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+--- Thread: ROSTER TALK: Mavs favs for Vogel if no HC job exists. Kyrie handshake deal? (/showthread.php?tid=2173)
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RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - HoosierDaddyKid - 02-28-2023
(02-28-2023, 12:45 PM)sterlingmallory Wrote: I want to pick up Noel now that he's been bought out. Waive Morris, Pinson, or Ntilikina, I don't care who really. Pick up Noel, plant McGee on the bench, and roll with a Noel, Maxi, Wood, Powell big man rotation.
After that I'd like to waive McKinley Wright and pick up Eugene Omoruyi on a two way contract. Wright is too small and a pretty big negative on offense so I'd prefer to give his spot to Omoruyi. We desperately need big wings so he would be a solid prospect to pick up. I think we only waived him before because he got injured. Now that he's available again, we should pick him up again.
In Cuban's world, that's doing too much.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - Chicagojk - 02-28-2023
(02-28-2023, 12:45 PM)sterlingmallory Wrote: I want to pick up Noel now that he's been bought out. Waive Morris, Pinson, or Ntilikina, I don't care who really. Pick up Noel, plant McGee on the bench, and roll with a Noel, Maxi, Wood, Powell big man rotation.
After that I'd like to waive McKinley Wright and pick up Eugene Omoruyi on a two way contract. Wright is too small and a pretty big negative on offense so I'd prefer to give his spot to Omoruyi. We desperately need big wings so he would be a solid prospect to pick up. I think we only waived him before because he got injured. Now that he's available again, we should pick him up again.
Not a bad idea. I would be surprised to see Dallas move off Wright though. He is a solid G league player and had some nice runs. But I agree, his size and lack of shooting is what is probably stopping him from being a NBA player outside of the G-league. I don't think he is back. I would like to take a look at Eugene. He is at least a bigger body who could potentially fill in during the regular season if we had some injuries.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - Mavs2021 - 02-28-2023
(02-28-2023, 03:40 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: Not a bad idea. I would be surprised to see Dallas move off Wright though. He is a solid G league player and had some nice runs. But I agree, his size and lack of shooting is what is probably stopping him from being a NBA player outside of the G-league. I don't think he is back. I would like to take a look at Eugene. He is at least a bigger body who could potentially fill in during the regular season if we had some injuries.
The Legends have been the worst G-League franchise off all-time, so not sure that´s accurate or means much. It´s hilarious how they cannot produce any talent for the main roster or at least win sh*t with all these "veterans".
The Legends were in Denver for three seasons. Results: Finals, Semifinals, D-League Title.
Moved to Dallas in 2010: Won a play-off game for the first time in 2022.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - Chicagojk - 02-28-2023
(02-28-2023, 04:23 PM)Mavs2021 Wrote: The Legends have been the worst G-League franchise off all-time, so not sure that´s accurate or means much. It´s hilarious how they cannot produce any talent for the main roster or at least win sh*t with all these "veterans".
The Legends were in Denver for three seasons. Results: Finals, Semifinals, D-League Title.
Moved to Dallas in 2010: Won a play-off game for the first time in 2022.
They did bring back Justin Jackson to their G-league team which is the most ever Mavs move.
Justin is a great guy and a heck of a college player, but can we maybe have a little creativity there?
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - Chicagojk - 03-01-2023
- From a part of Hollinger's article in the Athletic this morning
- Dallas made the conference finals last year, has a 24-year-old superstar, and yet … looks just as desperate as everyone else, especially in the wake of Sunday’s collapse against the Lakers and Jason Kidd’s weird press conference afterward.
The Mavs have a familiar litany of issues for a team on this list. They’re already in next year’s tax, out of future draft picks and trying to hit on a quasi-reckless gamble (Kyrie Irving) after painting themselves into a corner with bad contracts and the needless own goal of Jalen Brunson’s departure. The Mavs also got bonus desperation points for starting a buyout guy (Justin Holiday, who couldn’t get minutes in Atlanta even as the Hawks were desperate for reliable wing play).
Keep an eye on this situation. Between Irving’s wandering eye for L.A. this summer, the potential of Luka Dončić’s frustration boiling over and Kidd’s history of things ending badly when they end, this could get a lot worse before it gets better.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - LifeAquatic - 03-01-2023
Without over reacting, and just for the sake of speculation, if the Mavs somehow in fantasy land cleaned house from owner to front office to coach, and we had a FO we believed could make sound decisions... how much would Luka fetch on the trade market realistically?
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - KillerLeft - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 11:49 AM)LifeAquatic Wrote: Without over reacting, and just for the sake of speculation, if the Mavs somehow in fantasy land cleaned house from owner to front office to coach, and we had a FO we believed could make sound decisions... how much would Luka fetch on the trade market realistically?
