2021-2022 ROSTER TALK: [ARCHIVED]

[SleepingHero]

Effective THJ was a mirage. Rick did good with him, we should have just wished THJ well on his way when his contract expired. Instead we signed him to a big deal that makes absolutely no sense.

I honestly don't think THJ's deal is bad in a sense. Sure he's vastly underperforming his contract, but the fact it's a descending contract makes it valuable. 

Compared to other 2-guards that are playing the 6th man role and are getting paid around his salary:

Bogdan- $18 mil for the next 2 years. Averaging 12/4/3 on 41/35/77 
Jordan Clarkson-  $13.3, $14.2 mil the next 2 years. Averaging 15/3/2 on 40/32/81
Buddy- $20.5, $18.5mil the next 2 years. Averaging 16/4/2 on 40/38.5/86

Then there's THJ who's currently sitting at 14.5/4/2 on 39/33/75. 

I'm sure there are a lot more guys that qualify. But looks like it's a down year for almost every shooting guard and THJ should still be a relatively valued asset.

[dirkfansince1998]

Effective THJ was a mirage. Rick did good with him, we should have just wished THJ well on his way when his contract expired. Instead we signed him to a big deal that makes absolutely no sense.

I wonder if the THJ deal was agreed upon before Nico and Kidd took over. Under RC a new contract for him would have made a lot of sense. He was a crucial part of the offense and one of the best high volume 3-point shooters in the league.
But his defensive limitations were obvious. Stated many times in different threads. He is a solid on ball defender but a really bad team defender. Kidd introduced new defensive schemes that require more rotations/switches/activity off the ball and knowingly gave a big contract to a player that does not fit into his prefered schemes? Makes no sense.

[KillerLeft]

He's retired, my guy. 

And honestly, I think DFS is coming pretty close to the version of Trix the Mavs had (though not the PHX version of course).

[KillerLeft]

Kidd introduced new defensive schemes that require more rotations/switches/activity off the ball and knowingly gave a big contract to a player that does not fit into his prefered schemes? Makes no sense.

I think you might be right about them sort of inheriting the decision. Then again, it seems like it was at least plan B on their list, behind Lowry, so maybe there were other ideas we never heard about didn't work out, either. Maybe re-signing THJ rather than go over the cap with even less salary was preferable. 

And maybe, just maybe, they thought they could help THJ become a better team defender. I'd say the rising defensive rating for the team overall points to the idea that he's probably improving a little. I wouldn't object to moving him, at this point (not trying to defend his season at all) but I don't think it's crazy to wonder if he can improve enough on that end to reach the point where it doesn't negate his offense (the absence of THAT is really the problem, lately). It's possible, imo, because I totally agree with you that his on-ball defense is solid much of the time and even very good when he's focused. The problem is within this new team scheme, as you say.

[sterlingmallory]

Who is this mythical creature that you speak of; this better version of DFS?

The way some people talk about him on this forum, you'd think only Giannis or Kawhi could be better than DFS. I say this as someone that likes DFS myself, it's just funny reading the way DFS stans talk about him.

[KillerLeft]

you'd think only Giannis or Kawhi could be better than DFS

I would take either of them over DFS.

… So that’s two, so far.

[SleepingHero]

I would take either of them over DFS.

… So that’s two, so far.

Tatum? Jaylen Brown? Paul George? Mikal Bridges? Pascal Siakam?

[KillerLeft]

Tatum? Jaylen Brown? Paul George? Mikal Bridges? Pascal Siakam?

Not sure about bridges, I need to watch them more.

The rest, sure. But they are all stars. I highly doubt Dallas has a shot at any of them.

The point is that DFS is very far down on the list of problems that need to be solved here.

[SleepingHero]

The point is that DFS is very far down on the list of problems that need to be solved here.

I don't think a single person here is labeling DFS a problem to be fixed.

[KillerLeft]

I don't think a single person here is labeling DFS a problem to be fixed.

I beg to differ. From my POV anyone who thinks he should be replaced in the starting lineup is calling him a problem.

Next to Luka, his job here should be the most secure on the team, in my opinion. He’s not the team’s second best player, but I believe he does his job the second best and his job fits in perfectly with the guy who does it the first best.

[dirkfansince1998]

Not sure about bridges, I need to watch them more.

