume shooter...if he aint doing that hes worthless"...I just completely disagree with that stance. I say take the green light to shoot away from him and make him play within the flow...or just make it mandatory he pass more. To sweep his selfishness under the rug as "hes worthless if not shooting" is unacceptable to me. Just bench the dude.
I cant believe the Mavs treat this guy like he is Steph Curry...beyond ridiculous. Force feeding this guy shots like he is some Unicorn in the league makes no sense. The guy is literally a dime a dozen player in this League...having him microwave for 30 every 4 games isnt going to turn teams on to him. No one wants this guys contract or streaky shooting or bad defense.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - Smitty - 11-03-2022
Luka_______12 _________ Din______7______Luka__5____
RB ___6____Din____6____ THJ______8_______RB__4___
DFS___8_____Green__4___ Green__4__RB__4__Green__4__
Wood __8____ DFS____4__ Wood_____7_____DFS__5_____
Maxi___8_____Powell__4___ Powell__4__Maxi__5__Wood__3__
My first attempt at a rotation. Only got through the first two quarters but you get the idea...
RE: ROSTER TALK: - dynamicalVoid - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 09:19 AM)Smitty Wrote: Luka_______12 _________ Din______7______Luka__5____
RB ___6____Din____6____ THJ______8_______RB__4___
DFS___8_____Green__4___ Green__4__RB__4__Green__4__
Wood __8____ DFS____4__ Wood_____7_____DFS__5_____
Maxi___8_____Powell__4___ Powell__4__Maxi__5__Wood__3__
My first attempt at a rotation. Only got through the first two quarters but you get the idea...
Too many THJ minutes
RE: ROSTER TALK: - DanSchwartzgan - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 09:19 AM)Smitty Wrote: Luka_______12 _________ Din______7______Luka__5____
RB ___6____Din____6____ THJ______8_______RB__4___
DFS___8_____Green__4___ Green__4__RB__4__Green__4__
Wood __8____ DFS____4__ Wood_____7_____DFS__5_____
Maxi___8_____Powell__4___ Powell__4__Maxi__5__Wood__3__
My first attempt at a rotation. Only got through the first two quarters but you get the idea...
Closing lineup needs another big. The don’t trust Wood defensively as a solo-big. So, they certainly won’t trust him to do it in the most important possessions of the game. I’ve played around with this too and it is difficult to make it work unless Dorian comes off the bench.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - mvossman - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 10:02 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: Closing lineup needs another big. The don’t trust Wood defensively as a solo-big. So, they certainly won’t trust him to do it in the most important possessions of the game. I’ve played around with this too and it is difficult to make it work unless Dorian comes off the bench.
I look at it this way:
Maxi/Wood/DFS/Bullock/Luka (starters and finishers)
Powell/DFS/Green/THJ/Luka (Wood breather)
Maxi/Wood/Green/Din/Luka (Dorian breather)
Wood/DFS/Bullock/Green/Din (Luka breather)
I have not tried to lay it out minutes wise, but I assume it could be done reasonably well. I found myself give way more minutes to Green than Bullock due to the need for defense (and the fact that Bullock has his head up his ass right now). Bullock will likely get at least some of those minutes.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - Smitty - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 09:19 AM)Smitty Wrote: Luka_______12 _________ Din______7______Luka__5____
RB ___6____Din____6____ THJ______8_______RB__4___
DFS___8_____Green__4___ Green__4__RB__4__Green__4__
Wood __8____ DFS____4__ Wood_____7_____DFS__5_____
Maxi___8_____Powell__4___ Powell__4__Maxi__5__Wood__3__
My first attempt at a rotation. Only got through the first two quarters but you get the idea...
