Trade & FA 2023-24: OKC The Favorite For Nic Claxton Should He Leave BRK

[Winter]

The most recent news coming out today is from the following:

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/02/mavs...ffice.html

Following up on reports that Kyle Kuzma was nearly traded from the Wizards to the Mavericks last week, ESPN’s Brian Windhorst said on the latest Hoop Collective podcast (YouTube link) that he believes Dallas was offering two first-round picks to Washington in its proposal for the veteran forward.

One of those first-rounders was almost certainly the 2024 pick that Dallas acquired from Oklahoma City, which will likely end up being the more favorable of the Clippers’ and Thunder’s first-rounders. According to Tim MacMahon on The Hoop Collective, the Mavs and Thunder “very quietly” agreed to the deal involving that pick several days before the trade deadline, even though it wasn’t reported until Thursday.

The second first-rounder the Mavs offered for Kuzma would’ve presumably been their own 2027 pick, which was ultimately sent to Charlotte in the P.J. Washington deal instead, with top-two protection.

Windhorst, MacMahon, and ESPN’s Tim Bontemps agree it’s probably safe to assume the Mavs were looking to include Grant Williams in that potential Kuzma trade, which means the proposal might have been something like Williams, Richaun Holmes, a 2024 first-round pick, and the Mavs’ 2027 first-rounder for Kuzma. It’s unclear whether the ’27 pick would’ve had the same light protection that Dallas agreed to in its deal with Charlotte.

Ultimately, after the Wizards decided not to move forward on the Kuzma trade, Dallas ended up sending one of those first-rounders and Holmes to Washington in exchange for Daniel Gafford, completing separate deals with the Wizards and Hornets rather than just a single trade for Kuzma.


In a nutshell: We were going to offer Washington two FRPs along with G. Williams and more. We would not have acquired Gafford in this scenario.

[mvossman]

The most recent news coming out today is from the following:

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/02/mavs...ffice.html

Following up on reports that Kyle Kuzma was nearly traded from the Wizards to the Mavericks last week, ESPN’s Brian Windhorst said on the latest Hoop Collective podcast (YouTube link) that he believes Dallas was offering two first-round picks to Washington in its proposal for the veteran forward.

One of those first-rounders was almost certainly the 2024 pick that Dallas acquired from Oklahoma City, which will likely end up being the more favorable of the Clippers’ and Thunder’s first-rounders. According to Tim MacMahon on The Hoop Collective, the Mavs and Thunder “very quietly” agreed to the deal involving that pick several days before the trade deadline, even though it wasn’t reported until Thursday.

The second first-rounder the Mavs offered for Kuzma would’ve presumably been their own 2027 pick, which was ultimately sent to Charlotte in the P.J. Washington deal instead, with top-two protection.

Windhorst, MacMahon, and ESPN’s Tim Bontemps agree it’s probably safe to assume the Mavs were looking to include Grant Williams in that potential Kuzma trade, which means the proposal might have been something like Williams, Richaun Holmes, a 2024 first-round pick, and the Mavs’ 2027 first-rounder for Kuzma. It’s unclear whether the ’27 pick would’ve had the same light protection that Dallas agreed to in its deal with Charlotte.

Ultimately, after the Wizards decided not to move forward on the Kuzma trade, Dallas ended up sending one of those first-rounders and Holmes to Washington in exchange for Daniel Gafford, completing separate deals with the Wizards and Hornets rather than just a single trade for Kuzma.


In a nutshell: We were going to offer Washington two FRPs along with G. Williams and more. We would not have acquired Gafford in this scenario.

My recent faith in this FO just took a hit

[Luka77]

The most recent news coming out today is from the following:

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/02/mavs...ffice.html

Following up on reports that Kyle Kuzma was nearly traded from the Wizards to the Mavericks last week, ESPN’s Brian Windhorst said on the latest Hoop Collective podcast (YouTube link) that he believes Dallas was offering two first-round picks to Washington in its proposal for the veteran forward.

