2021-2022 ROSTER TALK: [ARCHIVED]

[Branduil]

Someone like Brogdon would probably be the best-case scenario at this point. It's possible with his injury history and the Knicks now being out on him, he could be had at a relatively "cheap" price. Something like THJ+Powell+a future 1st. Doubt Rick wants Green.

[cow]

Someone like Brogdon would probably be the best-case scenario at this point. It's possible with his injury history and the Knicks now being out on him, he could be had at a relatively "cheap" price. Something like THJ+Powell+a future 1st. Doubt Rick wants Green.

Doubt he wants THJ when they have Buddy Love.  Doubt anyone wants Powell.

[Branduil]

Doubt he wants THJ when they have Buddy Love.  Doubt anyone wants Powell.

Supposedly they've been trying to move Buddy. Rick might prefer his loyal guy THJ over the more-talented but also more-mercurial Buddy.

[cow]

Supposedly they've been trying to move Buddy. Rick might prefer his loyal guy THJ over the more-talented but also more-mercurial Buddy.

Buddy always seems to be in the trade rumors.  I think the Mavs would be smart to hang onto FRPs.  '25 is a long time away.

[F Gump]

I've racked my brains trying to figure out who TB is, certainly not Bubble.  Reggie typo?

Yes, Bullock. Typo. Fixed now. Sorry about the confusion.

[dirkfansince1998]

In the end it comes down to bad player evaluation and the Mavs reluctance to extend players on expiring deals. Mavs paid extra for THJ after a hot shooting season instead of extending him early. Paid extra for DFS and extended his contract in a career best season. Tried to do the same with Brunson and got burned.

[Mavs2021]

cow
You seem to have a perception that people on this board like the Mavs F.O. when the opposite is plainly obvious.  I don't think he's lying.  He could be 100% on the money.  I don't trust him as a source.

If that was true, I´d be the God of this board , cause I´m the most critical of the MBT and Cuban manages to "exceed" even my low expectations every summer.  Fact is we are already seeing the damage control delusions in full effect again by the usual suspects.

Branduil is spot on about McMahon and I have a huge amount of respect for him. He´s one of the few journalists that hasn´t jumped off the "press release manager"-cliff yet and is not swayed by being served chocolate strawberries by Nico.

[Mavs2021]

And if you turn Brunson into a negative asset long term, you prolong your stay in zero more cap space purgatory.

You guys always act like the team is suddenly not run by the same stupid owner that gave THJ an extension rather than pursue a younger player. The same owner that offered the Walking Duct Tape a full 158/5 extension with a player option. Face the reality that Cuban is a bottom five owner and he´ll always be a bottom five owner. You have a decade of evidence. He´s not suddenly going to become smart, besides conning people out of their money that vote for human scum like Cruz/Abbott. Low hanging fruit, but Cuban is picking the battles he can win.

[MAVS-SLO]

You sure were worse? So far CWood + Dragic + THJ back and we lost Brunson. We’re better imo.

Sure, the pocketbook is the only concern when as a tax team already your offering a guy 22 million a year so you can pay an additional 130 million in tax. Makes sense.

At the best we are the same level as the last season, and that wasn't enough to win a ring. I think we all agree that we and the Knicks have different goals. Our goal is to win a championship, while Knicks are, at the best trying to become a playoff team.

So from Knicks perspective, i think that's an massive overpay and that he is not the player they think they are (number 1). And i'm expecting that will not last long before all the media become backlashing Brunson as an bust and overpay.

From Mavs perspective, you managed to get to the WCF. And on that team you already added a big man you need, and a top prospect for the future. That would be massive step forward for trying to get a ring, so losing your 2 best player  in the playoff for nothing will at the very best put you at the same position as the last year. With much stronger west. So in that situation you have to match that offer, even if it's few million higher then you would want to (comparisons with FVV are just excuses, because of different situations).

The worst part of it is that he was your own draft pick, who has offered himself to you for contract extension FO refused. Listening Nico's words ''we can pay him more than all others'' also indicates which falt is for not extending him.

I think we all learn something from FA before, trade assests we have, draft capital we have that his replacment will be hard to be find.

Maybe statistically Dinwiddie, THJ and Hardy will replace him, but loosing your own draft pick who become 2 best player in the playoff for nothing is disaster. We are  without cap space, so getting nothing in return for him is even worse, because you didn't get anything in return from which you can probably change the scheme on the court.


With his walking him from free grade for offseason will immediately go from A- to an F.  

I'm really curius what Cuban (hopefully) and FO will say on this.

If anything changes, i will gladly take my words back.

PS: His next contract will probably be close to Bertans+Powell, so you can compare theirs contribution in this playoff with Jalen's.

[mvossman]

I notice there is still the narrative on the board that everything good is because of Nico and everything bad is because of Cuban.  I think its time for that to stop.  If Nico is getting the credit for the KP trade, then any mistakes made during from that point of time til now need to be in his lap as well.  A GM needs to know his owners appetite for tax.  To let our second best player walk without offering an extension, trading at the deadline or at least getting something from an S&T is a complete failure. 

