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+--- Thread: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST (/showthread.php?tid=3856)
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RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - SleepingHero - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 09:07 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: With Miami, San Antonio, Minny, Houston and Toronto all I treated but not really giving premium value for KD, I wonder if another team jumps in that gives a better offer, but not great? I am going to throw out the Clippers and Detroit. Detroit being the most intriguing.
I think it's hard for another team to really invest significant assets into a KD deal when he can just walk after 1 season.
It's the Kawhi/Toronto situation all over again. Except KD is 37.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - KillerLeft - 06-21-2025
I'm seeing/hearing more and more about this Dallas interest in Jrue Holiday. We've talked about it a lot already, but here's where I am:
I don't think he's done, and in some ways I think he's exactly what this team needs. He fits the mold of what we know Harrison likes. He's hugely respected across the league and would be a good get in the locker room, that's for sure. The age doesn't scare me so much, but is a negative. The contract is pretty concerning. I really wouldn't want to give up a pick or picks for him, but I'm not sure they'd have to.
I'm sure this has been covered already, so forgive me, but it seems like the contract would force Dallas to include players that it would hurt to lose. What is the least objectionable package the Mavs could put together that would satisfy the rules of legal trades? I think Gafford would be in the deal for sure, and then it would have to include either PJW or Thompson, correct?
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - DanSchwartzgan - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 12:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I'm seeing/hearing more and more about this Dallas interest in Jrue Holiday. We've talked about it a lot already, but here's where I am:
I don't think he's done, and in some ways I think he's exactly what this team needs. He fits the mold of what we know Harrison likes. He's hugely respected across the league and would be a good get in the locker room, that's for sure. The age doesn't scare me so much, but is a negative. The contract is pretty concerning. I really wouldn't want to give up a pick or picks for him, but I'm not sure they'd have to.
I'm sure this has been covered already, so forgive me, but it seems like the contract would force Dallas to include players that it would hurt to lose. What is the least objectionable package the Mavs could put together that would satisfy the rules of legal trades? I think Gafford would be in the deal for sure, and then it would have to include either PJW or Thompson, correct?
Above the first apron, you have to send more than you take. Jrue is $32.4mm, so that is the number you need to get to. I'm opposed to Gafford plus PJ. I'm OK with, but doubt it would be Gafford + Klay. If you take those off the table, then you get to within $2.4mm of what you need with Gafford, Martin and Hardy. So, you just have to add OMax or Powell.
However, you have to stay below apron 2 to aggregate like this. So, you have to do the math on what you have left once you refill the roster since this is a 4 for 1. This is where Kyrie comes into the picture. You can put Jrue in place of Gafford and minimums in place of Martin, Hardy and OMax and a second rounder in the 15th slot if Kyrie comes in at about $37.7mm. Then it is a matter of how far below the 2nd apron you want to be. If $700k, then Kyrie starts at $37.0mm (Or, Powell is outgoing instead of OMax or Christie is outgoing instead of Hardy).
This is why almost every post I do has some version of wanting to know Kyrie's number because almost everything we discuss is dependent on that number. Thankfully, the reporting is that he's working with the team. So, what we need to hear is he's opted out and they've agreed to a number with some flexibility depending on team needs.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Winter - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 12:22 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: I'm seeing/hearing more and more about this Dallas interest in Jrue Holiday. We've talked about it a lot already, but here's where I am:
I don't think he's done, and in some ways I think he's exactly what this team needs. He fits the mold of what we know Harrison likes. He's hugely respected across the league and would be a good get in the locker room, that's for sure. The age doesn't scare me so much, but is a negative. The contract is pretty concerning. I really wouldn't want to give up a pick or picks for him, but I'm not sure they'd have to.
I'm sure this has been covered already, so forgive me, but it seems like the contract would force Dallas to include players that it would hurt to lose. What is the least objectionable package the Mavs could put together that would satisfy the rules of legal trades? I think Gafford would be in the deal for sure, and then it would have to include either PJW or Thompson, correct?
If the deal is a straight trade to Boston, I would think Gafford and PJ. I tend to think a multi-team trade is more likely.
Issac with Locked on Mavs heard a Jrue Holiday trade from another source that he kind of liked - and this was the first one he had seen that he might be intrested in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sr1uXfe_88Q
I think it's near the end ... at about the 26:35 marker. Four teams are involved, but essentially the Mavs lose Gafford, Martin, and Hardy (to Atlanta and Brooklyn). The end result in the trade for the Mavs is Holiday and 2-3 draft picks. 2 of them are first-round picks. I can't actually remember what Boston gets.
This won't happen of course, but I think this kind of multi-team trade is the only way I could be happy with the result. I simply can't get my mind around losing Gafford AND PJ in one swing of the bat for a 35-year old PG.