One of those first-rounders was almost certainly the 2024 pick that Dallas acquired from Oklahoma City, which will likely end up being the more favorable of the Clippers’ and Thunder’s first-rounders. According to Tim MacMahon on The Hoop Collective, the Mavs and Thunder “very quietly” agreed to the deal involving that pick several days before the trade deadline, even though it wasn’t reported until Thursday.

The second first-rounder the Mavs offered for Kuzma would’ve presumably been their own 2027 pick, which was ultimately sent to Charlotte in the P.J. Washington deal instead, with top-two protection.

Windhorst, MacMahon, and ESPN’s Tim Bontemps agree it’s probably safe to assume the Mavs were looking to include Grant Williams in that potential Kuzma trade, which means the proposal might have been something like Williams, Richaun Holmes, a 2024 first-round pick, and the Mavs’ 2027 first-rounder for Kuzma. It’s unclear whether the ’27 pick would’ve had the same light protection that Dallas agreed to in its deal with Charlotte.

Ultimately, after the Wizards decided not to move forward on the Kuzma trade, Dallas ended up sending one of those first-rounders and Holmes to Washington in exchange for Daniel Gafford, completing separate deals with the Wizards and Hornets rather than just a single trade for Kuzma.


In a nutshell: We were going to offer Washington two FRPs along with G. Williams and more. We would not have acquired Gafford in this scenario.

Two first rounders for Kuzma is insane.  That's like the Mavs getting two first rounders for THJ.  Washington will never see that offer again.  I'm so glad that Mavs were saved from themselves.

[WillE]

Two first rounders for Kuzma is insane.  That's like the Mavs getting two first rounders for THJ.  Washington will never see that offer again.  I'm so glad that Mavs were saved from themselves.

How can one judge an outcome if he doesn't know the facts?

We don't know, if the above was the entire offer, do we?

Yet, your evident willingness to blame at least tells quite something about you...

[WillE]

In a nutshell: We were going to offer Washington two FRPs along with G. Williams and more. We would not have acquired Gafford in this scenario.

At least not with the package we received him.

But I'm pretty sure, they still would have brought in another big man. Maybe not Gafford, but not no one.

[Luka77]

How can one judge an outcome if he doesn't know the facts?

We don't know, if the above was the entire offer, do we?

Yet, your evident willingness to blame at least tells quite something about you...

Thanks WillE...your opinion of me is meaningless.

My comment was based on what is being reported not actually offered, nothing more. If that gets you to make an "informed judgement" on me, so be it.

[Winter]

At least not with the package we received him.

But I'm pretty sure, they still would have brought in another big man. Maybe not Gafford, but not no one.

I think you may be right... but clearly not Gafford.

[WillE]

Thanks WillE...your opinion of me is meaningless.

My comment was based on what is being reported, nothing more.

No one reported, that this would have been the offer.

My point is, that I think the FO already did enough to deserve more credit.

It's just tiring to constantly read so much negativity based on premature conclusions.

[KillerLeft]

No one reported, that this would have been the offer.

My point is, that I think the FO already did enough to deserve more credit.

It's just tiring to constantly read so much negativity based on premature conclusions.

I agree that the negativity has gotten out of hand, and I be been guilty at times. 

But I also think there’s enough signs to conclude that two 1sts would’ve gone for Kuzma, and OMG am I glad that didn’t happen.

[WillE]

I agree that the negativity has gotten out of hand, and I be been guilty at times. 

But I also think there’s enough signs to conclude that two 1sts would’ve gone for Kuzma, and OMG am I glad that didn’t happen.

I agree that two FRPs would have been included, but there are still endless ways to compensate value to varying degrees, so especially with trades every detail matters to really judge them.

[KillerLeft]

I agree that two FRPs would have been included, but there are still endless ways to compensate value to varying degrees, so especially with trades every detail matters to really judge them.

Sure, but for me, two first round picks going out and Kuzma coming in are both evils. Very hard to imagine anything canceling that amount of evil out for me. 

One of the easiest ways to make me happy as a fan is to not have Kuzma on the team.

[Luka77]

No one reported, that this would have been the offer.

My point is, that I think the FO already did enough to deserve more credit.

It's just tiring to constantly read so much negativity based on premature conclusions.