I don't really know why folks expected different.  Why would a rando with no NBA experience be able to come in and be one of the better GMs in the league.  There was no reason to believe he would be.  The Nico Honeymoon period should be over.

I'm not absolving Cuban, who has been cheap for over 10 years and hired Nico to begin with, but I feel like the unreasonable Nico cheerleading should probably be put to bed.

[mvossman]

If that was true, I´d be the God of this board , cause I´m the most critical of the MBT and Cuban manages to "exceed" even my low expectations every summer.  Fact is we are already seeing the damage control delusions in full effect again by the usual suspects.

Branduil is spot on about McMahon and I have a huge amount of respect for him. He´s one of the few journalists that hasn´t jumped off the "press release manager"-cliff yet and is not swayed by being served chocolate strawberries by Nico.

You do realize there is a difference between being critical of the FO, and being wildly overcritical, complaining they don't go out of their way to target your favorite players, complaining they don't do crazy stuff like dump half the team so they have cap space to threaten offers on restricted free agents, and generally complaining just to complain.  

I'm not surprised you like McMahon.  He has an axe to grind with the Mavs and has a pessimistic nature to begin with.  He's like your soulmate.

[mvossman]

At the best we are the same level as the last season, and that wasn't enough to win a ring. I think we all agree that we and the Knicks have different goals. Our goal is to win a championship, while Knicks are, at the best trying to become a playoff team.

So from Knicks perspective, i think that's an massive overpay and that he is not the player they think they are (number 1). And i'm expecting that will not last long before all the media become backlashing Brunson as an bust and overpay.

From Mavs perspective, you managed to get to the WCF. And on that team you already added a big man you need, and a top prospect for the future. That would be massive step forward for trying to get a ring, so losing your 2 best player  in the playoff for nothing will at the very best put you at the same position as the last year. With much stronger west. So in that situation you have to match that offer, even if it's few million higher then you would want to (comparisons with FVV are just excuses, because of different situations).

The worst part of it is that he was your own draft pick, who has offered himself to you for contract extension FO refused. Listening Nico's words ''we can pay him more than all others'' also indicates which falt is for not extending him.

I think we all learn something from FA before, trade assests we have, draft capital we have that his replacment will be hard to be find.

Maybe statistically Dinwiddie, THJ and Hardy will replace him, but loosing your own draft pick who become 2 best player in the playoff for nothing is disaster. We are  without cap space, so getting nothing in return for him is even worse, because you didn't get anything in return from which you can probably change the scheme on the court.


With his walking him from free grade for offseason will immediately go from A- to an F.  

I'm really curius what Cuban (hopefully) and FO will say on this.

If anything changes, i will gladly take my words back.

PS: His next contract will probably be close to Bertans+Powell, so you can compare theirs contribution in this playoff with Jalen's.

This team could conceivably be better than last year.  Wood plus Timmy plus Dragic is a lot more depth and addresses our biggest hole.  We also don't have to spend half a season with the dark cloud of KP (lets hope we don't have same issue with Wood).  This team will not be a contender, but I'm skeptical replacing Dragic with Brunson would make us true contenders either.  Ultimately we need to make a trade for a high level two way player eventually, and not having Brunson will make it more difficult (but not impossible).

The Wood trade was very good and if we get Dragic to replace Brunson it wont be a complete disaster for this season.  I am going with a C- right now and maybe Nico can pull another (Wood) rabbit out of the hat (I'm skeptical).

[Okstate819]

https://twitter.com/all_things_mavs/stat...73570?s=21&t=26znR8nRjm1dcrE0h13eSQ

[Chicagojk]

The question is where do we go now?   We were planning to bring back a very expensive team that I think most all of us still thought needed that final move.  Whether that happened now or a year and a half from now.  But we thought we had a tough knit group who played well off each other and would have a punchers chance to advance in playoff series.  

Now we are at a stage where we need two pieces with limited assets compared to other teams.   Do we make a strategic gamble on player?  If so, we better be right.  Are we back in the stage of hoping Dame or other star asks for a trade.  Yuck, if true.  Been there, done that.   Do we take a step back to take a step forward?  Or do we continue on the current path confident a path is known or will be found down the line?

[Branduil]

The question is where do we go now?   We were planning to bring back a very expensive team that I think most all of us still thought needed that final move.  Whether that happened now or a year and a half from now.  But we thought we had a tough knit group who played well off each other and would have a punchers chance to advance in playoff series.  

Now we are at a stage where we need two pieces with limited assets compared to other teams.   Do we make a strategic gamble on player?  If so, we better be right.  Are we back in the stage of hoping Dame or other star asks for a trade.  Yuck, if true.  Been there, done that.   Do we take a step back to take a step forward?  Or do we continue on the current path confident a path is known or will be found down the line?

It's pretty simple, the Mavs can't afford a single mistake now. It goes without saying they can't afford another Brunson. And they will HAVE to bring in a legitimate, unmistakable #2 within the next couple of years, or Luka is gone.

[mvossman]

The question is where do we go now?   We were planning to bring back a very expensive team that I think most all of us still thought needed that final move.  Whether that happened now or a year and a half from now.  But we thought we had a tough knit group who played well off each other and would have a punchers chance to advance in playoff series.  

