+- MavsBoard (https://www.mavsboard.com)
+-- Forum: Boards (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Dallas Mavericks and the NBA (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=2)
+--- Thread: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis | TRADED to WAS (/showthread.php?tid=56)
Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
65
66
67
68
69
70
71
72
73
74
75
76
77
78
79
80
81
82
83
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100
101
102
103
104
105
106
107
108
109
110
111
112
113
114
115
116
117
118
119
120
121
122
123
124
125
126
127
128
129
130
131
132
133
134
135
136
137
138
139
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - bin610 - 11-30-2019
Surely he can at least find a way to roll to the basket for a couple dunks even if his shot isn't going.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Scott41theMavs - 11-30-2019
(11-29-2019, 11:47 PM)TheSportyChannel Wrote: Porzingis 0-8 from the field and 0-6 from 3’s. 2 points for the game. Brought him into the mavs to be Luka robin when Luka has an off game. He’s so far been not worth a penny so far. He’s been a liability and still takes a shot as soon as someone throws him the ball.
You place no value whatsoever on defensive dominance and rebounding. You will not be missed here.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Fuerza1 - 11-30-2019
(11-30-2019, 01:37 PM)iolide Wrote: If he's still playing like this next year; sure. But it's way to early still IMO.
And besides, One is coming off 18 months of inactivity and the other has been playing ball without much interruption.
Last night, a lot of his shots looked short so to me, his legs are still getting there i guess.
Wasn't it way too early to call THJ an inefficient chucker too? People forget THJ was injured too, I don't think he was cleared until September. Yet we called him an inefficient chucker and other mean things.
Seems like THJ has no room for error but KP is above any criticism. He's been cleared to play since February. I highly doubt his legs aren't there. He is missing wide open looks and forcing shots in the post.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Scott41theMavs - 11-30-2019
(11-30-2019, 02:29 PM)Fuerza1 Wrote: Wasn't it way too early to call THJ an inefficient chucker too? People forget THJ was injured too, I don't think he was cleared until September. Yet we called him an inefficient chucker and other mean things.
Seems like THJ has no room for error but KP is above any criticism. He's been cleared to play since February. I highly doubt his legs aren't there. He is missing wide open looks and forcing shots in the post.
Methinks you assume that no one watched THJ play basketball prior to this year, when many here have followed his career as NBA-wide fans. Oh, and Mavs fans got to see a fair amount of him last year prior to his injury. His reputation as one of the absolute worst chuckers in the league was rotundly well-established from the time of his departure from Atlanta until the beginning of this season. To say otherwise is a bad-faith revision of historical reality.
That said, I appreciate greatly that THJ has the humility and intelligence to adapt as a player. If he's the guy we've seen the past five games (and no, Luka, not "since the beginning of the season" - that's magnanimous, but it's also horse puckey), then he will be worth his contract (!!!) and a player who should stay here a while. My problem is with the manure you're spreading, not with THJ.
As for KP, people are willing to give him time because 1) he is coming back from a major injury, 2) his play on the defensive end and rebounding (especially compared to past years) is close to being above reproach, and 3) if he is long-term garbage on offense, then the sky will have indeed fallen, because we've committed $150 mil to him and he'll be untradeable for the comparable talent we would need to get back, which probably snowballs eventually into Luka demanding a trade. I would think we would both agree that KP needs to spend a Dirk-load of time in the gym working on his offensive game. I think it's clear watching the games that it's 80% or more mental. Players outside of Markell Fultz don't struggle that way if that's not the case.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Fuerza1 - 11-30-2019
(11-30-2019, 02:49 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: Methinks you assume that no one watched THJ play basketball prior to this year, when many here have followed his career as NBA-wide fans. Oh, and Mavs fans got to see a fair amount of him last year prior to his injury. His reputation as one of the absolute worst chuckers in the league was rotundly well-established from the time of his departure from Atlanta until the beginning of this season. To say otherwise is a bad-faith revision of historical reality.Weren't we all under the same understanding that THJ would be more efficient in a reduced role rather than the go-to scoring ones he had in NY and with us second half of last year? You know like the one he had in ATL?
That said, I appreciate greatly that THJ has the humility and intelligence to adapt as a player. If he's the guy we've seen the past five games (and no, Luka, not "since the beginning of the season" - that's magnanimous, but it's also horse puckey), then he will be worth his contract (!!!) and a player who should stay here a while. My problem is with the manure you're spreading, not with THJ.
