Game 44: Phoenix Suns (25-18) vs. Dallas Mavericks (24-19)

[omahen]

A very dissapointing loss, obviously. Mavs started really well and fell apart in the second half. Really surprised by Luka kicking out a fan. Come on man, you are not that. You played in toughest arenas in the world and always loved trash talking with fans. Two things that imho had biggest impact on this game turning around as it did were GW being stupid and Luka twisting ankle. He just wasn't the same afterwards.

I am not really moved by a tough stretch of bad games. Of course the concern is this continues until Mavs get to keep yet another pick. But Mavs showed also a different face this season many times. Played joyful basketball which was fun to watch on most of the nights. The right questions imho are, why this has changed. I could understand they are tired, banged up, frustrations grow when things don't go their way. Mavs were playing great ball in December but I was constantly warning playing Luka 40+ minutes on a nightly basis is not sustainable. Several other players, most notably DJJ and GW have fallen of a cliff.

Big picture wise though, Mavs problem is imho obviously lack of talent. Mavs fielded a line-up that would be an equivalent to Phoenix playing something like Booker, Okogie, Allen, Nurkic and Metu. DJJ just fell of a cliff after a good start to the season. Can't hit a three anymore and defenses just ignore him. Previous game offensive rating with him on the floor was 90, this game it was 80 (abysmal 60 in the second half). More and more showing why he was signed for minimum. I really like him, can be positive in rotation, but it is more and more clear he is far from a starting level player. Enter GW being totally incapable and stupid, and Mavs have a huge PF hole, especially since they had to play Maxi at center as he was the only center available behind Lively. Exum was (understandably) a shadow of the guy playing in December. THJ is a chucker. Only thing he does well is shooting a lot, however he is not really efficient doing it, just 36 % from three. Green is a nice player, but he doesn't have it in him to take it on his shoulders. Could be a good 5th guy, just don't see anything more.

All in all, nothing has really changed for me. I was among more pessimistic after the summer, claiming they have not done enough. I still think one right move would make a huge change for this team. Just don't be impatient. Replacing one role player with another (using assets in the process) will not change much. If anything at all.

[omahen]

When THJ sped up for a lay-up in transition against KD, I knew what's going to happen: Either his shot gets blocked or he throws the ball up in the air just to get a shot off (with no real determination to put the ball in).

I've seen these too many times against the Clippers series, and to this day that play holds true.

Yeah, totally with you on that. Saw that block coming immediately THJ started the drive. Second game in a row when Mavs made a little late push, a tiny little hope that they could turn it around, then THJ does a stupid drive with no chance of success.

[omahen]

And at what point do we say the team is talented enough? 3 all-stars? 

Obviously not. Mavs probably need just one high level starter player. Something it is imho obvious for the whole last five years. They just continously field rosters with endless line of 5-10 best players, incapable of adding that needed starter level quality. Mavs have two stars, huge hole and then a bunch of 5-10 best players. Lively is ok as a starter and we all hope he will continue to develop. Green or Exum are ok as a starter, but you can't play them together next to Luka and Kyrie. DJJ or GW, the way they are playing past 2 months or so, are not even close to a starter level player, let alone third best player on the team. Fix this hole and the team might look very much different. 

This is not on GW or DJJ, they are who they are. Mistake is trying to make them into something they are not. Roster construction.

[RGP1981]

Luka deserves every bit of blame he's getting now. He's getting blasted for kicking that Suns fan out of the game. He's soft. He's a damn baby and needs to grow up and man up.

#FreeLuka needs to start trending on Twitter.

If I were Luka, I'd be giving interviews saying hot stuff like "either Cuban goes or I go" and "I'll be taking my talents to Salt Lake City".

Speaking of SLC, please trade Luka to the Jazz, pretty please. My body is ready. :FAP:

[Chicagojk]

 Killer was enthusiastic about THJ in the first half saying how you can't like this guy. Well, he showed in the second. Horrible shooting, forced shots and gives nothing on defense. 

There were so many other things wrong last night but I wanted to hit a bigger view on THJ.   I appreciate what he brings and is someone the team counts on.   He takes and makes extremely difficult shots and provides an offensive spark.   But when I look at box scores after the games, there are too many of these 5-15 shooting nights.   Many of those shots are shots I don't want anyone taking besides Kyrie and Luka too.    He takes too many heat check shots.  I just constantly think are we better off if we replaced THJ with a bigger guy who gets points other ways and also provides the non scoring impact plays.  THJ takes charges at high #'s, but it feels this has been reduced lately.  He also competes hard.   But there is just so many other things that he doesn't do.   

