TRADE: KAT to NYK | Randle+ Divencenzo to MIN

[Mavs2021]

Respect to the Knicks. How long did this complete re-build take? 3-5 years? We were rebuilding for a decade around Dirk with the stupid Cuban ideas. It´s unreal how long it took the NBA to understand re-trade value of younger players. We could have signed Markkanen and Randle for about 25M six years ago and turned them into KAT, Mitchell, Sexton and about 3-4 first round picks, if he wanted to. Instead they signed guys like DAJ to one year contracts.

As for this trade. I´m not sure. New York will make or break KAT. He does not seem like the type of player that will thrive under the brightest lights, but we´ll see. 

On Minnesota´s side this could go very right or very wrong. Will DiVincenzo be able to replicate his hot form outside of Villanewyorka. 

How do you solve the Randle/Gobert situation? The smart thing to do for Minnesota might be to take care of Randle´s contract extension immediately to sell him on a 6th man role. When he came off the bench in New Orleans he dished out 21/9/3 and his 3pt percentage jumped by 12%. Plus he´s a good passer and Minnesota doesn´t have any true PG besides ancient Conley.

If they don´t do the bolded part, I think it might become a lot more complicated. Randle is 29 years old. This will likely he his last big contract. He´s in the prime of his career, so while there is no evidence of him being a bad apple, you have to assume he wants to get paid and would not be pleased with a bench role.

[Mavs2021]

Looking at Spotrac post-trade salaries for NY, it appears that the Knicks had cap flexibility to end up with the payroll that results from KAT for Randle/DD, but the issue was the trade itself didn't match. The end payroll result has NY with room to keep player 14 and then landing around 188.1M. They can't cross the 2nd apron of 189.931M.

The trade match itself for NY requires a dollar-for-dollar match, so they need to send out another 9M or so.

It looks like DQJ is getting a really nice contract out of the deal for a scrub player. CHA is over the cap, but best guess is they will be using their 7.983M Room MLE as a TPE under the new rules. That's still about $1M short of a match, so they will need to send a player off their roster that isn't newly signed, who CHA can also take legally. My guess is Bates-Diop (minimum salary) is the other player, while DQJ gets the bulk of the $7.983M room MLE, whatever is the smallest remainder it takes to make the KAT trade legal. That number will be around 6.2M if my math is correct.

I also suspect CHA will get the WAS 1st rounder owed to NY for eating all this ugly salary. It has modest protections (its best outcome would be a pick near the bottom of the lottery in 25 or 26).

You overrate Charlotte´s management. They probably send three 2nd round picks out of gratitude that they are in the national NBA news again.

[SleepingHero]

SH, re your notes on Randle --
1 Worst case scenario seems like they let him walk in 2025 and enjoy the salary savings. This deal alone essentially washes the bloated KAT salary, which was their goal. But ...
2  Why wouldn't they now try to find a taker for JR asap, by looking for a team who needs a scorer/star at a relatively accommodating price? Maybe try to get back a pick, and a useful role player piece with a smaller salary (along with some cheap discardable parts)?

Responding to your 1), the more I look at this trade, the more I see this as MIN ownership just being unable to afford this roster. This definitely feels like a major salary dump move but in a way that they got the most talent available, which you already highlighted originally.

Which leads to 2), I just don't see the market for Julius Randle. The number of teams that need a player like that and could offer something are slim. The contending teams aren't going to be thrilled spending a lot of assets for a player who is expiring. The tanking teams are all in on Cooper Flagg and Randle will win a couple of games on his own. Furthermore, he was adamant about a 4 year max extension with the Knicks that they balked on. So much like Brandon Ingram, the team that's trading for him better be ready to pay a lot of money to Randle. And him at that ~28 number he's currently on is great. Randle at almost double that number is nauseating. 

Another small thing is Randle is coming off of shoulder surgery this summer. Is he even going to look the same? I've seen Minnesota fans already say Randle will be coming off the bench, is he going to be happy about being relegated back to the bench if that's the case? 

So many wrinkles here that makes me really wonder why MIN did this trade right now. They could have ran it back for at least 1 more season and then had a mini blow up trading KAT/Gobert. Instead it feels like they panicked/settled on an ill fitting guy and potentially nuked their team chemistry.

[SleepingHero]

As for this trade. I´m not sure. New York will make or break KAT. He does not seem like the type of player that will thrive under the brightest lights, but we´ll see. 

I was just thinking about this, this morning. KAT historically has choked in the playoffs majorly. He's shown that he shrinks when the pressure gets the biggest. How will adjust being in probably the highest pressure arena in the league? 

