FIBA Qualifying Tournament: USA loses to Germany|Gold medal between Germany+Serbia

[Mavs2021]

Dwight Powell grabs an off. rebound of a missed FT. 

Team USA


 

Rockets fans probably feeling pretty good about themselves right now with the Brooks signing.

[Knutsen]

Feeling bad for Maxi right now. Team Germany close to the biggest win in our history and he‘s at home watching.

[Mavs2021]

Feeling bad for Maxi right now. Team Germany close to the biggest win in our history and he‘s at home watching.

Nothing but love for Maxi, but I think it was good for Germany, cause it clearly defined the German big man rotation. 

Voigtmann was the MVP for me today. Held Milutinov to two points and four rebounds. 

Him, Theis, Wagner brothers and Bonga owned that forward/center rotation.

Lakers drafting is just stupid good. You could make a good NBA team with the players they waived or walked.

And damn Dennis Schroeder just become a German legend.

Also let´s sign Voigtmann, Obst and Bonga, so Maxi can also win a title with them.

Also this was some great final. Pesic and Herbert are two brilliant coaches.

---

Schroeder follows in Dirk´s footsteps as World Cup MVP.

[JamesConway912]

30 years since GER won an international tournament. Back then (european championship 1993) serbia’s coach Pesic was our / team GER’s coach. Impressive how he’s still coaching at that level at age 74.

Serbia played amazing in the first half, made some crazy shots. But GER just had the best team and stayed undefeated throughout the whole tournament. Incredible run, incredible team.

Schröder with the well deserved MVP trophy. Dude played amazing and has once again carried the german team. 

Just very unfortunate how little standing basketball has in our country. Almost the entire tournament was streamed exclusively online, only the finale today was finally broadcasted by german TV. It’s all about soccer here (where is the puke emoji?) 

Re Kleber: I wonder how they’ll handle his situation next year at the olympics. Unless somebody gets injured you pretty much have to bring back the entire championship team. Maybe that’s it for him.  You gotta wonder if it was really worth it. He missed something historical.

[ItsGoTime]

Maxi doesn’t need to play any more basketball that the Mavs season. I hope he comes back well rested after an offseason off like Luka should have had.

[Dahlsim]

Incredible how much difference rules and officiating styles change entire game, even though its all supposed to be the same game!

[omahen]

Maxi doesn’t need to play any more basketball that the Mavs season. I hope he comes back well rested after an offseason off like Luka should have had.

If Kyrie would be really wanted by team US for the Olympics, but he rejected. Would you support that decision?

[SwisherPrice]

Yeah Schroder was right, they didn't need Kleber 

Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if Kleber was never very interested in playing either. Schroder just conveniently gave him an out.

Next year's Olympics has the potential to the most competitive basketball tournament ever. Germany, Canada, Serbia (especially if Jokic plays), France, Spain, Australia, and Slovenia will all be in contention to medal along with the USA.

[KillerLeft]

If Kyrie would be really wanted by team US for the Olympics, but he rejected. Would you support that decision?

Absolutely. That's the case for dozens of guys. Rest assured, they start at LeBron/Durant/Curry when building these rosters and work their way down. I honestly don't think the average American gives it a second thought. Even now, after not winning this thing, most American basketball fans won't care because it's not even the olympics. All we truly follow is the NBA, and even the olympics don't really drum up interest unless they fail to win gold. Then, it gets discussed for a week or two. 

I have read your words about how the Slovenian national team is viewed, and while I can't relate, I do UNDERSTAND. I'm not suggesting that a cultural shift is called for here. That's obviously nobody's place to even think about, other than people from your country. However, I will be pissed as a Mavs fan if Luka's season is impacted by an injury that could've been remedied by sitting out of this thing, especially thinking about the generational wealth he'll earn for this one season, alone. 

It's not an easy conversation, let alone an easy problem to solve. That's for sure. I'm just being honest. 

Let me ask you this, because I'm genuinely curious, as this might be yet another cultural difference, seeing as our thinking is a little more infected with capitalism than some other countries: Is there any thinking by the average Slovenian that an annual salary of $40 million comes with an ethical (perhaps even moral) obligation to make some sacrifices to ensure the best chances possible to perform at a high level?

[WillE]

Incredible how much difference rules and officiating styles change entire game, even though its all supposed to be the same game!

Well...NBA Basketball is designed to be watched. It's a product and it will always be changed as needed to maximize sales.

While FIBA loves $ just as much as the NBA, they can't promote so many superstars, thus they put the team aspect more into the spotlight.

One can think of this what he wants, but the officials were a very big reason why this tournament was so much fun to watch. No superstar calls, no one had to earn the refs respect etc. "Just" consistent officiating.

[WillE]

Just very unfortunate how little standing basketball has in our country.