The rest, sure. But they are all stars. I highly doubt Dallas has a shot at any of them.

The point is that DFS is very far down on the list of problems that need to be solved here.

I am not on team replace DFS. I am on team lower his work load. Mavs don´t need to replace him. They need to replace one of the smaller wings and find a forward that can play some of DFS´s and Kleber´s minutes. Someone like RoCo or Batum.

[KillerLeft]

I am not on team replace DFS. I am on team lower is work load. Mavs don´t need to replace him. They need to replace one of the smaller wings and find a forward that can play some of DFS´s and Kleber´s minutes. Someone like RoCo or Batum.

I am on the team with you. Two DFS types are better than one.

[ItsGoTime]

I am not on team replace DFS. I am on team lower his work load. Mavs don´t need to replace him. They need to replace one of the smaller wings and find a forward that can play some of DFS´s and Kleber´s minutes. Someone like RoCo or Batum.

Back when debating who’s better, DFS vs RoCo I said I think RoCo was the better player and I would take him over DFS but I’d prefer to have both.

[KillerLeft]

Back when debating who’s better, DFS vs RoCo I said I think RoCo was the better player and I would take him over DFS but I’d prefer to have both.

It's cool to have opinions like this. Can we at least acknowledge that it's a conversation? There was a time when you wouldn't even entertain it. 

And, let's say you were right then. Have you seen Covington play much lately? He has fallen off. I don't know if it's permanent, but I do think it's safe to say that wherever you might fall in that comparison right now, the two players are trending in opposite directions, no?

[dirkfansince1998]

It's cool to have opinions like this. Can we at least acknowledge that it's a conversation? There was a time when you wouldn't even entertain it. 

And, let's say you were right then. Have you seen Covington play much lately? He has fallen off. I don't know if it's permanent, but I do think it's safe to say that wherever you might fall in that comparison right now, the two players are trending in opposite directions, no?

RoCo looked a lot better in the last couple of games. Averaging 11/8, 2.3stl/1.4blks in january. Shooting 42% from 3. Entire Blazers team is looking better without Lillard and McCollum.
I was with @"ItsGoTime" because it wasn´t really a debate when we had that discussion two or even one year ago. RoCo was a legit all defense team 3&D player. Thing is that DFS improved a lot. RoCo on the other hand looked like he was starting to lose a step.
Comparing both right now they are about equal on the boards. DFS is a better on ball defender (especially against quick guards). RoCo is a better help defender and even offers some rim protection.

[KillerLeft]

I was with @ItsGoTime because it wasn´t really a debate when we had that discussion two or even one year ago

Not sure I agree "it wasn't a debate" but I can sure respect people's opinions that don't jive with mine, then and now. 

I'm just shocked (then and now) by people who actually believe getting DFS of all people out of this lineup should be the goal. You would almost have to create an All Star team to do that, imo.

[dirkfansince1998]

Not sure I agree "it wasn't a debate" but I can sure respect people's opinions that don't jive with mine, then and now. 

I'm just shocked (then and now) by people who actually believe getting DFS of all people out of this lineup should be the goal. You would almost have to create an All Star team to do that, imo.

I know defense isn´t just about boxscore metrics (+/- is even more favorable for RoCo) but even if you think that DFS was more valuable on offense. RoCo finished the 19/20 season top 10 in steals and blocks. That´s prime Draymond/Kirilenko territory. He was one of the few players that could anchor a defense from the wing or as a small ball big after the Rockets trade.

[KillerLeft]

I know defense isn´t just about boxscore metrics (+/- is even more favorable for RoCo) but even if you think that DFS was more valuable on offense. RoCo finished the 19/20 season top 10 in steals and blocks. That´s prime Draymond/Kirilenko territory. He was one of the few players that could anchor a defense from the wing or as a small ball big after the Rockets trade.

Oh, I know. I'm a fan! 

I'm not meaning to put Covington down. I just feel like I was able to see the player DFS is now back then, if that makes sense.

[dirkfansince1998]

Oh, I know. I'm a fan! 

I'm not meaning to put Covington down. I just feel like I was able to see the player DFS is now back then, if that makes sense.

Absolutely. You are a time traveler.

[KillerLeft]

Absolutely. You are a time traveler.

lol, I'm being serious! It's ok to make fun of me - I can take it. And, I know you know what I really mean (not time travel).