This isn't like Minnesota where KAT could effectively hide. Heck I mean he disappeared in the WCF shooting 38% from the field and 24% from 3 and all we could hear about in the national media was clowning Gobert. 

What will happen if KAT has a 10 game bad shooting stretch? What about if he fizzles in the playoffs like he's historically done?

[Chicagojk]

Well, Hollinger says while the Knicks got the best player, his numbers think the Wolves get better by 3 games. While the Knicks are in a win now situation, his numbers think they get worse 2.5 games.

I just find it easier to envision this working out better for the Knicks though.

Maybe it is the sign of the times with the new cap. Wolves trade a scary contract for less certainty. They have an older Conley and Gobert who still played well last year but is older. They invested in a young guard in the draft and have Naz Reid (for one more year) at a value contract. But they traded some level of certainty for a lot of uncertainty with fit and potential free agency.

[SleepingHero]

@TheDunkCentral
Donte DiVincenzo reportedly didn’t like the idea of playing a reduced role with the Knicks, per @IanBegley


“DiVincenzo was probably going to be coming off the bench this season. Bridges would likely have taken his spot in the starting lineup. I can say confidently that DiVincenzo didn’t exactly love the idea of playing fewer minutes/a reduced role this season. He was coming off of a career year and helped the team win a ton of games when it was shorthanded.”

[DallasMaverick]

From the ESPN article:

…especially needed on a Wolves team that was already a bit light in that area and now is losing Towns, one of the best shooting big men in the league.

Apparently, ESPN’s opinion of KAT’s shooting is a bit lower than his own.

[SleepingHero]

@DaneMooreNBA
The Wolves’ perspective on this, as I can gather on a Friday night, is they like the optionality this trade gives them in the Anthony Edwards window — and the added opportunity within that time that it grants Naz Reid and Jaden McDaniels, who should be peaking at the same time as Ant.

Making this trade doesn’t necessarily save money, but it could provide financial optionality over the next few years into Ant’s prime. The Wolves felt they needed to not be locked into one path with Ant.

The question will be how much the trade off from Karl-Anthony Towns to Julius Randle and Donte DiVincenzo costs them in terms of production in the immediate.

New York’s more recent willingness to include DiVincenzo, along with the 1st via Detroit, is what activated these trade talks. The Wolves pursued DiVincenzo during his 2023 free agency and are big fans of his.

[RGP1981]

What is Minnesota's main rotation now?

Conley/Dillingham, Edwards/DDV, McDaniels, Randle/Reid, Gobert/Reid

The spacing is yuck.

Whoever is in charge of the money at the Mavericks should make a huge play for Anthony Edwards behind the scenes.

*cough, tap him up before the Lakers do, cough, Kyrie + all available Mavs picks, cough*

Future Mavs starting 5: Grimes, Antman, Luka, PJW, Giraffe

(Just realized we can spell Giraffe with the letters from Gafford and Lively... methinks that's better than typing out both their names each time, or using Lifford or Gaffly. )

[SleepingHero]

@FredKatz
The Knicks had to open up roster spots so they could pull off sign-and-trades in the Towns deal. Waiving Okeke and Morris gives them two extra open spots. Now they can sign and trade DaQuan Jeffries and whomever else to Charlotte.

[SleepingHero]

@FredKatz
The Knicks had to open up roster spots so they could pull off sign-and-trades in the Towns deal. Waiving Okeke and Morris gives them two extra open spots. Now they can sign and trade DaQuan Jeffries and whomever else to Charlotte.

This makes makes me feel like this deal came up out of nowhere. No reason for NYK to sign both of those guys in September and then turn around and waive them before the season started.

[DallasMaverick]

What is Minnesota's main rotation now?

Conley/Dillingham, Edwards/DDV, McDaniels, Randle/Reid, Gobert/Reid

The spacing is yuck.

Whoever is in charge of the money at the Mavericks should make a huge play for Anthony Edwards behind the scenes.

*cough, tap him up before the Lakers do, cough, Kyrie + all available Mavs picks, cough*

Future Mavs starting 5: Grimes, Antman, Luka, PJW, Giraffe

(Just realized we can spell Giraffe with the letters from Gafford and Lively... methinks that's better than typing out both their names each time, or using Lifford or Gaffly. )

 Not sure Ant would be willing to defer to Luka.

Especially since he considered himself the “first option” on the Olympic team.

[SleepingHero]

What is Minnesota's main rotation now?

Conley/Dillingham, Edwards/DDV, McDaniels, Randle/Reid, Gobert/Reid

The spacing is yuck.

