MAVS NEWS: Luka Wins Community Cares Award! | DLive's Mom Passes Away| Maxi OUT - Printable Version +- MavsBoard (https://www.mavsboard.com) +-- Forum: Boards (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=1) +--- Forum: Dallas Mavericks and the NBA (https://www.mavsboard.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=2) +--- Thread: MAVS NEWS: Luka Wins Community Cares Award! | DLive's Mom Passes Away| Maxi OUT (/showthread.php?tid=2172) Pages:
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RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - KillerLeft - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 11:45 AM)mvossman Wrote: In the playoffs it may only be 15-20 minutes. I mean are we are talking about Timmy being overpaid while also suggesting we trade for Tobias Harris at 40 mil? If the new guy is Harris, then all of this rotation debate wouldn't even matter because they would be getting worse no matter how you look at it. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - omahen - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 11:45 AM)mvossman Wrote: In the playoffs it may only be 15-20 minutes. I mean are we are talking about Timmy being overpaid while also suggesting we trade for Tobias Harris at 40 mil? Harris is 40 mil this season, but his next contract will likely be considerably lower. Even if new guy would be starting, I think he is replacing Timmy role. We would likely still be playing 2 out of Luka/Kyrie/new guy at any time. The difference is the new guy can also close with Luka/Kyrie. I think Grant is a plus defender, while Harris is an ok defender. Yes, I could see them contend, if Lively develops a bit more. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - mvossman - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 12:31 PM)omahen Wrote: Harris is 40 mil this season, but his next contract will likely be considerably lower. Even if new guy would be starting, I think he is replacing Timmy role. We would likely still be playing 2 out of Luka/Kyrie/new guy at any time. The difference is the new guy can also close with Luka/Kyrie. Yeah, I don't think either are plus defenders (and Grant doesn't rebound). I don't see that lineup being better than average defensively, which makes it really hard to be a true contender. I think either move would be a dead end unless you manage to trade Kyrie for a better defender. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - Chicagojk - 01-03-2024 I think I am fully in the camp of finding a big PF piece with our assets. So, I would be on board with Siakam. I just don't think we have the assets to interest Toronto. Question, could we lift the restrictions on the picks to the Knicks to be able to offer multiple firsts. Would the Knicks prefer this? Grant and Harris are good players. I just don't think they are final piece guys. Both are better than what we have, but not sure I would be aggressive on either at this stage. On another matter, I thin Dante has been without a doubt one of our top 5 players this year. He deserves a run as a starter here. Maybe 10 games. I just keep thinking that it may be best to use him as a 6th man. The beginning of games are very Luka centric. At times even Kyrie gets lost early in games. Are you getting the most bang for your buck starting Dante too? I think it won't impact who is finishing games. So maybe have Green start and play 5-6 minutes before Exum is brought in. Green just will need to hit a high percentage of corner threes and play good defense. I think this would look much better if we had the PF type I am envisioning. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - DanSchwartzgan - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 01:39 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: I think I am fully in the camp of finding a big PF piece with our assets. So, I would be on board with Siakam. I just don't think we have the assets to interest Toronto. Question, could we lift the restrictions on the picks to the Knicks to be able to offer multiple firsts. Would the Knicks prefer this? Grant and Harris are good players. I just don't think they are final piece guys. Yes. NY won’t do it for free. Probably costs the 2025 second if history is a guide. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - mvossman - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 01:39 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: I think I am fully in the camp of finding a big PF piece with our assets. So, I would be on board with Siakam. I just don't think we have the assets to interest Toronto. Question, could we lift the restrictions on the picks to the Knicks to be able to offer multiple firsts. Would the Knicks prefer this? Grant and Harris are good players. I just don't think they are final piece guys. Both are better than what we have, but not sure I would be aggressive on either at this stage. Not sure getting more first round picks is the answer if Toronto is looking for young players instead. If some combination of Green, GWill, Omax, Hardy (and probably our first) is not enough, then we probably are not getting him. