Trade & FA 2024-25: NYK Shopping Mitchell Robinson?

[F Gump]

Spencer, Exum, Grimes, and Hardy all can get and deserve minutes.

When everyone is healthy -  
In games that are competitive, I would expect 2-3 of those would be a total DNP. Who plays might differ from game to game, but I suspect Exum and Grimes have the best shot to play, because they have the ability to be a factor on both ends - especially defense.

The opponent's lineup (big, or small) would be a big factor also, as teams who feature small lineups might offer more minutes for guards to play as forwards.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

https://x.com/YossiGozlan/status/1841273206428295644

https://x.com/YossiGozlan/status/1841271945977077902


The Knicks had to do this deal before the regular season.

[HoosierDaddyKid]

https://x.com/BobbyMarks42/status/1841277517954691284


Here are the agreed-upon details of the NY/Minn trade.

[MarkAguirreWrathofGod]

https://x.com/YossiGozlan/status/1841273206428295644

https://x.com/YossiGozlan/status/1841271945977077902


The Knicks had to do this deal before the regular season.

I’m confused by how this is legal? Weren’t there apron restrictions? Is it because they signed and traded the scrub? Weren’t they a second apron team after Bridges? Doesn’t that mean you can aggregate salary/players? Is F Gump in the house?

[Ghost of Podkolzin]

Interesting.... this may be a great deal for both teams. NYK get an upgrade (not caring about payroll), and MIN gets off one of the worst contracts in the NBA.

Brunson
Hart
Bridges
OG
KAT
...hellva lineup.

[F Gump]

I’m confused by how this is legal? Weren’t there apron restrictions? Is it because they signed and traded the scrub? Weren’t they a second apron team after Bridges? Doesn’t that mean you can aggregate salary/players? Is F Gump in the house?

The tweet said: "The New York Knicks managed to increase their payroll in both the Karl-Anthony Towns and Mikal Bridges trades despite being an apron team. They did this by inflating their outgoing salary required with every remaining free agent from last year they had some form of Bird rights to. Excellent work by their front office for their creativity and execution of all this within the second apron. "

That tweet is confusing in that it uses muddled terminology. What is being called "an apron team" doesn't mean all that much. As he uses it, he means they did something that would make them stop at either Apron 1 or Apron 2, if they happen to get in that vicinity of salary. But if we use that term as he uses it, most teams would properly be called an "apron team" -- including ones miles below either apron.

NY's various moves in the summer gave them a hard cap at the 2nd apron line but not before. IIRC they were generally at about $177M (BELOW the 1st apron, and about 12M below the 2nd apron). So they had a lot of flexibility. 

After adding more salary by signing SNT-eligible players to use in the trades as outgoing matching salary, they are now about 1M below the 2nd Apron, I think.

The prohibition on aggregating players applies to teams above Apron 2, which they are not.

[SleepingHero]

I’m confused by how this is legal? Weren’t there apron restrictions? Is it because they signed and traded the scrub? Weren’t they a second apron team after Bridges? Doesn’t that mean you can aggregate salary/players? Is F Gump in the house?

They had the rights of all the dudes they signed and traded. They found a loop hole that has allowed them to give them contracts just $1 above the minimum (thus circumventing the aggregation minimum salary rules) and were able to get enough money to make it legal.

MIN couldn't aggregate anybody AND they can't take back any more salary than they are sending out. Thus why they only traded KAT and nothing else.

Charlotte was basically the garbage dump, where they ate 3 minimum salaries and got 2nds in return for it.

[F Gump]

Here's a deep dive on the cap issues and ensuing workarounds that came into play in the KAT trade. It featured some excellent cap planning and logistics by NY, and their work is not done (they still have to fill out the roster).

https://www.spotrac.com/news/_/id/2469/k...-team-deal

They also have to figure out how to make the roster work. For as many improvements as they made, they created issues as well that they will have to navigate.

[MarkAguirreWrathofGod]

Here's a deep dive on the cap issues and ensuing workarounds that came into play in the KAT trade. It featured some excellent cap planning and logistics by NY, and their work is not done (they still have to fill out the roster).

https://www.spotrac.com/news/_/id/2469/k...-team-deal

They also have to figure out how to make the roster work. For as many improvements as they made, they created issues as well that they will have to navigate.

Thanks so much for all of this! You and Sleeping Hero and a few others are such indispensable members of this forum. Thankful you all exist!