Whoever is in charge of the money at the Mavericks should make a huge play for Anthony Edwards behind the scenes.

*cough, tap him up before the Lakers do, cough, Kyrie + all available Mavs picks, cough*

Future Mavs starting 5: Grimes, Antman, Luka, PJW, Giraffe

(Just realized we can spell Giraffe with the letters from Gafford and Lively... methinks that's better than typing out both their names each time, or using Lifford or Gaffly. )

Their 15 man roster so far is:

Conley/Dillingham/Doizer
Ant/Divincenzo/Alexander-Walker/Shannon Jr.
McDaniels/Bates-Diop/Leonard Miller
Randle/Naz Reid/Joe Ingles
Gobert/Luka Garza

They're suddenly very thin at the 5 unless Reid plays the stretch 5 role from now on with Randle. I still don't trust their lotto pick. Divincenzo is a great pickup but I feel like he's going to hunt for shots for his next contract. Genuinely shocked they made this trade still.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

Their 15 man roster so far is:

Conley/Dillingham/Doizer
Ant/Divincenzo/Alexander-Walker/Shannon Jr.
McDaniels/Bates-Diop/Leonard Miller
Randle/Naz Reid/Joe Ingles
Gobert/Luka Garza

They're suddenly very thin at the 5 unless Reid plays the stretch 5 role from now on with Randle. I still don't trust their lotto pick. Divincenzo is a great pickup but I feel like he's going to hunt for shots for his next contract. Genuinely shocked they made this trade still.

They made the trade for financial reasons, and I can't blame them for that. Randle comes off the books if he elects free agency after next season, and they have Detroit's 1st round pick which could come in handy in another deal if need be.. I don't think they'll be as bad off as some are predicting. They could be a top 5 or 6 team.

[SleepingHero]

They made the trade for financial reasons, and I can't blame them for that. Randle comes off the books if he elects free agency after next season, and they have Detroit's 1st round pick which could come in handy in another deal if need be.. I don't think they'll be as bad off as some are predicting. They could be a top 5 or 6 team.

That Detroit pick is protected 1-13 next year. Highly unlikely it conveys, if it ever does at all. As the rest of the protections are as follows: 1-11 in 2026, 1-9 in 2027. 

Afterwards it turns into a 2nd. 

Does DET all of a sudden turn into a top 15 team after setting the worst losing streak in American sports history? 


Minny better hope Randle re-signs or they can trade him because if he walks for free they've essentially swapped KAT for Divincenzo+2nd.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

That Detroit pick is protected 1-13 next year. Highly unlikely it conveys, if it ever does at all. As the rest of the protections are as follows: 1-11 in 2026, 1-9 in 2027. 

Afterwards it turns into a 2nd. 

Does DET all of a sudden turn into a top 15 team after setting the worst losing streak in American sports history? 


Minny better hope Randle re-signs or they can trade him because if he walks for free they've essentially swapped KAT for Divincenzo+2nd.

Yeah, you're probably right. We'll see.

[RGP1981]

Not sure Ant would be willing to defer to Luka.

Especially since he considered himself the “first option” on the Olympic team.

Well, rather than either deferring to the other, I prefer to think they will be co-stars, each bringing something different to the table. So hopefully, Ant will realize that Ant needs Luka as much as Luka needs Ant. Honestly, I can't think of a star who would fit better alongside Luka. Kyrie is real nice but he's not getting younger and can't do what Ant does on defense.

[F Gump]

@FredKatz
The Knicks had to open up roster spots so they could pull off sign-and-trades in the Towns deal. Waiving Okeke and Morris gives them two extra open spots. Now they can sign and trade DaQuan Jeffries and whomever else to Charlotte.

This could be merely a technicality.

It looks to me like they could (and probably are planning to ) waive two players on "waive at no cost" deals, then do the trade, then sign them again to the very same contract.

[F Gump]

Minny better hope Randle re-signs or they can trade him because if he walks for free they've essentially swapped KAT for Divincenzo+2nd.

Turning KAT into DD (11.4M salary) and a 2nd might be what they WANTED to happen, in their wildest dreams. 

They were about to be mired in 2nd Apron hell with no way to escape. Not only extreme financial penalties but also guts your picks, and all for the ~ahem~ "privilege" of having KAT on the team. That albatross magically got erased.

[michaeltex]

Feels like there will be a traffic jam in Minny with Gobert, Randle and a driving Ant all looking for space in the paint.

I wonder how KAT will like playing 5. Will the Knicks really let him drift out to wait for a corner 3pt shot opportunity? Hard to get rebounds out there, and that's what NYKs are needing.

I get the financial aspects for Minny though.