90's Mavs question

[Chicagojk]

I became a Mavs fans during the brief 3J run.   I remember what happened to Kidd and the subsequent trade to PHX.  But I am having trouble remembering what happened to Mashburn and Jackson.  Can someone help me fill in as years have made this blurry?

Mashburn first three years points per game were 19, 24, and 23.   His fourth year it looks like he played 37 games but started only 21.  Was he coming off the bench?  Injury?  He only average 10 points per game during his fourth year and then was traded for Kurt Thomas.   Mashburn had some solid seasons for some good Heat teams and then averaged over 20 a game with Charlotte and New Orleans before he had an injury.   Was his dip in production was that whole Triangle mess??

Jim Jackson had an even weirder career.   16, 19, 25, 20 and 15 over his first five years.  Then he went to play for 13 different teams.   I believe he had some ankle injuries, but can't remember how his stay ended here either.  I believe it was messy.  Wikipedia says he was traded to NJ with Sam Cassell, Eric Montross, George McCloud and Chris Gatling for Shawn Bradley, Ed O'bannon, Robert Pack and Khalid Reeves.  What a throwback to names that is.  It looks like he put up solid stats, but never stuck around more than a year with a team and never made much of an impact.

That first year with Kidd was so fun, and it was shocking how fast it fell apart.

[SleepingHero]

This is one of my favorite vids I keep on bookmark detailing the fall of Triple J ranch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78rlrhHveCg

[MrGoat]

If I remember Mashburn was dealing with some injury issues that year he got traded. And yes it was messy with Jackson. Really with all three of them. None of the Js really got along with each other, especially Mashburn and Jackson and the front office was in continuous flux. I think Perot bought the team during the triple J era as well, it got so messy they just blew it up

[HoosierDaddyKid]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamal_Mashburn

[MrGoat]

Though the timing of this thread spooked me because I just watched a long interview with Mash yesterday

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdUrgIPR96c

[Chicagojk]

This is one of my favorite vids I keep on bookmark detailing the fall of Triple J ranch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78rlrhHveCg

Thanks.  That is really informative and super depressing.  I was young back then and thought the 3J's were the start of something amazing.    There was a draft after Kidd's rookie season that was the first draft I did a lot of "studying" for and bought a few draft guides.   I spent way too much time debating Samaki Walker vs. Erik Dampier vs. Lorenzen Wright.   And literally no time thinking about Kobe Bryant or Steve Nash.  Ugh.  

I seem to remember Don Nelson saying he would have never traded Kidd but he was brought in after the trade.   What a fascinating look down memory lane!

[SkenfromLMF]

If I remember Mashburn was dealing with some injury issues that year he got traded. And yes it was messy with Jackson. Really with all three of them. None of the Js really got along with each other, especially Mashburn and Jackson and the front office was in continuous flux. I think Perot bought the team during the triple J era as well, it got so messy they just blew it up

So the irony is that rumors were swirling about a Jackson trade to Phoenix around the start of the 96-97 season. But a couple of things happened that really derailed that thinking and among them was the development of Richard Dumas (not Tony) in Phoenix. So Phoenix has a LOADED backcourt and Jackson didn't look like a player that was going to be happy in the shadow that Kevin Johnson and Charles Barkley had with PHX... Dumas made that concern unnecessary, and Dallas was stuck with Jim Jackson who was just not very liked by the rest of the J's. Dick Motta joked that the 4th J was the most dominant - Jealousy!

So Dallas gets to December and Kidd has a DWI incident... That seemed to be the end for Kidd in Dallas - the crazy thing is that Rick Pitino was telling Mashburn to do whatever it took to get out of Dallas even if that meant to quit on the team. I pretty much loathe Ricky the P. Speaking of Samaki Walker (Louisville) it was Pitino that started hyping him when he knew that Antoine Walker (Kentucky) was getting a lot of attention by NBA types in that draft - Pitino bragged about getting a sucker to take him.

So Dallas (remember that Frank Zachanelli - the acting GM aka Zach the HACK - was NOT really an NBA guy, but a Perot guy) makes the trade that sent Kidd to PHX. Dallas did not get the rookie PG (Nash), nor the starting PG (Kevin Johnson), NOR any draft compensation for the player that in '94-95 was co ROY as the 2nd pick in the draft. Not only that, but Dallas had to eat the contract of A.C. Green to make the trade work. (memory says that it was Zachanelli that basically ran Keith Grant off the Mavs for a couple of years and it was mark that brought him back). THIS EPISODE is the biggest reason I have been a Don and Donnie Nelson fan in that I remember this F/O without stable leadership at the helm and it was  - well the worst run organization for the entire decade in professional sports, and the lottery screwed us every time!

IF Dallas had gotten either Nash or some draft compensation for the Kidd trade, Dallas could have possibly kept their pick in the '99 draft which PHX used to select Shawn Marion.
When the Dirk trade went down, Perot forced Nelson to make the deal with Milwaukee so that they could get "something more that just Dirk" with the 6th pick. So the Dirk trade ended up being #6 for #9 & #18 to Milwaukee...  The only thing I wish could have happened is that Dallas could have gotten another top 10 pick and kept Paul Pierce from being Boston's consolation prize.

Nelson then flipped #18 and the Mavs unprotected '99 pick for Nash - whom I will always say was the piece that should have been included in the J-Kidd trade, but wasn't - and part of the reasoning at the time was that Donnie had been on the Phoenix staff when Don brought him to Dallas.

[Dahlsim]

Thanks.  That is really informative and super depressing.  I was young back then and thought the 3J's were the start of something amazing.    There was a draft after Kidd's rookie season that was the first draft I did a lot of "studying" for and bought a few draft guides.   I spent way too much time debating Samaki Walker vs. Erik Dampier vs. Lorenzen Wright.   And literally no time thinking about Kobe Bryant or Steve Nash.  Ugh.  

I seem to remember Don Nelson saying he would have never traded Kidd but he was brought in after the trade.   What a fascinating look down memory lane!

Nice thread.  

Jim Jackson had an even weirder career.   16, 19, 25, 20 and 15 over his first five years.  Then he went to play for 13 different teams.   I believe he had some ankle injuries,

Just on this, the fall of Jim Jackson.  I always recall Jim Jackson looking like he was just leveling up into almost super star level wing for a brief stretch then having that severe ankle turn after which he came back but never, ever looked the same.  

He was good after that ankle but never great and always seemed to me more careful and tentative in his play.  Maybe that extended his play as he felt almost like a solid but unspectacular NBA journeyman role player after his his 3-J days and no longer really threatened to reach star level.  

He has also become what is now a pretty decent (again not great) commentator / analyst.