Now we are at a stage where we need two pieces with limited assets compared to other teams.   Do we make a strategic gamble on player?  If so, we better be right.  Are we back in the stage of hoping Dame or other star asks for a trade.  Yuck, if true.  Been there, done that.   Do we take a step back to take a step forward?  Or do we continue on the current path confident a path is known or will be found down the line?

I don't think they need two pieces.  I think the general thought is Brunson would be outgoing for that one piece we really need.  The Bucks showed that you can trade for that piece without sending back young or high level players, but it costs a ton in draft capital.  That is the final move the Mavs will eventually need to make (which they can pull as soon as next years draft is done).

This season will be about evaluation.  Does Wood fit in that starting center position?  Does Green take the next step?  Does Frank have any more progression in him?  Does Dinwiddie get even better another year removed from ACL?  Can Timmy learn to play in Kidd's defense?  Does Hardy have anything? 

To me this team looks like a 4/5 seed that will have a reasonable chance to get to second round (Luka) but will have a hard time getting farther than that (what we though of last year's team).

[Kammrath]

This season will be about evaluation.  Does Wood fit in that starting center position?  Does Green take the next step?  Does Frank have any more progression in him?  Does Dinwiddie get even better another year removed from ACL?  Can Timmy learn to play in Kidd's defense?  Does Hardy have anything? 

Yep. 

BUT if Luka makes the conditioning leap, anything is possible.

[Chicagojk]

I don't think they need two pieces.  I think the general thought is Brunson would be outgoing for that one piece we really need.  The Bucks showed that you can trade for that piece without sending back young or high level players, but it costs a ton in draft capital.  That is the final move the Mavs will eventually need to make (which they can pull as soon as next years draft is done).

This season will be about evaluation.  Does Wood fit in that starting center position?  Does Green take the next step?  Does Frank have any more progression in him?  Does Dinwiddie get even better another year removed from ACL?  Can Timmy learn to play in Kidd's defense?  Does Hardy have anything? 

To me this team looks like a 4/5 seed that will have a reasonable chance to get to second round (Luka) but will have a hard time getting farther than that (what we though of last year's team).

I am in a much more negative space right now and lowered long term expectations.

If this season is about evaluation as you state, then lets bring in some more guys with upside.  I was so impressed with Kidd this year and how he gave players freedom on the court.   I think that bodes well if we get young, mature guys with upside too.

[MAVS-SLO]

This team could conceivably be better than last year.  Wood plus Timmy plus Dragic is a lot more depth and addresses our biggest hole.  We also don't have to spend half a season with the dark cloud of KP (lets hope we don't have same issue with Wood).  This team will not be a contender, but I'm skeptical replacing Dragic with Brunson would make us true contenders either.  Ultimately we need to make a trade for a high level two way player eventually, and not having Brunson will make it more difficult (but not impossible).

The Wood trade was very good and if we get Dragic to replace Brunson it wont be a complete disaster for this season.  I am going with a C- right now and maybe Nico can pull another (Wood) rabbit out of the hat (I'm skeptical).

Don't forget that whole west is gonna be much stronger then last season (Warriors, Clippers, Memphis, Suns, Nuggets, Pelicans).

I completly agree with Wood, THJ back and dark cloud of KP. Dragic (if he signs) is vet min. guy, no a starter which Brunson was. Also don't forget that Brunson was one of most healthy players in the roster during last 2 seasons.

Replacing Brunson with Dragic will not put as a direct contender, the point is that we finally managed to replace one hole in roster without giving anything valuable in return, to then opening another hole in the roster and that for nothing. 

I also completly agree that high 2/3 level player would have much more bigger efect on this team than Brunson (that's also the reason i'm against the trades for the players like Brogdon and others), but problem is how can you get him?

We won't have cap space for xy years (and even with them FO didn't used it), we don't have assets to pull such a trade and draft capital is also weak.

In that situation you have to match the offer for a player, even if he is few million higher than you would want. I saw somewhere these days how similar situation this was with Middleton extension with the Bucks. When you are putted in that situation that you will not know how many time you will looking for a player of this level. And i don't think he is max or. number 1 player.

Even if you don't want this contract you loose an asset. Or some kind of combinations of others (Dinwiddie, THJ) as an assets.

Then we can talk about what a fool the Cuban made of himself with his statement ''we can pay him more than anybody'', to the reports now that FO knew he is not going to resign for weeks.

https://twitter.com/ballysportssw/status...1618946048


We can all hope that Hardy will replace Brunson, but Cuban's stinginess with luxury cap will surrely not have positive efect in the future to attrack the players and build a dynasty.

And again, Brunson next year salary will be around Bertans+Powell.

[Mavs2021]

I am in a much more negative space right now and lowered long term expectations.

If this season is about evaluation as you state, then lets bring in some more guys with upside.  I was so impressed with Kidd this year and how he gave players freedom on the court.   I think that bodes well if we get young, mature guys with upside too.

Like Theo Pinson. The absolute state of the Mavs making Pinson a RFA like any other team in the league would sign that cheerleader.