On top of that, what's this team going to look like in two years with an aging Kyrie, AD, and Jrue (fortunately I think Klay will be gone by then). This is about to be a very old team in a very short time.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - DanSchwartzgan - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 12:45 PM)Winter Wrote:
Issac with Locked on Mavs heard a Jrue Holiday trade from another source that he kind of liked - and this was the first one he had seen that he might be intrested in.
It is the CBA Mav's trade that Chicago posted earlier:
Fake Jrue trade from
@CBAMavs
DAL sends Caleb Martin to BOS
DAL sends Jaden Hardy to BRK
DAL sends Daniel Gafford to ATL
BOS sends Jrue Holiday to DAL
BOS sends 28th pick and 32nd pick to DAL
BOS sends future 2nd to BRK
ATL sends 22nd and future 2nd to DAL
Would you do it?
Mavs(New)CBA
@CBAMavs
We do need to add in OMax or Powell. My bad on that
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Winter - 06-21-2025
Oh thanks, I must have glossed over that.
At least I could live with something like that. Any scenario that we give up Gafford and PJ for Jrue is a hard no for me.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Chicagojk - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 01:14 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: It is the CBA Mav's trade that Chicago posted earlier:
Fake Jrue trade from
@CBAMavs
DAL sends Caleb Martin to BOS
DAL sends Jaden Hardy to BRK
DAL sends Daniel Gafford to ATL
BOS sends Jrue Holiday to DAL
BOS sends 28th pick and 32nd pick to DAL
BOS sends future 2nd to BRK
ATL sends 22nd and future 2nd to DAL
Would you do it?
Mavs(New)CBA
@CBAMavs
We do need to add in OMax or Powell. My bad on that
I was thinking. In evaluating this trade blew should remove pick 28 and 32 because we know Nico leaves picks on the table
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - DanSchwartzgan - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 01:14 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: It is the CBA Mav's trade that Chicago posted earlier:
Fake Jrue trade from
@CBAMavs
DAL sends Caleb Martin to BOS
DAL sends Jaden Hardy to BRK
DAL sends Daniel Gafford to ATL
BOS sends Jrue Holiday to DAL
BOS sends 28th pick and 32nd pick to DAL
BOS sends future 2nd to BRK
ATL sends 22nd and future 2nd to DAL
Would you do it?
Mavs(New)CBA
@CBAMavs
We do need to add in OMax or Powell. My bad on that
So, let's break this down...
I can see Atlanta taking Gafford for #22. There are rumors out there of their interest in something like this.
The Brooklyn part is interesting to me. I don't see the fit of Hardy with Cam Thomas on the roster. But, would you rather have Hardy at $6mm and use your space on something else. Or, would you rather give Cam Thomas a bigger contract (maybe triple what Hardy makes). We also need to find a home for either Powell or OMax. With all of the draft capital they have, do they give up a late first for Hardy/OMax? If I were them, I'd ask for Christie/Omax and give up some of their excess draft capital that they can't use anyway.
Where I have trouble is the financial savings of Jrue for Martin (both are 3 years remaining) being worth 28 and 32. Can Nico extract this? It is probably worth doing if all you get is 32. Dallas doesn't really need #22, #32 and possibly a late first from Brooklyn. Maybe Boston demands #22 as a face saving maneuver, but gives up #28 in the process instead of #32. Then Boston can say they got Gafford's value from Atlanta, but Dallas can say it didn't give up a first...and in fact, got a first from Boston for taking on Jrue. There is a lot of possible play given all of the late first rounders that could be involved in such a construct.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - RasheedsBigWhiteSpot - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 02:08 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: So, let's break this down...
I can see Atlanta taking Gafford for #22. There are rumors out there of their interest in something like this.
The Brooklyn part is interesting to me. I don't see the fit of Hardy with Cam Thomas on the roster. But, would you rather have Hardy at $6mm and use your space on something else. Or, would you rather give Cam Thomas a bigger contract (maybe triple what Hardy makes). We also need to find a home for either Powell or OMax. With all of the draft capital they have, do they give up a late first for Hardy/OMax? If I were them, I'd ask for Christie/Omax and give up some of their excess draft capital that they can't use anyway.
Where I have trouble is the financial savings of Jrue for Martin (both are 3 years remaining) being worth 28 and 32. Can Nico extract this? It is probably worth doing if all you get is 32. Dallas doesn't really need #22, #32 and possibly a late first from Brooklyn. Maybe Boston demands #22 as a face saving maneuver, but gives up #28 in the process instead of #32. Then Boston can say they got Gafford's value from Atlanta, but Dallas can say it didn't give up a first...and in fact, got a first from Boston for taking on Jrue. There is a lot of possible play given all of the late first rounders that could be involved in such a construct.
Seriously? Boston is lopping off $70 million in longterm money + the mind blowing taxes added on that's owed to a mid-30s player and you think them giving up #28 and #32 is too much? Nah, in today's NBA economics that should be worth both late 1sts AND a future 1st.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Winter - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 02:08 PM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: So, let's break this down...