As for KP, people are willing to give him time because 1) he is coming back from a major injury, 2) his play on the defensive end and rebounding (especially compared to past years) is close to being above reproach, and 3) if he is long-term garbage on offense, then the sky will have indeed fallen, because we've committed $150 mil to him and he'll be untradeable for the comparable talent we would need to get back, which probably snowballs eventually into Luka demanding a trade. I would think we would both agree that KP needs to spend a Dirk-load of time in the gym working on his offensive game. I think it's clear watching the games that it's 80% or more mental. Players outside of Markell Fultz don't struggle that way if that's not the case.
That's what we hoped for and we got it; thus far it's paying dividends for THJ and the Mavs. But it's still not enough for some "fans."
Many of us, including me, called his contract one of the worst in the league based on his earlier play. Right now, he's still overpaid but it's far from one of the worst. It's only two years left and he has a player option next summer. KP, for instance, you admit is not living up to his contract on the offensive side. But I don't see anyone saying he's overpaid. I guess everyone is still infatuated with "potential." I prefer results.
And mental seems like a good excuse for any player struggling. Thanks, I'll start using that one more often.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - StepBackJay - 11-30-2019
Man KP cannot buy a bucket from outside. I think he needs to shoot less of those a game. KP standing at the 3 point line does give Doncic a lot of space to operate but then it limits what KP can do. Every look KP takes is basically wide open because you can't really close out on a 7'3 guy and yet they rim out a ton.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Scott41theMavs - 11-30-2019
(11-30-2019, 03:21 PM)Fuerza1 Wrote: I guess everyone is still infatuated with "potential." I prefer results.
And mental seems like a good excuse for any player struggling. Thanks, I'll start using that one more often.
You might want to apply the first of those perspectivally and the second rhetorically when it comes to Brunson. Why does a small sample size excuse Brunson (and even make us all willing to forgive THJ) but not Porzingis?
Don't forget that KP was quite decent (if rather raw) offensively prior to his injury. He has a solid history of decent, max-contract-worthy-when-combined-with-his-rim-protection offensive play. Based on that, his problems are either 1) physical (in which case he needs to see the team physician), 2) mental (in which case he needs to see the team sports psychologist), or 3) rust (in which case he needs to hit the gym).
Mavs fans aren't writing off KP because that would be extremely stupid. Nearly every national pundit has chimed in that he will get better, but that it might take him up to a full season. In other words, patience is the choice not to be foolish. Moreover, the Mavs couldn't trade for KP without the willingness to give him that max deal, but there were several other league execs who groused that they didn't have the opportunity to beat Dallas's deal (meaning they would have given more for him than the Mavs did, and meaning that they would have been just as willing to give him that big contract).
Luka and KP are the future. I don't say that as a KP homer; I say it as a Mavs fan. We will see who else on the current roster is still here at the beginning of the 2021-22 season. Guess what the answer to that question might be.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Lucky Luciano - 12-01-2019
THJ doesn't play defense nor does he snatch up double digit rebounds. Last I checked KP was top 5 in blocks and top 3 in altered shots at the rim and in top 5 discussion for defensive player of the year so far. At least KP has been consistent on 1 half of the court. THJ was consistently bad on both sides for the larger part of the last few years. KP can score 0 points and still be more important than THJ out there as long as he's playing excellent defense as he's been doing.
Todays game
THJ 8 points in 30 minutes on 30% shooting from the field with 2 rebounds and 1 assist (In 30 minutes!!!!) lol Also a plus minus of 0 worst on the team (We literally played way better when he was on the bench) Timmy went 0-7 from 3 today.
KP 15 points in 27 mins on 45% shooting from the field with the highest plus minus of the starters +12 (Only second to team high D Warp)
Also that Suns game which was probably KPs worst offensive game of his career, he was still a positive on the plus minus again highest of the starters where is THJ was a -1 THJ had a really strong shooting game percentage wise too but he had literally 0 assists in almost 37 minutes! and got cooked on the defensive end.
That suns game was literally the best opportunity to dog KP and pump up THJ and it still showed on the box score, +/- and win shares who was more important on the floor.
Timmy had 8 pionts 1 rebound and 1 assist in 30 minutes the game before that on 37% from the field and 25% from 3 with a -13.
Dude has a total of 2 assists in the 3 last games!!! That's less than 1 assist per game average good grief! He started and he's played 33 minutes per game average!!! He makes Barnes look like a savant on the assist game lol.
I can't figure out if this dude "Fuerza" is either a troll or a secret account from Timmy himself since all he does is hate on guys like Seth who was endangering his starting job and now KP having a shooting slump to keep the heat off of him. lmao its really weird to see people post like he does and question if he's really serious or not hahahaha.
