A Few Thoughts on Mavs 117, Spurs 110

[ItsGoTime]

Yeah. It's always a decision in writing a recap what tone to take. To be objective and dispassionate, or to ride the emotional waves? In truth, there is a lot that could be criticized about this performance, but maybe it's possible to do some of that, while still recognizing the joy in the occasion. I don't understand you to be saying anything different. 

Should be fun to watch the development of this young team!

Ya man, I love it! The reason I put in the babysteps thing is cause that's the measurable thing you can point to to see the growth. It'll be fun to see them reach the milestones, and sure there will be NY bumps along the road, doesn't take the enjoyment out of it. I actually still liked the NY games because it made me feel like they will learn to not let anything get to their head. As long as the team is learning, and I think they are, all is good. 


I've been pretty pessimistic in the recent past just because it didn't seem Dirk was getting a good enough shot at what he'd like to do...compete in the playoffs. Now that he's retired, I get to go back to being more and more optimistic as I can see where this train is headed. Not that there won't be criticism, just that the criticism has a different tone.

[bartlettbear]

Luka is very capable of keeping this up, I am sure he will get banged up and take a day off or two, but his game is based on so much and not just athleticism, so the 82 games should not slow him down as it does some others.

The alst tow games have been very good and this is a play off team once we figure out a few more things.

[SportPsychMav]

Luka is very capable of keeping this up, I am sure he will get banged up and take a day off or two,  but his game is based on so much and not just athleticism, so the 82 games should not slow him down as it does some others. 

  The alst tow games have been very good and this is a play off team once we figure out a few more things.

Actually, the notion that Luka isn't athletic is a myth.

He isn't toned/ripped that's all.
Plus he plays too much video games in all likelihood, which is an injury risk, and disturbs sleeping patterns.

[mavsluvr]

Yeah. It's always a decision in writing a recap what tone to take. To be objective and dispassionate, or to ride the emotional waves? In truth, there is a lot that could be criticized about this performance, but maybe it's possible to do some of that, while still recognizing the joy in the occasion. I don't understand you to be saying anything different. 

Should be fun to watch the development of this young team!

Ya man, I love it! The reason I put in the babysteps thing is cause that's the measurable thing you can point to to see the growth. It'll be fun to see them reach the milestones, and sure there will be NY bumps along the road, doesn't take the enjoyment out of it. I actually still liked the NY games because it made me feel like they will learn to not let anything get to their head. As long as the team is learning, and I think they are, all is good. 


I've been pretty pessimistic in the recent past just because it didn't seem Dirk was getting a good enough shot at what he'd like to do...compete in the playoffs. Now that he's retired, I get to go back to being more and more optimistic as I can see where this train is headed. Not that there won't be criticism, just that the criticism has a different tone.

Yes, those are good points. Experiences like the Knicks losses can be very good learning opportunities, if they really use them that way, as you mention. 

The baby steps view is a wise one, I think. Looking for small but evident measurables, rather than expecting them to be contenders based on a win or two. 

Should be interesting!

[ItsGoTime]

Luka is very capable of keeping this up, I am sure he will get banged up and take a day off or two,  but his game is based on so much and not just athleticism, so the 82 games should not slow him down as it does some others. 

  The alst tow games have been very good and this is a play off team once we figure out a few more things.

Actually, the notion that Luka isn't athletic is a myth.

He isn't toned/ripped that's all.
Plus he plays too much video games in all likelihood, which is an injury risk, and disturbs sleeping patterns.

Disagree, but needing athleticism is the myth. If Luka was athletic most of those layups he makes would be dunks. He is crafty and knows when he gets the defender on his heels is when he can blow by him, which traditionally is called a quick first step.

[SportPsychMav]

Luka is very capable of keeping this up, I am sure he will get banged up and take a day off or two,  but his game is based on so much and not just athleticism, so the 82 games should not slow him down as it does some others. 

