(09-28-2022, 03:51 PM)ItsGoTime Wrote: I don’t know, even if they don’t show any improvement over last year, I’d rather see Green and Frank get those minutes.

Edit: and Dorsey for that matter

(09-29-2022, 07:24 AM)Kammrath Wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWw9C1_o6J0

(09-29-2022, 08:52 AM)ItsGoTime Wrote: Interesting tidbits of information. 

Doubled down on Green and Frank (and later Dorsey) being ball handlers and running the offense. 

Lots of conceptual lineup talk about big vs small and saying we found a lot of success going small last year. If you’re gonna play 2 bigs, at least 1 of them has to be able to shoot. Will we see more Powell than we thought with DFS/Maxi/Wood all being able to shoot?
 

(09-29-2022, 10:19 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: 1. We have to have the flexibility to respond to what the best teams throw at us.  There are certain bigger teams where 5-out just won't work.  There are others where the D is so quick and long that the spread PnR isn't effective.  We have to be able to do several things well with variations of personnel.

(09-29-2022, 11:17 AM)KillerLeft Wrote: But, if you MUST play all of those ways in combination EACH game, rather than leaning into any 1-2 of them when the situation calls for you to do so, then in my opinion, you are not flexible ENOUGH.  

(09-29-2022, 11:58 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: I think it is CAN rather than MUST.  The regular season (especially the first half of it) will be a time of experimentation.  Good teams don't fret over the early regular season as much as fans.  I don't think we have to necessarily sacrifice a good record to experiment.  But, we need to know what we have and don't have going into the final two months.

I better wording for "not flexible enough" might be "not dominant enough".  Some teams are good enough to dictate to their opponents.  We aren't there.  We don't have a single lineup and style of play that will work for 82 and 16.  A healthy LAC, for instance, doesn't have to adapt their style nearly as much as most teams (though they are deep enough to do so).  Same with GSW.  They are very different teams and until we get our version of Paul George, we will be dictated to by these better teams.  Our only hope is to be high quality in every combination of things we throw out there.  We have bench guys in Maxi, Powell, Tim, Wood and Bertans who have been starters much of their careers.  None of those guys are ball handlers, which is where a lot of angst comes from.  Maybe Grank gets the job done.  If they don't, there will need to be an addition before we get to the playoffs in order to be fully adaptable to whatever opponents throw at us.

(09-29-2022, 10:19 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: One of the assistants was on Locked On this summer and described how Frank and Green might work as ball handlers.  So, the info has been out there for months.  We (collective we on this board) didn't want to believe it and thought it was coach-speak until another move was made.  It doesn't appear another move is coming prior to the season.  When there is one of Luka or SD on the court, Frank/Green can be a ball handler in much the same way as what we saw in the practice highlight from yesterday (Luka/Green Backcourt video).  Frank/Green brings the ball up and gets into a set designed for Tim or Wood.  Or, Grank brings the ball up and gets it to Luka/SD.  This is exactly what the assistant said on the podcast all those months ago.

I think the more interesting question isn't 'whether' Grank and Dorsey will initiate offense.  It is how much time will they do it without Luka or SD on the floor with them.  If Luka and SD play together for 6 minutes at the beginning of each half and Luka gets 32 and SD gets 28, then you've covered 48 minutes at PG (Luka's 32 plus 16 of SD's minutes) with SD's remaining 12 minutes being the overlap at the beginning of each half.  Here's the issue with one of Luka/SD on the court at all times AND Luka/SD both starting...  They don't get any other time together including the end of the games unless they find some minutes that don't include either Luka or SD.  That means someone from among the rest of the "ball-handlers" or some combo will have to find some minutes somewhere running things by themselves.  I think we'll see a few minutes each game where there is a big, Tim and Wood and neither Luka nor SD are on the floor.

I think Powell will have a small but regular role.  Mav teams have tended to have positive results when he's on the court the last five years.  Apparently he's a de facto captain now also.  I think his energy in short stints against backups will be a good thing and if history is a guide, the Mav's will win those segments of time.  That probably still leaves some time where CWood is alone at center or the CWood/Maxi combo are eating up the 20 minutes left if McGee gets 16 and Powell gets 12.  CWood is a dramatically better defender as a 4.  CWood with Maxi will be a good defensive combo and Maxi doesn't hurt CWood's offensive repertoire the way McGee or Powell might.

I think "we" spend too much time thinking Dallas has to play one way or another.  The truth is:

1. We have to have the flexibility to respond to what the best teams throw at us.  There are certain bigger teams where 5-out just won't work.  There are others where the D is so quick and long that the spread PnR isn't effective.  We have to be able to do several things well with variations of personnel.

2.  Games are not 48 minutes of a monolithic style or opponent.  You have to win or be competitive in every segment.  How do you match up the first six minutes.  What about the rest of the first quarter when at least 3 of your starters sub out.  How do you match up in the non-Luka minutes to start the 2nd/4th quarters.  What will the personnel be if/when both Luka and SD are sitting.  What bigs work best with what combo of ball-handlers.  How do you keep enough D on the floor and not let your O die during these bench minutes.  

If you start to map out lineup combinations, you probably have to have some segment somewhere where there is an inferior ball handler running things.  There will probably be some segment where you don't have a rim protector if McGee gets 16 and Maxi gets 24.  You can't keep DFS and Bullock on the floor for 48, so you either need one of the young guys to take a big step up defensively or you have to run a lineup that overwhelms the opponent offensively, but gives up more points relative to your other lineups  (with CWood and Tim coming off the bench, this is fairly easy to envision).  Finally, you have to make sure you have enough shooting (and ball-handling) on the floor when McGee or Powell are in the game.  If one of those is playing center, the other four have to shoot.  This is where Grank is so important.  Not only do they have to handle, but if Powell or McGee is in with them, they have to be threats to hit the three to make those minutes work offensively.