Re Kleber: I wonder how they’ll handle his situation next year at the olympics. Unless somebody gets injured you pretty much have to bring back the entire championship team. Maybe that’s it for him.  You gotta wonder if it was really worth it. He missed something historical.

I'm under the impression, that things already started to change. In my hometome (with a Bundesliga team) they recently keep breaking their records of new youth players signing up.

Also, it's already a development that the entire tournament was aired by a dedicated team a magenta sport. I'm perfectly happy with their coverage; the public media would have been a desaster as always.

Of course, more public attention would be nice, but I am also very happy that no started such parades like the soccer people do...Basketball is just more real and doesn't need any extras

Re Kleber: Yeah, I already wondered, if he'll get another chance. I guess we'll see soon.

[omahen]

Absolutely. That's the case for dozens of guys. Rest assured, they start at LeBron/Durant/Curry when building these rosters and work their way down. I honestly don't think the average American gives it a second thought. Even now, after not winning this thing, most American basketball fans won't care because it's not even the olympics. All we truly follow is the NBA, and even the olympics don't really drum up interest unless they fail to win gold. Then, it gets discussed for a week or two. 

I have read your words about how the Slovenian national team is viewed, and while I can't relate, I do UNDERSTAND. I'm not suggesting that a cultural shift is called for here. That's obviously nobody's place to even think about, other than people from your country. However, I will be pissed as a Mavs fan if Luka's season is impacted by an injury that could've been remedied by sitting out of this thing, especially thinking about the generational wealth he'll earn for this one season, alone. 

It's not an easy conversation, let alone an easy problem to solve. That's for sure. I'm just being honest. 

Let me ask you this, because I'm genuinely curious, as this might be yet another cultural difference, seeing as our thinking is a little more infected with capitalism than some other countries: Is there any thinking by the average Slovenian that an annual salary of $40 million comes with an ethical (perhaps even moral) obligation to make some sacrifices to ensure the best chances possible to perform at a high level?

I can totally understand the problem between being paid by the team and playing for NT. Much different situation between USA and Slovenia, as USA has huge depth and can still put together a very good team even if a lot of best players refuse to play. Although, as we could see from last events, only the best version of USA is still good enough.

One thing to note. All those players performing for NT are insured and insurance usually needs to be paid by the national association. The team is not really paying players for nothing, if they get injured. Fans are the ones losing. But, so is the player. His career will suffer if he gets injured, especially if you are not a star. For example, Cancar NBA days are probably over because of the season ending injury he suffered in WC preparations. 

I think the big problem is that players are made to play way too much games. If you are in the playoffs and attend the NT action, you play something like 120 games in a season. It used to be a bit different. NBA players were not allowed to compete in FIBA until 1992 and European competitions had far less games in a season. Something like 40 games of the national league and some 10 European games or so. Now that has increased exponentially even in Europe and Euroleague guys play similar number of games as NBA players. The more games played, the more money is made. At all levels of competitions. But I don't think bodies can hold that much effort. 

As for specific case of Luka. This time, he had plenty of rest since April. Of course he he was training most of the time. But trainings can be easily adjusted so that the injured muscle rests while you still work out. I find it quite strange that March injury would still be nagging. He could have easily take 2 months off to heal the injury and have plenty of time to prepare for world cup.

To answer your specific question. I think average fan puts National team as the most sacred duty. Teams are where the money is made, but NT is where legends are made. Success with Slovenia has 10 times the weight compared to success with team. Slovenia also has one of top hockey players in NHL (Kopitar with LA Kings). Similar as Luka in basketball, by far the best player Slovenia had. But because he rarely plays for the NT, so he is not a great star in the country, even though he won two Stanley cups.

[omahen]

I remembered a couple of examples. Slovenians Beno Udrih and Sasa Vujacic had quite decent NBA careers. Weren't stars, but useful role players.Other than Luka and Nesterovic probably had best careers of all Slovenian players. I don't want to go into discussion about the reasons why, but they somehow almost never came to play for the national team, often citing "excuses" that were took by fans as if they just don't want to play (lets say very similar reaction as Schroeder had about Kleber). After their career was finished, they are basically "forgotten" in Slovenia, despite having much better careers than many other celebrated players. A lot of fanbase hates them and media doesn't really cover them. I noticed that Udrih became head coach of one of G-league franchises (Milwaukee, if I remember correctly) this season, yet I didn't even notice that news in Slovenian media. Milic was loved as a player. He is just a "deep bench" assistant on Mavs and, let's be honest, got his job because of Luka only, but is being covered all the time by Slovenian media.