  The alst tow games have been very good and this is a play off team once we figure out a few more things.

Actually, the notion that Luka isn't athletic is a myth.

He isn't toned/ripped that's all.
Plus he plays too much video games in all likelihood, which is an injury risk, and disturbs sleeping patterns.

Disagree, but needing athleticism is the myth. If Luka was athletic most of those layups he makes would be dunks. He is crafty and knows when he gets the defender on his heels is when he can blow by him, which traditionally is called a quick first step.

Yeah then we disagree. He can easily dunk, it's just not his preferred way of playing. He has elit deceleration and lateral quickness. He is also plenty fast for his size.
Players relying on skill are not necessarily less athletic.

He has a good frame and can easily add muscle. If he further improved his diet and reduces video gaming he will improve even more.

He isn't even in his physical prime yet and in Europe athletic training comes after skill training so expect his realized athleticism to increase.

I'm sorry to say it but that Luka isn't athletic is an American bias.

---

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.azcentr.../718656002

[ItsGoTime]

Yeah then we disagree. He can easily dunk, it's just not his preferred way of playing. He has elit deceleration and lateral quickness. He is also plenty fast for his size.
Players relying on skill are not necessarily less athletic.

He has a good frame and can easily add muscle. If he further improved his diet and reduces video gaming he will improve even more.

He isn't even in his physical prime yet and in Europe athletic training comes after skill training so expect his realized athleticism to increase.

I'm sorry to say it but that Luka isn't athletic is an American bias.

First the bolded: Sure Luka can dunk, what 6'7" NBA player can't? That has nothing to do with what I said. The kind of athleticism it takes to get within 10' of the rim and dunk it in traffic is not what Luka possesses. If he were to possess that kind of athleticism, he would be even more otherworldly. Once again, good news is, he doesn't have to.

Everything you just said talks about him having the ability to gain athleticism, that doesn't speak to what he has right now. Look, compared to me and you, every guy in the NBA is "athletic", but compared to his peers, he "doesn't have athleticism". Good news is needing athleticism is still a myth. 


Steve Nash excelled on lower than average athleticism, and when he left Dallas and got serious about his diet and working out, his athleticism did increase, but he was still not as athletic as his peers. Crafty is the word to describe these types of guys. 

Sorry Luka doesn't have "everything", doesn't suck that he doesn't though.

[SportPsychMav]

P3’s publicly disclosed data suggest some unorthodoxy to Doncic’s brand of athleticism, akin to a player like James Harden, whose ability to accelerate may be nothing special, but whose ability to stop on a dime is world-class. Doncic’s lateral acceleration numbers from 2017 were in the 71st percentile of all NBA players whom P3 has tested. His slide agility drill results produced times that “outpace most NBA guards tested at P3.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thering...life-twice


That's all from 2017...

[fifteenth]

Seems to me the athleticism discussion is almost always about folks having different definitions of what athleticism is. Luka is obviously athletic, but he's not a DSJ level leaper. DSJ is obviously athletic, but he doesn't have Luka's deceleration or control.

[SportPsychMav]

Seems to me the athleticism discussion is almost always about folks having different definitions of what athleticism is. Luka is obviously athletic, but he's not a DSJ level leaper. DSJ is obviously athletic, but he doesn't have Luka's deceleration or control.

His vertical isn't even bad, he just doesn't rely on it.

[fifteenth]

His vertical isn't even bad, he just doesn't rely on it.

I'm glad he doesn't. I think his floater is more devastating, and easier on his body.

[SportPsychMav]

His vertical isn't even bad, he just doesn't rely on it.

I'm glad he doesn't. I think his floater is more devastating, and easier on his body.

I agree

[mavsluvr]

dont ask me for stats to back this up, but i always feel like mavs - spurs games are always dog fights, no matter the talent level on each side. kind of like some big football rivalries. im always happy with a W against the spurs or lakers, no matter their record

A-men.

