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RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - RoyTarpleysGhost - 07-15-2025
I can't even make up trades anymore with the new apron rules.
Gafford to Memphis
PJ Washington, Caleb Martin, KCP to Cleveland
Garland to Dallas
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - KillerLeft - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:04 AM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: I can't even make up trades anymore with the new apron rules.
Gafford to Memphis
PJ Washington to Cleveland
Garland to Dallas
+ a bunch of other crap
I hear you on the cap stuff. I have no idea if this is legal, either, but for the record I'd be into it.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - RoyTarpleysGhost - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:04 AM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: I can't even make up trades anymore with the new apron rules.
Gafford to Memphis
PJ Washington, Caleb Martin, KCP to Cleveland
Garland to Dallas
ESPN trade machine says this is legal. LMAO. (I guess KCP can be traded again?)
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - RoyTarpleysGhost - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:06 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: but for the record I'd be into it.
Oh for sure. I've been trying to turn Gafford and PJ into a really good young PG all summer.
Garland/Flagg/Lively is a nice trio for the future.
I won't be able to sleep now. Great
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - F Gump - 07-15-2025
ABOUT CLE AND LEBRON AND AGGREGATION
For Cavs to receive in trade LBJ's 52M salary, the rules say they cannot add multiple salaries together to do so (since they are over A2 by a lot). They would have to end the trade under A2, and remain under A2 afterwards (iow, re-fill the roster), in order to match his salary with a package of smaller salaries added together. It would not matter where they sent the various players in that trade, if it's a multi-team one..
But -- the Mavs are under A2, so they have no such restriction to take LBJ. The Mavs' issue is what 52M of salaries makes sense (if any) and how they would have room to re-fill the roster and end up under A2. Technically it's possible, but would it be worth it?
ABOUT THE RUMORS
I have not seen them, so I am only reacting to things posted here. But someone said this is only a minor trade looming (if any of it is even true). So maybe this is about cap room and roster space and that sort of stuff and not some big name package of significance. [More likely imo it's just people feeding their boredom.]
But if you want a minor idea, do we go back to the "Ball for Hardy-Powell" framework that is an exact salary match and opens up a roster spot. However, it doesn't open up cap room, which the Mavs need, so a need for a 3rd team to take some salary, and you include several of Martin, Powell, Hardy, Omax going here or there.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - mvossman - 07-15-2025
Don't think we have the assets for Garland.
I would be very happy with something like Caleb Martin for Ball. Would make that trade a little less painful.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - SleepingHero - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:04 AM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: I can't even make up trades anymore with the new apron rules.
Gafford to Memphis
PJ Washington, Caleb Martin, KCP to Cleveland
Garland to Dallas
Unfortunately KCP cannot be added in a trade along with other players due to just recently being traded himself. That restriction lifts on August 15th.
There is also another error in your trade. Because CLE is a 2nd apron team, they cannot, under any circumstances, take back more salary in a trade than they are sending out. They also are not allowed to send out more than 1 player in any trade (unless in a trade they go below the 2nd apron).
The new rules do seem complicated at first, but the CBA FAQ on the front page is a good guideline to reference when making a deal.
The ESPN trade machine is outdated and does not have the ability to recognize apron triggers.
https://fanspo.com/nba/trade-machine
This is the best trade machine currently imo. It also has issues at times, namely recognizing extensions/base year deals. But overall its good enough 90% of the time.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - mvossman - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:15 AM)F Gump Wrote: ABOUT CLE AND LEBRON AND AGGREGATION
For Cavs to receive in trade LBJ's 52M salary, the rules say they cannot add multiple salaries together to do so (since they are over A2 by a lot). They would have to end the trade under A2, and remain under A2 afterwards (iow, re-fill the roster), in order to match his salary with a package of smaller salaries added together. It would not matter where they sent the various players in that trade, if it's a multi-team one..
But -- the Mavs are under A2, so they have no such restriction to take LBJ. The Mavs' issue is what 52M of salaries makes sense (if any) and how they would have room to re-fill the roster and end up under A2. Technically it's possible, but would it be worth it?
ABOUT THE RUMORS
I have not seen them, so I am only reacting to things posted here. But someone said this is only a minor trade looming (if any of it is even true). So maybe this is about cap room and roster space and that sort of stuff and not some big name package of significance. [More likely imo it's just people feeding their boredom.]
But if you want a minor idea, do we go back to the "Ball for Hardy-Powell" framework that is an exact salary match and opens up a roster spot. However, it doesn't open up cap room, which the Mavs need, so a need for a 3rd team to take some salary, and you include several of Martin, Powell, Hardy, Omax going here or there.
I would be more than happy with that kind of deal.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - KillerLeft - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:18 AM)mvossman Wrote: Don't think we have the assets for Garland.
I would be very happy with something like Caleb Martin for Ball. Would make that trade a little less painful.
Good way to get off of Martin, too, if that's what they want, because Ball has a team option for season after this one.
I just don't know what that would have to do with Gafford to Memphis, or any sort of 4-team deal. Maybe some of the rumors are right and some are made up, though. Maybe they're all made up.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - mvossman - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:21 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: Good way to get off of Martin, too, if that's what they want, because Ball has a team option for season after this one.
I just don't know what that would have to do with Gafford to Memphis, or any sort of 4-team deal. Maybe some of the rumors are right and some are made up, though. Maybe they're all made up.
I like Gump's idea that we are moving some salary to them. Doesn't have to involve Gafford.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - F Gump - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:06 AM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: ESPN trade machine says this is legal. LMAO. (I guess KCP can be traded again?)