I am not saying dump him for a can of beans, but I hope this is his last year here.

[dirkfansince1998]

There were so many other things wrong last night but I wanted to hit a bigger view on THJ.   I appreciate what he brings and is someone the team counts on.   He takes and makes extremely difficult shots and provides an offensive spark.   But when I look at box scores after the games, there are too many of these 5-15 shooting nights.   Many of those shots are shots I don't want anyone taking besides Kyrie and Luka too.    He takes too many heat check shots.  I just constantly think are we better off if we replaced THJ with a bigger guy who gets points other ways and also provides the non scoring impact plays.  THJ takes charges at high #'s, but it feels this has been reduced lately.  He also competes hard.   But there is just so many other things that he doesn't do.   

I am not saying dump him for a can of beans, but I hope this is his last year here.

He has always been a less than ideal fit next to Luka because of his defensive short comings  but at the end of the day THJ is a 6th man that is forced to be the Mavs 2nd option more often than not. Mavs aren't running a lot of plays on offense. They aren't drawing up stuff for the role players. They have two guys that dominate the ball and create shots for themself. In a game without Kyrie and/or Luka it is THJs job to provide the difficult shot making. That shouldn't be THJs role but as long as the Mavs aren't coming up with a new offensive scheme THJ will have the ultimate green light.

[Chicagojk]

Let me add. Physical defense is a plus. Physical defense picking up cheap fouls is not. It is a slim line between the two but important.

Williams played physical defense to start the game but got a few cheap fouls. Dallas hit start was offset a little because the suns were in the penalty and wound up getting a lot of free throws. Because the Mavs fell in love with the 3, they got only a few free throws.

I add this to my list of winning things. Good teams target these types of winning players (turnovers, loose balls, more free throws. Good rotations etc). Poor to average team constantly lose these areas.

[Jason Terry]

There were so many other things wrong last night but I wanted to hit a bigger view on THJ.   I appreciate what he brings and is someone the team counts on.   He takes and makes extremely difficult shots and provides an offensive spark.   But when I look at box scores after the games, there are too many of these 5-15 shooting nights.   Many of those shots are shots I don't want anyone taking besides Kyrie and Luka too.    He takes too many heat check shots.  I just constantly think are we better off if we replaced THJ with a bigger guy who gets points other ways and also provides the non scoring impact plays.  THJ takes charges at high #'s, but it feels this has been reduced lately.  He also competes hard.   But there is just so many other things that he doesn't do.   

I am not saying dump him for a can of beans, but I hope this is his last year here.

Tim Hardaway Jr. #1 in the league at standing perfectly still on defense

[omahen]

Couldn't agree more with this analysis from Iztok

https://twitter.com/iztok_franko/status/...wcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2Fdallas-mavericks

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

Couldn't agree more with this analysis from Iztok

https://twitter.com/iztok_franko/status/...wcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2Fdallas-mavericks

That 4th point is basically everything.  The DJJ shine has worn off for me and all the reasons he never found a home are more blatant than ever.  We can't win if we can't punish teams for packing the paint by knocking down corner threes.  Exum turned down a ton of open looks last night too.

[omahen]

Luka deserves every bit of blame he's getting now. He's getting blasted for kicking that Suns fan out of the game. He's soft. He's a damn baby and needs to grow up and man up.

Cato first one with detailed description of the incident. The fan wasn't actually thrown out of the game...

Luka Dončić’s frustration spills over in blowout loss to Suns – and could reveal even more - The Athletic

[BigDirk41]

Cato first one with detailed description of the incident. The fan wasn't actually thrown out of the game...

Luka Dončić’s frustration spills over in blowout loss to Suns – and could reveal even more - The Athletic

I can't open that up because I don't have a subscription, but ESPN is still reporting that he had the fan ejected and Luka saying as much. I'm not sure which is true, but it's a bad look all around. Luka can expect to start getting heckled like crazy now.

[StrandedOnBeauboisHill]

I can't open that up because I don't have a subscription

https://archive.is/uEiBZ

[Nowitzki Way]

This game got ugly right before halftime and the 2nd half was brutal.