Luka NOW, towards the beginning of a rookie max extension (cost controlled, and not even on a real max yet) could bring an INSANE return.
Broad strokes, I’m thinking salary match with GOOD players, not junk, 5-7 picks and 2-4 swaps? Tough for any team to have more than that to offer, even.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - omahen - 03-01-2023
Mavs in the summer needed (their own words) vs What Mavs did
1. Resign Brunson vs bring in Kyrie for Brunson and SD. Tough to say they are actually better
2. Bring in rotation wing vs traded DFS. They actually got worse in this department instead of better. Green development helps, but they somehow refuse to play him lately. Unless of course you are convinced Holiday is an answer
3. Bring in a center vs signing a guy to a three year deal that is already out of rotation and traded FRP for a guy that they don't like and will be likely gone in the summer
Really looking forward to see how they intend to fill the obvious holes with even less assets. I have to stop saying same things over and over again...
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - cow - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 11:57 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: Luka NOW, towards the beginning of a rookie max extension (cost controlled, and not even on a real max yet) could bring an INSANE return.
Broad strokes, I’m thinking salary match with GOOD players, not junk, 5-7 picks and 2-4 swaps? Tough for any team to have more than that to offer, even.
OKC maybe though I haven't looked at their draft capital lately.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - chaparral - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 11:49 AM)LifeAquatic Wrote: Without over reacting, and just for the sake of speculation, if the Mavs somehow in fantasy land cleaned house from owner to front office to coach, and we had a FO we believed could make sound decisions... how much would Luka fetch on the trade market realistically?
We will know in a few years what Luka will net our beloved Mavs in return.
But to continue the sake of speculation. If we lose Wood and Kyrie this summer for nothing and then Luka requests a trade - would Cuban not become the laughingstock of the NBA. The only way Cubes could save face is sell the team.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - Chicagojk - 03-01-2023
The crazy thing is they are not far off if they just would hit on the simpler things.
I am not sold on Maxi as a high minute player. But a closing lineup of Luka, Kyrie, green/bullock and maxi is not bad. They just need that one big body to fill that group out. It is just real surprising they didn’t realize this or get it filled.
For short term it can be a PF or C. Center is probably easier to fill but in time they need to find that PF type.
But I am sick of giving them the benefit of the doubt that they are not far off. They have fumbled way too many chances.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - F Gump - 03-01-2023
I've said it many times, and it bears repeating ---
Until Cuban hires an EXPERT (and takes himself out of the equation, fully empowering the expert) to handle the player evaluation, negotiation, drafting, development, and all the other roster-building tasks, the Mavs will continue to blunder their way along. It's a GM's league, there are only 30 teams, and the competition has EXPERTS who are actively competing against the Mavs.
The fact that Cuban chose to replace Donnie with a man who has none of those skills, and will be learning on the job while competing against others who are miles ahead and also learning more skills, it was a terrible choice. They needed an expert, and got a kindergartner. While we are disappointed by what's going on, none of these results should be surprising.
They still have no clue how to get players who are two-way talents -- in particular, those who can defend -- so how are they going to fix this? Blind leading the blind.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - MaxiThreeba - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 11:57 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: Luka NOW, towards the beginning of a rookie max extension (cost controlled, and not even on a real max yet) could bring an INSANE return.
Broad strokes, I’m thinking salary match with GOOD players, not junk, 5-7 picks and 2-4 swaps? Tough for any team to have more than that to offer, even.
Tough to find a team that controls enough picks, youth and salary to even enter the conversation. In addition to ALL the picks, you would have to have a prime young talent to lead the package and be able to absorb a salary or two the Mavs want off the books.
Just taking a gander, would you feel like you did well if this season completely derailed and you netted the following from the Magic THIS offseason:
F. Wagner, Carter, Suggs, Bol, and Fultz and Harris as salary/flips for Luka, THJ and McGee? Magic could send their own picks in 2023, 2025, 2027 and 2029 plus the Bulls pick in 2023 and Denver's in 2025...along with pick swaps every other year....hell maybe the Mavs could actually get someone to SEND them 2nds as well! If this season spiraled completely on the Mavs, they could potentially hang on to a top 10 pick and 2024 and 2025 would obviously be high probability of picking top 10 as well, turning that pick owed to NY into a 2025 2nd.
There is no way to get fair value for Luka. It's an impossible exercise. Even on the Magic side of things, is Luka/Banchero enough for you to mortgage everything?
I sincerely hope there is a pathway forward for the Mavs. A Luka trade is just an impossible scenario to win.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - Chicagojk - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 12:36 PM)F Gump Wrote: I've said it many times, and it bears repeating ---I so want it to work, but you are probably right.