The trade rules are ultra-confusing these days, because team salary changes the rules from team to team. It's not just confusing to us -- fwiw, ESPN trade machine is no longer reliable. It's good on helping match up salaries in general, but I have found I have to manually double check some of the issues. And it works both ways - sometimes it approves deals that are bad, other times it turns down ones that are ok. (I'm not commenting on any specific trade, just saying).
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - KillerLeft - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:24 AM)mvossman Wrote: I like Gump's idea that we are moving some salary to them. Doesn't have to involve Gafford.
Oh, for sure. THAT idea doesn't. But the rumor explicitly mentions Gafford. That's what got us all talking.
And...you really can't see a Garland deal? I might be uber naive, but I think I can. Maybe I value Gafford more than you guys, lol.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - KillerLeft - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:25 AM)F Gump Wrote: The trade rules are ultra-confusing these days, because team salary changes the rules from team to team. It's not just confusing to us -- fwiw, ESPN trade machine is no longer reliable. It's good on helping match up salaries in general, but I have found I have to manually double check some of the issues. And it works both ways - sometimes it approves deals that are bad, other times it turns down ones that are ok. (I'm not commenting on any specific trade, just saying).
I feel like someone able to create a trade machine that actually worked with the rules and maintain it to stay up to date could find a way to monetize that effort pretty easily. You should look into that.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - mvossman - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:27 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: Oh, for sure. THAT idea doesn't. But the rumor explicitly mentions Gafford. That's what got us all talking.
And...you really can't see a Garland deal? I might be uber naive, but I think I can. Maybe I value Gafford more than you guys, lol.
I guess I messed the mention of Gafford with all of the rumors.
Garland would be worth multiple firsts. Gafford might be worth one. It does not make sense for them to spend all of their assets for basically another Kyrie (not yet). Not sure how it makes sense for Cleaveland either.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - RoyTarpleysGhost - 07-15-2025
Brian Windhorst said last month that Garland could be available.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1l5548c/brian_windhorst_on_potential_changes_coming_to/
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - KillerLeft - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:40 AM)RoyTarpleysGhost Wrote: Brian Windhorst said last month that Garland could be available.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1l5548c/brian_windhorst_on_potential_changes_coming_to/
Dude…you’re doing your very best to get my hopes up.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - F Gump - 07-15-2025
1 GARLAND. I can't imagine Mavs would be trying to trade for an INJURED player (Garland) since some of the problem they would be addressing is covering for Kyrie being injured. Then again, Nico stupidly did that with AD and Martin, so maybe he's stupid enough to do it again. Hope not.
2 LEBRON. Technically you can match his salary in several ways, but it's a pile of players. (I don't like it, but it's doable, and you need a 3rd team to take a bigger salary so the Mavs can have room to refill the roster.) But with all the assets it takes to match LBJ, don't you need more than 1 year commitment from him?
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - SleepingHero - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:32 AM)mvossman Wrote: I guess I messed the mention of Gafford with all of the rumors.
Garland would be worth multiple firsts. Gafford might be worth one. It does not make sense for them to spend all of their assets for basically another Kyrie (not yet). Not sure how it makes sense for Cleaveland either.
Well I can see the Cavs wanting to either reduce their salary OR go in a different direction. They have the most expensive roster in the NBA and are facing a 142 mil tax bill.
That is a lot of money for a team that couldn't make the ECF in a historically weak East. Garland was hurt during their run, but I can see the GM thinking a Garland+Mitchell backcourt has run its course.
What if the Grizzlies are ready for a mini rebuild?
Morant to CLE. Garland to Dallas. Role players and stuff to MEM. CLE doesn't save any money with this, but they do remain ultra competitive with a new look PG next to Mitchell. Morant is a better scorer than Garland, a little bit worse of a facilitator. When all things are working he's a better player, but has injury concerns.
MEM has been cutting salary this summer as well as reworking the entire roster. I can see them wanting to just hit restart and work around JJJ. A bunch of role players from the Mavs + picks could be enticing for a Morant package given his value isn't THAT high.
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - KillerLeft - 07-15-2025
(07-15-2025, 01:55 AM)F Gump Wrote: 1 GARLAND. I can't imagine Mavs would be trying to trade for an INJURED player (Garland) since some of the problem they would be addressing is covering for Kyrie being injured. Then again, Nico stupidly did that with AD and Martin, so maybe he's stupid enough to do it again. Hope not.
He’s not that hurt, he just won’t be ready for the very beginning of the season (by a matter of a few weeks). I don’t like his fit with Kyrie playing together, as someone else mentioned already, but do you really not see value in adding a 25 year old Darius garland to the team? I think it’s much more easily shot down by saying Dallas can’t pull it off than by saying they wouldn’t want to do it…
RE: Trade & FA 2025-26: Free Agency Starts 5pm CST/6pm EST - DanSchwartzgan - 07-15-2025
Late to the party, and haven't read the Twitter rumors. But, my first thought when I first started reading posts was Donovan Mitchell. To me, he makes more sense in Dallas than Garland. The other thought I had was Jarrett Allen to LA with Gafford back-filling to Cleveland. You can overcome the aggregation issues for Cleveland by dividing things into two stand alone deals.
I came up with two versions that salary match. Klay, Gafford, Martin and Hardy adds $250k to Dallas salary. Klay, Gafford and PJ adds $1.1mm. Note that it isn't enough to just get the deal to barely work financially for Dallas. You have to also account for filling in the needed roster spots with minimums. The second deal (3 for 1), creates roster room to add Exum and K. Jones. But, it doesn't create room under the second apron.
That's the issue with barely legal constructs (I think SH had something similarly tight for Garland a few pages back). You have to create some extra space to fill out the roster and create a sufficient margin under the second apron. You typically have to add more salary (and probably send at least one of the outgoing players to an additional team). FWIW, I had Jarrett Allen going to LA for Rui in the second stand alone deal involving these three teams.