I can see Atlanta taking Gafford for #22. There are rumors out there of their interest in something like this.
The Brooklyn part is interesting to me. I don't see the fit of Hardy with Cam Thomas on the roster. But, would you rather have Hardy at $6mm and use your space on something else. Or, would you rather give Cam Thomas a bigger contract (maybe triple what Hardy makes). We also need to find a home for either Powell or OMax. With all of the draft capital they have, do they give up a late first for Hardy/OMax? If I were them, I'd ask for Christie/Omax and give up some of their excess draft capital that they can't use anyway.
Where I have trouble is the financial savings of Jrue for Martin (both are 3 years remaining) being worth 28 and 32. Can Nico extract this? It is probably worth doing if all you get is 32. Dallas doesn't really need #22, #32 and possibly a late first from Brooklyn. Maybe Boston demands #22 as a face saving maneuver, but gives up #28 in the process instead of #32. Then Boston can say they got Gafford's value from Atlanta, but Dallas can say it didn't give up a first...and in fact, got a first from Boston for taking on Jrue. There is a lot of possible play given all of the late first rounders that could be involved in such a construct.
I think there is enough in there to make that trade (or some variation).
It has some warts in regards to the future. If Nico decided to pound his fist on the "Win Now" theme, the trade is something he might like. I'm not sure about the fan base. I'm on the fence only because we didn't give up PJ ...and we have a shot at some more draft picks.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - FireNicoHarrison - 06-21-2025
Boston is desperated, they need to dump someone.
I think Jrue will not put us in the contending group so it's just a rental to next 3 years when him, Irving & street clothes will be out the city and we can start Flagg dynasty.
2/3 picks for that gift is ok for me.
And of course fire Harrison in december.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Ghost of Podkolzin - 06-21-2025
Jrue is still considered a top wing defender. I think he can be gotten for salary dump. Martin/Klay/Hardy works.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - KillerLeft - 06-21-2025
Okay, so Holiday, Sexton, Coby White...I've seen Simons mentioned, and he's a great scorer. Is he really available, do we think? I don't think Portland is the best fit, given they have no need for Gafford, but is he actually available?
Who else is being shopped?
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - F Gump - 06-21-2025
(06-21-2025, 06:46 PM)Ghost of Podkolzin Wrote: Jrue is still considered a top wing defender. I think he can be gotten for salary dump. Martin/Klay/Hardy works.
"Martin/Klay/Hardy works" -- unfortunately it does not
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - DL2RimRocker - 06-22-2025
(06-21-2025, 11:44 PM)F Gump Wrote: "Martin/Klay/Hardy works" -- unfortunately it does not
Curious as to why it doesnt work?
Salaries are less than 140k difference.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Winter - 06-22-2025
(06-21-2025, 10:48 PM)KillerLeft Wrote: Okay, so Holiday, Sexton, Coby White...I've seen Simons mentioned, and he's a great scorer. Is he really available, do we think? I don't think Portland is the best fit, given they have no need for Gafford, but is he actually available?
Who else is being shopped?
If we are making a list, I guess you add L Ball. Also Tyus Jones.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - DanSchwartzgan - 06-22-2025
(06-22-2025, 02:32 AM)DL2RimRocker Wrote: Curious as to why it doesnt work?
Salaries are less than 140k difference.
Two issues. As a first or second apron team, we can't take back more than we send. It is only $139k, but it is $139k in the wrong direction. Second, we are technically a second apron team currently which means we can't aggregate outgoing salary. So, we either have to send out enough additional salary to get under the second apron (about $3.5mm) or you have to make assumptions about Kyrie opting out and signing for less. You could also make a dent in that $3.5mm number by rostering only 14 players or having a second rounder instead of a vet min in that 15th slot.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Chicagojk - 06-22-2025
The Magic offered Cole Anthony, Jonathan Isaac, and two first-round picks to the Bulls for Coby White, per @LockedOnBulls
(h/t @BallReportX)
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Winter - 06-22-2025
(06-22-2025, 07:39 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: The Magic offered Cole Anthony, Jonathan Isaac, and two first-round picks to the Bulls for Coby White, per @LockedOnBulls
(h/t @BallReportX)
Damn. Nice offer.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: - Smitty - 06-22-2025
(06-22-2025, 07:39 AM)Chicagojk Wrote: The Magic offered Cole Anthony, Jonathan Isaac, and two first-round picks to the Bulls for Coby White, per @LockedOnBulls
(h/t @BallReportX)
That’s way too rich for me. White is probably my favorite guard, of all the ones connected with the Mavs, but that makes me think the Bulls are keeping him.
The idea of trading for Sexton is becoming more palatable each day.
Please NO Jrue Holiday. We will hate what Nico PAYS for him. Those of you thinking the Mavs will get picks back in a Jrue deal, haven’t been paying attention.