(09-29-2022, 12:59 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: While I don't agree with DLord's theory about Cuban being so much of a skinflint that he won't pay a 15th player minimum wage, I do believe that the reality is that, at this juncture, our desire for a third ball-handler is moot. The Mavs do not have the assets to acquire a ballhandler without including FRPs and damage future flexibility. The value of many of their assets will increase by the TDL (by virtue of contract situation more than anything else), and they might make a move for a ballhandler if Grank hasn't stepped up. I do agree with KL that their current situation regarding this particular problem is going to cost them some opportunities. The crimes on their part here are past crimes - it's their fault that they boxed themselves into the current inflexibility. However, there is still hope that after the '23 draft they may be able to make a major move that will help the team greatly. That hope disappears if they burn a FRP right now. Shame on them for the situation they're in, but imho they're handling it the right way if they can't find a team willing to be fleeced for what we want.

(09-29-2022, 01:14 PM)mvossman Wrote: I realize Kidd knows way more about basketball (and particularly PG play) than I do, but I still have to seriously question what looks to be his contention that Grank is a better option at PG than Dragic or Kemba.

(09-29-2022, 01:14 PM)mvossman Wrote: I don't really think they need to spend assets to get a decent 3rd point guard.  They probably could have had Dragic if they pushed for it.  They could probably have Kemba right now if they wanted.  

I realize Kidd knows way more about basketball (and particularly PG play) than I do, but I still have to seriously question what looks to be his contention that Grank is a better option at PG than Dragic or Kemba.

(09-29-2022, 01:48 PM)Scott41theMavs Wrote: I think the "Kidd as a coach" thing is less about how to build the best team, and more about saying the right thing given the situation the Mavs find themselves in. No assets. They have to build the value of their roster and their assets. Frank, Green, THJ (at the rock bottom of his trade value coming off of injury until he proves otherwise), et al. have low value right now. We need that value to increase. If Frank and Green in particular improve, it benefits the current roster by building up our talent quotient, and also builds up their value. If the Mavs acquire Kemba (I refuse to countenance Dragic because that ship has obviously sailed - and with regard to Kemba, he isn't available right now - let's see what happens if he's bought out) before the season starts, then those two don't play, and their value to the roster and in trade likely goes down considerably. The only way to botch this is if Frank and Green play minutes and get worse, which would be on both them and Kidd. They still need to play at this point.

This is the reality the Mavs find themselves in, and unless one of the 29 other GMs bends over to be fleeced, the Mavs are playing this right given the crappy situation they gave themselves by past mistakes. Now, if nothing happens at the TDL, it's right for us to complain.

The only trade I would like to see right now is Powell and a second for Crowder or a similar wing. The Mavs' Powell addiction is a problem, given that it's a significant basketball issue if he plays more than any of Wood, McGee, or Maxi (especially in the playoffs). However, I've given up hope on such a deal given their talking him up as a leader in camp. The first step toward recovery is to admit you have a problem, and the Mavs are simply delusional about this issue right now.

(09-29-2022, 01:46 PM)cow Wrote: Kidd might be hamstrung by Cuban's purse strings.

(09-29-2022, 02:03 PM)mvossman Wrote: I can understand Cuban choking on 60+ mil for Brunson due to tax, but if he is really so tight that he does not want to spend a few million in tax for a viable 3rd point guard, then its time to sell the team.

(09-29-2022, 02:15 PM)cow Wrote: I think Cuban being a cheap ass might be part of it, but a side benefit is that it may be smart evaluation whether intentional or not.  Josh has a club option coming up.  This is the last year of Frank's deal.  Maybe the thought is, "let's see what we have in those two players before we pull someone off the scrap heap".

(09-29-2022, 02:43 PM)StrandedOnBeauboisHill Wrote: Ya it's definitely starting to feel like "ya we know that we need a third ball handler but we're going to let Frank/Green/Dorsey/Hardy all give it a whirl early on to see what we got"

(09-29-2022, 01:09 PM)mvossman Wrote: It makes more sense to me to put Timmy in the starting lineup with McGee.  That improves spacing and makes it easier to stagger Luka and Din.

We might be able to survive a few minutes a game with Grank bring the ball up and relying on Wood and Timmy to create, but its hard to see that working for longer stretches when Luka or Din are out.

Its really easy to see how trading out Timmy and Green for Conley cleans things up from a minutes and fit perspective.

(09-29-2022, 10:19 AM)DanSchwartzgan Wrote: One of the assistants was on Locked On this summer and described how Frank and Green might work as ball handlers.  So, the info has been out there for months.  We (collective we on this board) didn't want to believe it and thought it was coach-speak until another move was made.  It doesn't appear another move is coming prior to the season.

(09-29-2022, 03:40 PM)Kammrath Wrote: Yep. I have posted multiple times the tweets from MacMahon and Stein POST-Brunson-Leaving of how the Mavs were NOT looking for more ball handling and instead wanted wing and big man help. That is reputable, plugged in reporting, but many on this board did not want to believe that was possible.

(09-29-2022, 03:49 PM)mvossman Wrote: I don't think folks are questioning that its possible, I think they are simply disagreeing with that strategy.