Until Cuban hires an EXPERT (and takes himself out of the equation, fully empowering the expert) to handle the player evaluation, negotiation, drafting, development, and all the other roster-building tasks, the Mavs will continue to blunder their way along. It's a GM's league, there are only 30 teams, and the competition has EXPERTS who are actively competing against the Mavs.
The fact that Cuban chose to replace Donnie with a man who has none of those skills, and will be learning on the job while competing against others who are miles ahead and also learning more skills, it was a terrible choice. They needed an expert, and got a kindergartner. While we are disappointed by what's going on, none of these results should be surprising.
They still have no clue how to get players who are two-way talents -- in particular, those who can defend -- so how are they going to fix this? Blind leading the blind.
It is probably not a apples to apples comparison, but look at what Boston did when Stevens took over as GM when Nico took over here. Boston had all their picks which the Mavs were a little limited. They had a deeper roster already, but they got off Kemba, took a gamble on Horford, traded for Derrick White and traded for Brogdon. All three may have weaknesses but they are just good players who fit their system. Look at the players Dallas has targeted over that same period of time. I keep waiting for Dallas to make these type of smart moves or calculated gambles but it never comes. Just more questionable "WTF" moves.
Just looking at some of our recent opponents, some of these guys have been available at certain times for different costs:
Vanderbilt- I was against offering a unprotected first for him, but he was great against us. Former second round pick in the Jalen draft
Naz Reid- Undrafted two years ago
Nic Batum- He wanted to stay in LAC but he would have been a really nice piece here
Kyle Anderson- Just a solid player. SA, Memphis and Minny have all had good runs with him. Nothing flashy but a skilled big player.
The league is filled with them. Most won't require first round picks, but you just need to be able to evaluate guys correctly and make smart decision.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - ItsGoTime - 03-01-2023
I posted a trade recently with the scenario that we realize trading Luka was the only way out of this mess. It was something to the effect of Luka/Bertans/THJ/McGee for OG/Siakam/FVV/Achiuwa/4 FRPs. Max out Kyrie and we’re going for a championship immediately with a team that has a semi-small window. There might have needed to be other pieces to make the money work, but this is the jist of it.
OKC would have the young package we are looking for with Giddy/Dort and up to something like 14 picks.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - omahen - 03-01-2023
With Luka and Kai, Mavs need an elite defender, if not two. Not just a good defender. Elite one.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - SwisherPrice - 03-01-2023
Their main offseason priority will be to re-sign Justin Holiday probably. Considering he has only been here a week and has already earned Kidd's trust as a starter/closer
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - MaxiThreeba - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 01:18 PM)SwisherPrice Wrote: Their main offseason priority will be to re-sign Justin Holiday probably. Considering he has only been here a week and has already earned Kidd's trust as a starter/closer
When Kidd put him back in the game to inbound the ball at the end, I had to laugh.
Based on the negotiating skills of this FO...they may have guaranteed Holiday things to land their BIG FISH!
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - cow - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 12:36 PM)F Gump Wrote: I've said it many times, and it bears repeating ---
Until Cuban hires an EXPERT (and takes himself out of the equation, fully empowering the expert) to handle the player evaluation, negotiation, drafting, development, and all the other roster-building tasks, the Mavs will continue to blunder their way along. It's a GM's league, there are only 30 teams, and the competition has EXPERTS who are actively competing against the Mavs.
The fact that Cuban chose to replace Donnie with a man who has none of those skills, and will be learning on the job while competing against others who are miles ahead and also learning more skills, it was a terrible choice. They needed an expert, and got a kindergartner. While we are disappointed by what's going on, none of these results should be surprising.
They still have no clue how to get players who are two-way talents -- in particular, those who can defend -- so how are they going to fix this? Blind leading the blind.
Agreed. They've also had the bad habit of collecting and paying too many one dimensional players. The days of specialists, unless you are a top flight defender, are quickly coming to an end in the NBA, especially on heftier contracts.
I also think most teams would have issues building around Luka. He's a transcendent offensive talent, but is a liability on the other end of the floor (some of that by his own choosing) and for as good is offensively, he's shown he doesn't naturally mesh with other players who need the ball. KP was disaster but even Jalen, Din and now Kyrie feels more like a my-turn-your-turn situation than an offense.
RE: ROSTER TALK: Maxi delayed a bit longer, Prob out vs. Lakers | Holiday 15pts in debut - ItsGoTime - 03-01-2023
(03-01-2023, 02:04 PM)MaxiThreeba Wrote: When Kidd put him back in the game to inbound the ball at the end, I had to laugh.To be fair, this is seemingly how the Suns landed our first target.
Based on the negotiating skills of this FO...they may have guaranteed Holiday things to land their BIG FISH!