All that said I like the turn THJ is making by taking less awful forced shots. He's had a bad shooting night 2 out of the last 3 nights but I have hopes he can continue to grow and find ways to move better without the ball to get himself better looks. Dude worked his ass off this summer and I'd like to see him continue to be rewarded. Even though his on ball defense has been bad he's found ways to get some good passing lane or off ball steals. Any effort on the defensive end is going to go a long way. He does however need to pass the ball better. His Dirkie he earned the other night wasn't just cause he had 30 points it was cause he pulled in 5 boards and 5 or 6 assists and didn't have a defensive assignment that was going to get him cooked. I'd love to see him continue to grow in our offense and become a serious weapon for us!
KP needs to get out of his head and lock in the gym and shoot till his arms are noodles the next few off days. He will get his groove again. My only major issue with KP this early (Giving him time to get his new role figured out) is that he plays soft af. I get it that he was a frail guy who played a real finesse style for so long but he's bulked up and has to get bigger in his head as well. At his size and athletic ability he could be Giannis with a deadly 3 pointer. He has to lift weights in his head and get some edge to himself for us to really because scary. I think he can do it but I doubt it comes this season. Also he needs to work his post game like Dirk learned late on. Dirk used his body to bump defenders creating a little space then using the legendary one legged fade to maintain shooting freedom from being blocked. KP is taller with a higher release and can jump higher. This should be a common sense move. Every other great star has practiced it and tossed it in their repertoire.
Good news is we have plenty of time going forward assuming everyone stays healthy.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - windjc - 12-01-2019
(11-30-2019, 03:21 PM)Fuerza1 Wrote:(11-30-2019, 02:49 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: Methinks you assume that no one watched THJ play basketball prior to this year, when many here have followed his career as NBA-wide fans. Oh, and Mavs fans got to see a fair amount of him last year prior to his injury. His reputation as one of the absolute worst chuckers in the league was rotundly well-established from the time of his departure from Atlanta until the beginning of this season. To say otherwise is a bad-faith revision of historical reality.Weren't we all under the same understanding that THJ would be more efficient in a reduced role rather than the go-to scoring ones he had in NY and with us second half of last year? You know like the one he had in ATL?
That said, I appreciate greatly that THJ has the humility and intelligence to adapt as a player. If he's the guy we've seen the past five games (and no, Luka, not "since the beginning of the season" - that's magnanimous, but it's also horse puckey), then he will be worth his contract (!!!) and a player who should stay here a while. My problem is with the manure you're spreading, not with THJ.
As for KP, people are willing to give him time because 1) he is coming back from a major injury, 2) his play on the defensive end and rebounding (especially compared to past years) is close to being above reproach, and 3) if he is long-term garbage on offense, then the sky will have indeed fallen, because we've committed $150 mil to him and he'll be untradeable for the comparable talent we would need to get back, which probably snowballs eventually into Luka demanding a trade. I would think we would both agree that KP needs to spend a Dirk-load of time in the gym working on his offensive game. I think it's clear watching the games that it's 80% or more mental. Players outside of Markell Fultz don't struggle that way if that's not the case.
That's what we hoped for and we got it; thus far it's paying dividends for THJ and the Mavs. But it's still not enough for some "fans."
Many of us, including me, called his contract one of the worst in the league based on his earlier play. Right now, he's still overpaid but it's far from one of the worst. It's only two years left and he has a player option next summer. KP, for instance, you admit is not living up to his contract on the offensive side. But I don't see anyone saying he's overpaid. I guess everyone is still infatuated with "potential." I prefer results.
And mental seems like a good excuse for any player struggling. Thanks, I'll start using that one more often.
How was Paul George the first season back from his injury?
What's wrong with people on here. KP is a max player for sure, with the potential to be ALL-NBA during his career. Heck, Kellerman talked about this just this week.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - ItsGoTime - 12-02-2019
I would really like for KP to work on not getting shook from contact. To me that is the biggest factor in him turning the corner. It seems every time he gets bumped even a little, his control of the ball becomes an issue. Dirk had to figure that out early in his career too. I'd love to see Dirk attend some practices to help the big fella out in many facets of the game.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Mavsfan12 - 12-02-2019
(12-02-2019, 12:03 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: I would really like for KP to work on not getting shook from contact. To me that is the biggest factor in him turning the corner. It seems every time he gets bumped even a little, his control of the ball becomes an issue. Dirk had to figure that out early in his career too. I'd love to see Dirk attend some practices to help the big fella out in many facets of the game.