[SportPsychMav]

dont ask me for stats to back this up, but i always feel like mavs - spurs games are always dog fights, no matter the talent level on each side. kind of like some big football rivalries. im always happy with a W against the spurs or lakers, no matter their record

A-men.

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

[ItsGoTime]

dont ask me for stats to back this up, but i always feel like mavs - spurs games are always dog fights, no matter the talent level on each side. kind of like some big football rivalries. im always happy with a W against the spurs or lakers, no matter their record

A-men.

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

[mavsluvr]

dont ask me for stats to back this up, but i always feel like mavs - spurs games are always dog fights, no matter the talent level on each side. kind of like some big football rivalries. im always happy with a W against the spurs or lakers, no matter their record

A-men.

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

It always amazes me how the Knicks fans never seem to move on and get a life.

[SportPsychMav]

dont ask me for stats to back this up, but i always feel like mavs - spurs games are always dog fights, no matter the talent level on each side. kind of like some big football rivalries. im always happy with a W against the spurs or lakers, no matter their record

A-men.

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

It always amazes me how the Knicks fans never seem to move on and get a life.

Knicks are their life, it's hard to move on. Most people don't have a life. Many live through video games, internet, tv-series, sports teams, brand fandom.



Plus there is something called the sunk-cost effect if it interests you ?

[mavsluvr]

A-men.

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

It always amazes me how the Knicks fans never seem to move on and get a life.

Knicks are their life, it's hard to move on. Most people don't have a life. Many live through video games, internet, tv-series, sports teams, brand fandom.



Plus there is something called the sunk-cost effect if it interests you ?

Do you mean the illogical thought process that since you have already invested so much into something, that is reason enough in itself to invest more?

[SportPsychMav]

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

It always amazes me how the Knicks fans never seem to move on and get a life.

Knicks are their life, it's hard to move on. Most people don't have a life. Many live through video games, internet, tv-series, sports teams, brand fandom.



Plus there is something called the sunk-cost effect if it interests you ?

Do you mean the illogical thought process that since you have already invested so much into something, that is reason enough in itself to invest more?

It's close enough yes. Sunk cost means since you have invested, you rather stick it out than writing it off, even though riding it out increases your losses. Like staying in a bad movie because you paid for it even though you dislike the movie. I guess you could state it like you just did it's good enough.

Default bias and omission bias probably also play a role. Maybe even gamblers fallacy.

[mavsluvr]

A-men.

That's what the Knicks thought about Porzingis.

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

It always amazes me how the Knicks fans never seem to move on and get a life.

Knicks are their life, it's hard to move on. Most people don't have a life. Many live through video games, internet, tv-series, sports teams, brand fandom.

Wow. I guess I think of sports, at the most basic level, as a way that people relate to each other. I suppose the Knicks fans might get some sort of emotional kick from commiserating or sum'n. 

Plus there is something called the sunk-cost effect if it interests you ?

---

Those games were for sure their game 6 and 7 of the finals.

It always amazes me how the Knicks fans never seem to move on and get a life.

Knicks are their life, it's hard to move on. Most people don't have a life. Many live through video games, internet, tv-series, sports teams, brand fandom.



Plus there is something called the sunk-cost effect if it interests you ?

Do you mean the illogical thought process that since you have already invested so much into something, that is reason enough in itself to invest more?

It's close enough yes. Sunk cost means since you have invested, you rather stick it out than writing it off, even though riding it out increases your losses. Like staying in a bad movie because you paid for it even though you dislike the movie. I guess you could state it like you just did it's good enough.

Default bias and omission bias probably also play a role. Maybe even gamblers fallacy.

We studied the sunk cost effect in economics -- the fallacy that you should spend more on Project A, because you have already sunk so much into it. The theory being that the additional expenditure might serve as a psychological justification for making the previous investment. Interesting to think of it being applied to sticking with a sports team. I can see it!