Brian Windhorst has now said twice he "believes"  that was the offer.  No one will know exactly what was offered except the Agents and the GM's involved.

My comment that if the offer was indeed two first rounders for Kuzma the chunker, that is insane.  I don't see what your problems and/or judgement of me as a person are.

[SleepingHero]

No one reported, that this would have been the offer.

My point is, that I think the FO already did enough to deserve more credit.

It's just tiring to constantly read so much negativity based on premature conclusions.

You're correct.

But it's also not an insane leap of logic to conjure up a theoretical deal for Kuzma based on the fact that the Mavs had worked out the 2024 FRP deal with the OKC days in advance of the TDL.

The pieces they sent out on the TDL were Grant, Holmes, Seth, and those 2 firsts. 

Grant and Holmes is a money match for Kuz. 2 FRP was Washington's asking price.

Putting it all together we got a pretty big overpay for Kuzma and I think it's justified to critique it.

Thankfully the deals they ended up doing were 10x better in comparison.

[KillerLeft]

Brian Windhorst has now said twice he "believes"  that was the offer.  No one will know exactly what was offered except the Agents and the GM's involved.

My comment that if the offer was indeed two first rounders for Kuzma the chunker, that is insane.  I don't see what your problems and/or judgement of me as a person are.

I don’t think he meant anything personally insulting by his comment. I can kind of tell where he’s coming from, because sometimes you want to come here and be excited about the Mavericks and you get beat over the head with negativity like a ton of bricks. It can be a real drag, sometimes.

[DanSchwartzgan]

FWIW, here's what Stein wrote today on the subject.  (emphasis added was mine):


"Kuzma was the Mavericks’ top trade deadline target. The Wizards wanted two first-round picks in any Kuzma deal. When the teams’ Kuzma talks fizzled, they pivoted to a Daniel Gafford-to-Dallas trade that netted Washington a first-round pick in the upcoming June draft via Oklahoma City."

Carry on.

[KillerLeft]

FWIW, here's what Stein wrote today on the subject.  (emphasis added was mine):


"Kuzma was the Mavericks’ top trade deadline target. The Wizards wanted two first-round picks in any Kuzma deal. When the teams’ Kuzma talks fizzled, they pivoted to a Daniel Gafford-to-Dallas trade that netted Washington a first-round pick in the upcoming June draft via Oklahoma City."

Carry on.

The information everybody’s talking about post-dates that info by a couple of days. Still have to choose to believe it, of course, but both Kuzma and Windhorst are basically saying there was an agreed upon deal, whereas is that older Stein info makes it seem like the Mavs walked away over price. It seems pretty clear that that is not what happened.

At the end of the day, I’m just glad I don’t have to watch Kuzma play for the Mavericks.

[WillE]

Brian Windhorst has now said twice he "believes"  that was the offer.  No one will know exactly what was offered except the Agents and the GM's involved.

My comment that if the offer was indeed two first rounders for Kuzma the chunker, that is insane.  I don't see what your problems and/or judgement of me as a person are.

Ah, then it ws actually reported, thanks.

And I am also glad we didn't do two FRPs on Kuzma. My point was that we could judge isolated about having two FRPs involved, but judging an entire deal we don't know enough about is just to big of a stretch imo.

[SleepingHero]

I didn't want the mavs to trade any firsts on the TDL and I'm still happy we traded 2 for Washington and Gafford over freaking Kyle Kuzma

[WillE]

I don’t think he meant anything personally insulting by his comment. I can kind of tell where he’s coming from, because sometimes you want to come here and be excited about the Mavericks and you get beat over the head with negativity like a ton of bricks. It can be a real drag, sometimes.

Kinda, yes.

I at least want to stand up for how I believe we should treat each other.

This is most probably triggered by the developments in the media we consume every day and my desire to at least try to impact my/our house here for the good of all.

[WillE]

I didn't want the mavs to trade any firsts on the TDL and I'm still happy we traded 2 for Washington and Gafford over freaking Kyle Kuzma

Agree.

And I'm now very curious to see if that not insignificant gamble pays off. For so many reasons, it better should be, but so far, so good I would say.