How cool would it be to have KP mentored by Dirk? The possibilities are endless. Really has all the ability to be All-NBA. Dirk's moves on offense with KP's defensive skillset? I know that asking him to BE Dirk is not fair to him. On the other hand, I have optimism that KP's abilities in some ways surpass Dirk's. I think he is just rushing and needs time to have the game slow back down again. It will happen - especially if his work ethic is strong.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - ClutchDirk - 12-02-2019
When [b]Kristaps Porzingis[/b] was traded to the Mavericks last season, he was joined by [b]Tim Hardaway Jr., Courtney Lee [/b]and [b]Trey Burke [/b]on the move to Dallas.
Nearly a year later, what precipitated to the deal is still somewhat of a mystery. There was a meeting between Porzingis and the Knicks' front office[b] [/b]about the direction of the team, and just two days later, the Latvian native was out the door. People have said that Porzingis was so unhappy, he demanded the trade himself.
But Burke -- now with the 76ers and who was back at Madison Square Garden on Friday for the first time since the trade -- shed a new light on the days leading up to Porzingis' departure.
"I don't think he was happy at the time,'' Burke told The Post on Friday. "But I do think he wanted to stay. I think something happened at the meeting. I don't know everything. Going into the meeting, KP had one type of understanding. After the meeting, there was a 180.
"I know once Knicks management and KP had that meeting, KP was out of New York because of what was said. I think he went into the meeting hoping, like, 'OK, what's the plan for next year?' And something went wrong in that meeting and it just blew up. And that was the end of Porzingis."
Burke is the first player to speak publicly about the trade. Porzingis returned to New York for the first time as a visiting player earlier in the season, but didn't have much to say on the subject.
"I'll let [Porzingis] tell his own story,'' Burke said. "I know he still has some stuff to get off his chest.''
But the point guard did provide a bit of a look into what Porzingis may be feeling since his departure from the Knicks.
"One thing he did say, a lot of things the press said, he felt like wasn't true,'' Burke said. "He feels like there was a narrative that got out about him, he couldn't defend himself. I don't know if [Dallas] told him not to talk that much, but he wasn't talking. I do think he has his side.''
http://www.sny.tv/knicks/news/former-knick-trey-burke-on-kristaps-porzingis-i-know-he-still-has-some-stuff-to-get-off-his-chest/312031902
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Tyler - 12-02-2019
One of these days the full story will come out. I can totally see Dallas asking him to just let it go so that it won't distract from his much larger goal to come back, play at an elite level, and win games. In the timeline where KP wins a championship in Dallas, I can also see him finally opening up and offering his side of the story. But rather than being told from a position of bitterness, it will be a thank-you letter for a much better life.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - matt6715 - 12-02-2019
In each of the last 4 wins, KP has had the highest +/- of any of the starters. His defense and rebounding has been incredible as a whole, and when he contributes even a little bit offensively, this team is very hard to beat. I'm not worried at all about him.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - ItsGoTime - 12-02-2019
(12-02-2019, 12:03 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: I would really like for KP to work on not getting shook from contact. To me that is the biggest factor in him turning the corner. It seems every time he gets bumped even a little, his control of the ball becomes an issue. Dirk had to figure that out early in his career too. I'd love to see Dirk attend some practices to help the big fella out in many facets of the game.The one other thing I'd like to see him work on is putting a body of the defender when he sets a pick. This was pointed out by someone else previously in this or another thread and ever since I've been noticing how poorly he sets a pick. That more than anything probably has to do with why Luka and he are seemingly not on the same page. He scores best off the pick and roll and KP can't set a pick to save his life.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - Fuerza1 - 12-02-2019
(11-30-2019, 03:44 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: You might want to apply the first of those perspectivally and the second rhetorically when it comes to Brunson. Why does a small sample size excuse Brunson (and even make us all willing to forgive THJ) but not Porzingis?Now you're just making things up.
Don't forget that KP was quite decent (if rather raw) offensively prior to his injury. He has a solid history of decent, max-contract-worthy-when-combined-with-his-rim-protection offensive play. Based on that, his problems are either 1) physical (in which case he needs to see the team physician), 2) mental (in which case he needs to see the team sports psychologist), or 3) rust (in which case he needs to hit the gym).