[KillerLeft]

I remembered a couple of examples. Slovenians Beno Udrih and Sasa Vujacic had quite decent NBA careers. Weren't stars, but useful role players.Other than Luka and Nesterovic probably had best careers of all Slovenian players. I don't want to go into discussion about the reasons why, but they somehow almost never came to play for the national team, often citing "excuses" that were took by fans as if they just don't want to play (lets say very similar reaction as Schroeder had about Kleber). After their career was finished, they are basically "forgotten" in Slovenia, despite having much better careers than many other celebrated players. A lot of fanbase hates them and media doesn't really cover them. I noticed that Udrih became head coach of one of G-league franchises (Milwaukee, if I remember correctly) this season, yet I didn't even notice that news in Slovenian media. Milic was loved as a player. He is just a "deep bench" assistant on Mavs and, let's be honest, got his job because of Luka only, but is being covered all the time by Slovenian media.

A complicated issue, to say the least. 

It seems clear that for now, Luka sees his future (after basketball) as being in Slovenia. I'm sure that has something to do with his approach, to your point. It will be interesting if that continues to be his plan. I'm sure Dirk's plan was to retire to Germany, too, but when the dust cleared he stayed here in DFW. Pretty interesting journey these international phenoms go through.

[ItsGoTime]

If Kyrie would be really wanted by team US for the Olympics, but he rejected. Would you support that decision?

So, I mean no disrespect to NT play, but any player that goes INTO it injured should not play. I’ve never really been a spectator of much of the international scene (even watching the olympics is spotty for me as I get older), but I’m pretty much fine with a healthy player playing, well, fine with whatever decision they decide for themselves. Injury, and maybe even injury prone players (looking at Anthony Davis types), should not play.

I’m second guessing why the Mavs didn’t even shut Luka down at the end of the season seeing as though they were tanking anyway. If we do, maybe we have a much better draft ranking with more ping pong balls and who knows where we end up overall. Luka might have also not been injured for this tournament too and I would have been fine with him playing then. An injury that lingers on like this there is no way he’s not doing lots more long term damage by playing on it.

I was in Tae Kwon Do in my early years. During a tournament I pulled a groin muscle. I continued working out on it (never gave it the rest it needed to fully heal) and to this day I have much more tightness in that muscle as opposed to the opposite one.

[khaled1987]

Let me ask you this, because I'm genuinely curious, as this might be yet another cultural difference, seeing as our thinking is a little more infected with capitalism than some other countries: Is there any thinking by the average Slovenian that an annual salary of $40 million comes with an ethical (perhaps even moral) obligation to make some sacrifices to ensure the best chances possible to perform at a high level?

Do you think the Luka's of the world would get 40M a year without the international market that basketball have?
The NBA isn't taking FIBA seriously and allowing professionals to go out of patriotic tendency,  it is because it is essential for the growth of their own league and the owners pour more cash in their pockets while the extra strain is on the players and their trainers
You think if Dirk, Peja, Yao didn't represent their country,  it would have been the same exposure for the NBA in those areas.
No, those are all calculated business moves, that are profitable for the league. 

An example is basketball in Africa,  African super stars rarely represented their countries and it is a major reason NBA can barely get into the market, niether for cash or talents.
Players like Siakam, Embiid, Ibaka & Hakeem didn't represent African teams, instead the likes of Thabeet & DeSagana Diop are the best we have.

I mean my own NT Egypt somehow finished with 2nd best African result in World cup while we really suck in terms of talent in comparison to sub-saharian Africa. This is because those countries sees the likes of Eto/Osmihan/Mane &Drogba represents them in football/soccer but non in basketball

[KillerLeft]

Do you think the Luka's of the world would get 40M a year without the international market that basketball have?
The NBA isn't taking FIBA seriously and allowing professionals to go out of patriotic tendency,  it is because it is essential for the growth of their own league and the owners pour more cash in their pockets while the extra strain is on the players and their trainers
You think if Dirk, Peja, Yao didn't represent their country,  it would have been the same exposure for the NBA in those areas.
No, those are all calculated business moves, that are profitable for the league. 

An example is basketball in Africa,  African super stars rarely represented their countries and it is a major reason NBA can barely get into the market, niether for cash or talents.
Players like Siakam, Embiid, Ibaka & Hakeem didn't represent African teams, instead the likes of Thabeet & DeSagana Diop are the best we have.

I mean my own NT Egypt somehow finished with 2nd best African result in World cup while we really suck in terms of talent in comparison to sub-saharian Africa. This is because those countries sees the likes of Eto/Osmihan/Mane &Drogba represents them in football/soccer but non in basketball

I agree completely. I think it’s a great point.

I STILL think someone earning $40 Million annually has a responsibility to make sure he starts every season healthy and in shape if at all possible.

[Dahlsim]

Well...NBA Basketball is designed to be watched. It's a product and it will always be changed as needed to maximize sales.

While FIBA loves $ just as much as the NBA, they can't promote so many superstars, thus they put the team aspect more into the spotlight.

One can think of this what he wants, but the officials were a very big reason why this tournament was so much fun to watch. No superstar calls, no one had to earn the refs respect etc. "Just" consistent officiating.

Great point.