The interaction with the fan and the postgame stuff from Luka and Kidd is even more troubling, and is the real story.

Luka is frustrated and it shows. This game was this entire season in a nutshell. We started off hot, Luka was controlling the game and we looked good. Defense started to tail off. We got out muscled, out rebounded, and out hustled.

Frustrations kicked in. Gwill ejection. Luka trying to throw out a fan. And a huge collapse. I think phoenix went on a 52 to 15 run at some point. That's terrible.

This team needs a change. Either with the roster or with the coach. But honestly both.

[HoosierDaddyKidd]

This game got ugly right before halftime and the 2nd half was brutal.

The interaction with the fan and the postgame stuff from Luka and Kidd is even more troubling, and is the real story.

Luka is frustrated and it shows. This game was this entire season in a nutshell. We started off hot, Luka was controlling the game and we looked good. Defense started to tail off. We got out muscled, out rebounded, and out hustled.

Frustrations kicked in. Gwill ejection. Luka trying to throw out a fan. And a huge collapse. I think phoenix went on a 52 to 15 run at some point. That's terrible.

This team needs a change. Either with the roster or with the coach. But honestly both.

It's going to be hard to change the roster without assets. Some of you look at Holmes, THJ, Green, and Hardy as viable assets, where other teams may not.  Mavs are backed in a corner from making big changes that would drastically improve the team. Fringe deals are the only one's they can realistically make.

[Nowitzki Way]

It's going to be hard to change the roster without assets. Some of you look at Holmes, THJ, Green, and Hardy as viable assets, where other teams may not.  Mavs are backed in a corner from making big changes that would drastically improve the team. Fringe deals are the only one's they can realistically make.

Agreed. I'm not sure any of those assets are attractive to other teams. On the surface I would think that THJ would be attractive to a lot of playoff teams. 6th or 7th guy off the bench. Can get hot and make shots. But if he was attractive, he'd be gone by now. It seems like we've been trying to trade him for 2 years now. 

And on your point of fringe deals.  We could pull off a fringe trade or two. But why? It wont help us advance any further than we would. This is a play-in team. 1st round loss team. Why waste assets that wont put us over the top. 

So like you said, we're stuck! Backed into a corner of mediocrity.

[Reunion Mav]

This game got ugly right before halftime and the 2nd half was brutal.

The interaction with the fan and the postgame stuff from Luka and Kidd is even more troubling, and is the real story.

Luka is frustrated and it shows. This game was this entire season in a nutshell. We started off hot, Luka was controlling the game and we looked good. Defense started to tail off. We got out muscled, out rebounded, and out hustled.

Frustrations kicked in. Gwill ejection. Luka trying to throw out a fan. And a huge collapse. I think phoenix went on a 52 to 15 run at some point. That's terrible.

This team needs a change. Either with the roster or with the coach. But honestly both.

Or the players themselves can take this series of kicks in the teeth and create their own change. Maybe Luka leads it or maybe Kyrie. Who knows maybe stuff J Kidd has been saying can be simply accepted as part of the more unified teams more mature competitive series of decisions. 
Furthermore these 5-10 level players do have the opportunity they have dreamed of. Sometimes getting smoked can be a great teacher. The two stars can lead them and see who earns their trust like DFS did.

[BigDirk41]

https://archive.is/uEiBZ

Thank you. That sounds more legit than the ESPN article.

---

Do the new owners have control yet? Maybe they will fire Kidd mid season.

[Scott41theMavs]

Couldn't agree more with this analysis from Iztok

https://twitter.com/iztok_franko/status/...wcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2Fdallas-mavericks

One thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is how the comment likely pushed Luka's buttons because he was trying to play through a twisted ankle. Yeah, he's not going to be quite as spry under those conditions, so I could see why he would take it personally in the midst of the rest of his frustrations.

[Jason Terry]

Looking back on these bad losses…..a common theme I’ve noticed is when our shots stop falling we stop playing defense. Even just one quarter of that type of quit will lose us a game.

Kidd after the game saying “we’re looking for a leader on defense” hinting that that player is not on the team

I wonder what this team would look like with Dorian back. I’m having trouble coming up with another player or coach we could get that everyone(including and especially Luka) would respect