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - surfpuckmd - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 01:39 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: I think I am fully in the camp of finding a big PF piece with our assets. So, I would be on board with Siakam. I just don't think we have the assets to interest Toronto. Question, could we lift the restrictions on the picks to the Knicks to be able to offer multiple firsts. Would the Knicks prefer this? Of course the Knicks would prefer this. This would be a bad idea for the Mavericks. We are a major Luka Doncic injury away from being one of the 8 worst teams in the NBA. Should Luka unfortunately sustain a knee injury or another season-ending injury in the next couple months, we would probably finish in the top 10 range in the draft. Although this may not be a great draft, another top-10 pick would be a very helpful way to add talent to this roster. It would also be much a much better trade asset than almost anything else we have to offer apart from Kyrie or Lively. Adding protections to draft picks is a smart form of insurance in the case of a disappointing season. Dropping that insurance in this case would be a degenerate gambling move. Niko and Lindsay are too smart for that. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - omahen - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 03:00 PM)surfpuckmd Wrote: Of course the Knicks would prefer this. Not making a good move because you are affraid Luka will get injured is just as high risk imho RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - surfpuckmd - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 04:10 PM)omahen Wrote: Not making a good move because you are affraid Luka will get injured is just as high risk imho That's the same logic that a lot of bankrupt gamblers have used. I can definitely see Mark Cuban thinking like that. Fortunately, he's not really running the show anymore. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - KillerLeft - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 04:10 PM)omahen Wrote: Not making a good move because you are affraid Luka will get injured is just as high risk imho Ok, but it's not binary. There is a wide variety of what I'd consider "good" moves, and not all of them require a complete and total mortgage of the future. There are moves that I think would be worth a lot of "unprotected pick" risk, and many that wouldn't. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - Chicagojk - 01-03-2024 (01-03-2024, 07:04 PM)surfpuckmd Wrote: That's the same logic that a lot of bankrupt gamblers have used. No doubt it is risky and I am not saying I would do it. But if you want Siakam, I am pretty confident Toronto doesn’t do it without two firsts and a young player from us. To compete against other teams we lack the picks, young prospects and expirings. Tough spot to be in. Especially with a gm who is a nightmare to deal with on trades. So maybe you want to hold your picks until this summer or next. The risk you mention is still there if that player takes multiple firsts. Would you be able to get a player better than Siakam over the next year.? Plus if the player is really good then you need to deal with the pick hoarding teams who can blow our offer away probably. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - SleepingHero - 01-04-2024 Shawn McFarland (@McFarland_Shawn) Jason Kidd on Dereck Lively II and Grant Williams' ankle sprains: "Mild, getting treatment, we'll see how they feel tomorrow." RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - surfpuckmd - 01-04-2024 (01-03-2024, 07:37 PM)Chicagojk Wrote: No doubt it is risky and I am not saying I would do it. But if you want Siakam, I am pretty confident Toronto doesn’t do it without two firsts and a young player from us. To compete against other teams we lack the picks, young prospects and expirings. Tough spot to be in. Especially with a gm who is a nightmare to deal with on trades. Fair points. However, my perspective is that Siakam is not the guy to mortgage the future on. Most of the all-in trades that have been made over the past 6 years haven't worked out that well. Trades like the Aaron Gordon and Derrick White trades were more clever and cautious and have worked out better. We need that level of player here at a reasonable price. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd- Hope is Kyrie returns against UTA - omahen - 01-04-2024 (01-04-2024, 06:17 AM)surfpuckmd Wrote: Fair points. However, my perspective is that Siakam is not the guy to mortgage the future on. Most of the all-in trades that have been made over the past 6 years haven't worked out that well. Trades like the Aaron Gordon and Derrick White trades were more clever and cautious and have worked out better. We need that level of player here at a reasonable price. First of all, I would just like to make a disclaimer, that I don't think Siakam would cost 2 FRP to get. Sure there are teams that can (theoretically) make better offers, but who says they will actually make them. Toronto is facing a real threat that Siakam walks in the summer. Any team trading for him will also take this risk that Siakam might just walk in the summer and no one will imho risk a bunch of assets because of that. Secondly - lifting protection from NY pick doesn't enable Mavs to offer additional pick. Even with lifted protection, Mavs still can't trade 2025 pick because of the Stepien rule (2024 being still owed to NY) and can't trade both 2026 and 2027 picks because of the same rule. Leaving all of that aside, even if Mavs would be able to trade two picks by lifting protection from NY pick, I wouldn't call that as an all in move. Mavs all in move was imho Kyrie. Because of his age they basically declared their short-term strategy, which is "win now". Mavs are not rebuilding, they want to win. From here on it is just about using that realistic window and trying to create a contender putting right pieces next to Luka and Kyrie. Siakam is imho a huge proven talent and while he might not be perfect (which player is???), it would be on the three stars and coaching staff to make it work on both ends on the floor. Having three such players would put a pressure from the front office to players and coaching staff for the first time in Luka era. 2024 is owed to NY by past actions. A whole bunch of stuff would have to go wrong if Mavs traded for Siakam and still finished in bottom 10 of the league. Even Luka injury would still leave enough talent on the team and they should be able to finish better than bottom 10. I think it is certain that Siakam makes this team better, the question is only, if he makes them good enough to contend. Personally, I don't think Mavs are just one "Gordon" or "White" trade away from contending. I think they need more of the top end talent. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - F Gump - 01-04-2024 Random notes .... 1 On Siakam, I am a yes with conditions, but not sure my main condition is doable. It's that it must be an extend-and-trade, so that I'm not trading for a short-term rental. The max on such a deal would be to add 2 more years, beginning at ~40M. However, Siakam's max as a FA will be about 42M, so I'm guessing an extension is a non-starter for Siakam unless he really likes the idea of playing with Luka. But that's where I start. 2 It's disappointing to see the dearth of talent on this roster after a summer of getting done what they wanted. G Will is still an 8th man, like he was in BOS - there's nothing in his game that really has the potential to somehow blossom. And sad to say, this meh-ness should not have been a surprise to Mav talent experts, as he's the same guy here playing at about the same level as he was there. 3 Was OMax worth being saddled with Holmes? Lots of crowing about that one. Yet hard to see why. We need talent, and the net result of that move seems to be we got an iffy rookie who has showed next to nothing PLUS a cap-choking player for 2 years. 4 Adding DJJ and Exum were good moves -- but the cap mismanagement means we will have a hard time turning them into long-term Mavs. Ugh. 5 With all the trade ideas swirling, I am reminded that the Mavs issue is a talent issue. We are trying to imagine trades that are possible using junk, rather than talent. No talent? Oh, ok, strip the team of its picks. All of this is not new, and I'm discouraged that Cuban is still in charge of the strategy to work the cap and identify talent properly, because he has done poorly at those for so many years. .... Cuban is now the GM (or POBO) -- and nothing else. And he doesn't have a side gig anymore to keep him out of using his "smartest guy in the room" thoughts. To my way of thinking, that's not good. 6 I would hope that the Adelsons would be a solution, allowing more spending, but the Mavs way of roster building under Cuban would tend to get in the way, in how they end up with bad contracts on meh-talent players and no cap permission to spend more. You can't trade your way out of that situation, because you lack talent, and you can't spend your way out of that situation, because the cap rules block you. Where deep pockets work is when you have a slew of underpaid highly-talented players who will need raises later. Lively is one, but they need 3-4 more. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - HoosierDaddyKidd - 01-04-2024 (01-04-2024, 07:05 AM)F Gump Wrote: Random notes .... This. In a nutshell. Bravo! RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - ItsGoTime - 01-04-2024 Trade for Siakam. Pick up Hayward after he’s bought out. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - omahen - 01-04-2024 A very thoughtful answer from Kidd about Lively and foul trouble https://twitter.com/MFollowill/status/1742947845710225896?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1742947845710225896%7Ctwgr%5Eacb0af6b3fbdea71ba0c24bd8a1bdae7b308800f%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2Fdallas-mavericks RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - KillerLeft - 01-04-2024 (01-04-2024, 12:02 PM)omahen Wrote: A very thoughtful answer from Kidd about Lively and foul trouble Yeah, I thought of @chicagojk when I saw this. He said the other day that the only part of Lively's game he was a little down on was his aggressiveness when defending the rim, which is kind of what Kidd is saying (politely) here. RE: MAVS NEWS: Kidd: Lively and Grant's sprains "Mild"- day to day - KillerLeft - 01-04-2024 (01-04-2024, 07:05 AM)F Gump Wrote: Random notes .... I'm normally right there with you on this stuff, but the above notes seem...harsh, imo. I still have hope for Grant Williams, but I can't defend him at this time, so I'll give you that one. They knocked the 12th pick out of the park. Home Run. And, yes, I think O-Max WAS worth being saddled with Holmes. There's only one more year on that deal - it's not the end of the world, and I don't understand why people are already trying to give up on O-Max. He's not getting minutes because the Mavs are deep (at their talent level) and he's a bit raw, but I think he's better than Patrick Williams RIGHT NOW and he has been playing big minutes for YEARS after being drafted 4th overall. Someone with the size, length, speed, motor and mentality of O-Max deserves a little patience. Not all rookies are going to be winners right out of the gate. O-Max MIGHT be the thing I'm most excited about on this entire team right now. No argument, whatsoever, with the critique of what got them into the hole, but I think disappointment that one good summer didn't completely right the ship is a little unfair. It's going to take a sustained streak of good decisions to get squarely on track. |