[HoosierDaddyKid]

Thanks so much for all of this! You and Sleeping Hero and a few others are such indispensable members of this forum. Thankful you all exist!

F Gump, Dan, and SH are the resident capologists.

[SleepingHero]

Thanks so much for all of this! You and Sleeping Hero and a few others are such indispensable members of this forum. Thankful you all exist!

[SleepingHero]

F Gump, Dan, and SH are the resident capologists.

I still consider myself a very, very, low level apprentice. 

FGump and Dan are on another level. Those two rock.

[RGP1981]

I still consider myself a very, very, low level apprentice. 

FGump and Dan are on another level. Those two rock.

Well, then you should bring us all a beer, apprentice wench. 

I kid!

[HoosierDaddyKid]

I still consider myself a very, very, low level apprentice. 

FGump and Dan are on another level. Those two rock.

You probably know more than most on here, especially me. I'm just along for the ride.....

[michaeltex]

Roster lock is two weeks from today, so the current roster of guaranteed contracts is (alphabetically):

1. Dinwiddie
2. Doncic
3. Exum
4. Gafford
5. Grimes
6. Hardy
7. Irving
8. Kleber
9. Lawson
10. Lively
11. Marshall
12. Powell
13. Omax
14. Thompson
15. Washington

2-way #1 Edwards
2-way #2 Williams
2-way #3 ???

Sharp, Miller and Gortman are all Exhibit 10 contracts. Potentially for the last 2-way or at least for signing to a G-league contract.

Morris on on an Exhibit 9?

Is this still correct? If so, then the real camp competition is the pecking order to back up Luka/Kyrie/Klay/PJ/DLive?

[SleepingHero]

Roster lock is two weeks from today, so the current roster of guaranteed contracts is (alphabetically):

1. Dinwiddie
2. Doncic
3. Exum
4. Gafford
5. Grimes
6. Hardy
7. Irving
8. Kleber
9. Lawson
10. Lively
11. Marshall
12. Powell
13. Omax
14. Thompson
15. Washington

2-way #1 Edwards
2-way #2 Williams
2-way #3 ???

Sharp, Miller and Gortman are all Exhibit 10 contracts. Potentially for the last 2-way or at least for signing to a G-league contract.

Morris on on an Exhibit 9?

Is this still correct? If so, then the real camp competition is the pecking order to back up Luka/Kyrie/Klay/PJ/DLive?

Lawson is on an non-guaranteed deal that only becomes guaranteed after January. Morris' Exhibit 9 deal becomes guaranteed on opening day. 14 spots locked down with 1 remaining essentially.

The last spot is between those two. I can't imagine Morris not being kept and Lawson stays.

[michaeltex]

Well, it's the 15th spot, so if you are going to hide a player/coach who is more coach than player, it makes sense.

[F Gump]

Morris' Exhibit 9 deal becomes guaranteed on opening day. 

That's news to me. Source?

[RGP1981]

Lawson is on an non-guaranteed deal that only becomes guaranteed after January. Morris' Exhibit 9 deal becomes guaranteed on opening day. 14 spots locked down with 1 remaining essentially.

The last spot is between those two. I can't imagine Morris not being kept and Lawson stays.

I don't understand why Morris is back. It could be more worthwhile to promote O-Max to the main squad and take a chance on Emanuel Miller. Jazi Gortman seems nice too, he might be able to replace Dinwiddie or Hardy.

Diverting from the offensive/defensive guard and forward rotation that I used here, if you look at the squad in a more traditional manner.

PG: Kyrie, Spencer, Exum
SG: Klay, Grimes, Hardy
SF: Luka, Naji, Miller
PF: PJW, Kleber, O-Max
C: Lively, Gafford, Dwight

2-ways: Edwards, Williams, Gortman

[SleepingHero]

https://www.si.com/nba/knicks/news/maver...en%20Hardy

"The Knicks are rumored to still be active in the trade market, and they have until the February deadline to make more moves.

Bleacher Report's Grant Hughes has put together a list of each team's top potential trade targets, and for New York, he named Dallas Mavericks guard Jaden Hardy."



Take this with the biggest grain of salt as this is an aggregation of a BR rumor written by a guy who's just throwing ideas around. But still, I figured it'd be an interesting talking point. Knicks want bench creation/scoring. Hardy is definitely that. Question is, what is Hardy's value?