Second half:
Luka_______9_____ Din__3_ Din___4___Luka______8_______
Green __6__Din_3__THJ__3_ Green__4__THJ___4___Din__4___
DFS____6____RB____6_____ RB___4___Green__4___DFS__4__
Wood __8____ __DFS___4__ Wood__4__DFS___4___Wood__4__
Maxi___6___Powell___6____ Maxi__4__Powell___4___Maxi__4___
Total minutes:
Luka 34
DFS 35
Wood 34
Din 27
Maxi 27
Green 24
Bullock 24
Powell 18
THJ 15
Starting LU: Luka - Bullock - DFS - Wood - Maxi
Closing LU: Luka - Din - DFS - Wood - Maxi
RE: ROSTER TALK: - SleepingHero - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 08:44 AM)dynamicalVoid Wrote: Just bench THJ. Im so over it.
I'm starting to get there as well. He's a black hole.
Under Carlisle he became an efficient 2-guard and one of our better contributors. Under Kidd, all his bad habits have come back. On the one hand I appreciate THJ when he creates a shot for himself as that is something maybe only 3 other guys can do on the roster.
Mavs need more guys who can create for themselves so it's hard to just bench Timmy but I'm starting to wonder if its worth putting up with his unexceptional defense and heat check 40fters with 20 seconds left in the shot clock.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - mvossman - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 11:26 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: I'm starting to get there as well. He's a black hole.
Under Carlisle he became an efficient 2-guard and one of our better contributors. Under Kidd, all his bad habits have come back. On the one hand I appreciate THJ when he creates a shot for himself as that is something maybe only 3 other guys can do on the roster.
Mavs need more guys who can create for themselves so it's hard to just bench Timmy but I'm starting to wonder if its worth putting up with his unexceptional defense and heat check 40fters with 20 seconds left in the shot clock.
I think Dan made a really good point that he is sucking shots away from Wood and Din. I feel like the best spot to put him is rotations with Powell/Luka like the old days. Add Dorian and Green for defense and guys that don't need a lot of shots and Timmy might be of some value.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - dynamicalVoid - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 11:26 AM)SleepingHero Wrote: I'm starting to get there as well. He's a black hole.
Under Carlisle he became an efficient 2-guard and one of our better contributors. Under Kidd, all his bad habits have come back. On the one hand I appreciate THJ when he creates a shot for himself as that is something maybe only 3 other guys can do on the roster.
Mavs need more guys who can create for themselves so it's hard to just bench Timmy but I'm starting to wonder if its worth putting up with his unexceptional defense and heat check 40fters with 20 seconds left in the shot clock.
The guy could be good for us. But he's compounding his flaws by launching every opportunity. We need someone that can score and take load off of Luka and Spencer. But...the guy just absolutely refuses to pass the ball. I hate everything about this guys game. I dont think hes being told to launch at the rate he launches...I think its him being oblivious to the flow of an offense coupled with what I believe is selfishness. Its a bad mix. I want him gone or benched.
What sucks is...hes got one of the best looking shots in the league mechanics wise. I wish he would just stop being selfish and make the best basketball play instead of chucking and never passing. We could use his scoring...but instead he is killing possessions by taking bad shots instead of passing. When I say bad shots...Im talking about not having to take every open shot just because youre open...if there is a better play to be made by passing he should do it but he doesnt. He shoots because he thinks hes Curry and hes selfish.
Bench this selfish scrub.
RE: ROSTER TALK: - dynamicalVoid - 11-03-2022
(11-03-2022, 11:37 AM)mvossman Wrote: I think Dan made a really good point that he is sucking shots away from Wood and Din. I feel like the best spot to put him is rotations with Powell/Luka like the old days. Add Dorian and Green for defense and guys that don't need a lot of shots and Timmy might be of some value.
Absolutely not.
I get what youre saying but I firmly oppose giving THJ shots over Green unless we are in a hole and need some microwave offense and hope THJ is on that night.
Green is timid on the offensive end. The only way to break that is by giving him minutes and letting him shoot. You are stunting him by putting him in lineups with THJ because THJ will shoot every shot. Green needs to break his lack of confidence and get in a rhythm...and I think we are starting to see that...taking away minutes or shot opportunities from Green is stunting him. The time to invest in Green is now. THJ can take a backseat.
Why waste any more time investing in THJ?