Mavs fans aren't writing off KP because that would be extremely stupid. Nearly every national pundit has chimed in that he will get better, but that it might take him up to a full season. In other words, patience is the choice not to be foolish. Moreover, the Mavs couldn't trade for KP without the willingness to give him that max deal, but there were several other league execs who groused that they didn't have the opportunity to beat Dallas's deal (meaning they would have given more for him than the Mavs did, and meaning that they would have been just as willing to give him that big contract).
Luka and KP are the future. I don't say that as a KP homer; I say it as a Mavs fan. We will see who else on the current roster is still here at the beginning of the 2021-22 season. Guess what the answer to that question might be.
I don't exonerate Brunson for a small sample size either. I already acknowledged his piss poor 3PT shooting thus far. But overall he's been pretty good all things considering. Best on/off court, defensive rating on the team; 4th best PER on the team. For only his second season, and getting inconsistent minutes, what more do you want?
People love to throw the superstar label on KP so with that comes superstar expectations. The max contract begins this season. His TS% is worse than what Barnes did for us last season thus far. But at least he contributes in other ways like rebounding and defense.
For the record, I am not crowning anyone on the Mavs except Luka. I am also not giving up on anyone on the Mavs this early in the season. But when players play well or poor, I will point it out. Just like every one trashes Powell and THJ every other game, which every one seems to be okay with.
KP plays bad and we have to be quiet and be reminded it's all mental or it's too early every time? We know, we're not as dumb as y'all think but there's nothing wrong in dissecting his current play. It's a long season, lighten up.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - ClutchDirk - 12-02-2019
(12-02-2019, 02:22 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote:https://twitter.com/bobbykaralla/status/1201551914556624897(12-02-2019, 12:03 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: I would really like for KP to work on not getting shook from contact. To me that is the biggest factor in him turning the corner. It seems every time he gets bumped even a little, his control of the ball becomes an issue. Dirk had to figure that out early in his career too. I'd love to see Dirk attend some practices to help the big fella out in many facets of the game.The one other thing I'd like to see him work on is putting a body of the defender when he sets a pick. This was pointed out by someone else previously in this or another thread and ever since I've been noticing how poorly he sets a pick. That more than anything probably has to do with why Luka and he are seemingly not on the same page. He scores best off the pick and roll and KP can't set a pick to save his life.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - ItsGoTime - 12-02-2019
(12-02-2019, 02:25 PM)ClutchDirk Wrote:Ya, I saw that after I posted. The eye test is way off from the stats, at least to me. Either way, he still doesn't set meaningful picks, he mostly puts a hand on the defender and goes to his spot.(12-02-2019, 02:22 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote:https://twitter.com/bobbykaralla/status/1201551914556624897(12-02-2019, 12:03 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: I would really like for KP to work on not getting shook from contact. To me that is the biggest factor in him turning the corner. It seems every time he gets bumped even a little, his control of the ball becomes an issue. Dirk had to figure that out early in his career too. I'd love to see Dirk attend some practices to help the big fella out in many facets of the game.The one other thing I'd like to see him work on is putting a body of the defender when he sets a pick. This was pointed out by someone else previously in this or another thread and ever since I've been noticing how poorly he sets a pick. That more than anything probably has to do with why Luka and he are seemingly not on the same page. He scores best off the pick and roll and KP can't set a pick to save his life.
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - fifteenth - 12-02-2019
(12-02-2019, 02:29 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: meaningful
shouldn't data have something to do with defining "meaningful"?
RE: HOLY KRISTAPS: All Things Porzingis - ClutchDirk - 12-02-2019
(12-02-2019, 02:29 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote:It tells you how awesome Luka is at running an offense...(12-02-2019, 02:25 PM)ClutchDirk Wrote:Ya, I saw that after I posted. The eye test is way off from the stats, at least to me. Either way, he still doesn't set meaningful picks, he mostly puts a hand on the defender and goes to his spot.(12-02-2019, 02:22 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote:https://twitter.com/bobbykaralla/status/1201551914556624897(12-02-2019, 12:03 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: I would really like for KP to work on not getting shook from contact. To me that is the biggest factor in him turning the corner. It seems every time he gets bumped even a little, his control of the ball becomes an issue. Dirk had to figure that out early in his career too. I'd love to see Dirk attend some practices to help the big fella out in many facets of the game.The one other thing I'd like to see him work on is putting a body of the defender when he sets a pick. This was pointed out by someone else previously in this or another thread and ever since I've been noticing how poorly he sets a pick. That more than anything probably has to do with why Luka and he are seemingly not on the same page. He scores best off the pick and roll and KP can't set a pick to save his life.